/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>26144995
https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/cardano/ratings/

>>26144995

I don't own ADA I sold it all but I believe in this project 100% long term. It's biggest competition is XLM, I believe these will be fighting for real world adoption on mass scale. Eth is currently broken and unless it's fixed will start losing market share to ADA starting this year. I don't think people realize just how much thought went into Cardano and what is being developed. I never hear people talk about K project which is a game changer and opens Cardano up to the world, no other project has anything like this.

>>26145148
thanks, good info
>>26145169
you’re making me very bullish

cardano is vaporware. nothing is being developed on it. imagine waiting 5 years for smart contracts.

meanwhile, algorand came out with smart contracts, private transactions, zero forkability and 46k tps all within a few years of coming out

cardano will 100% lose out to its competitors for lacking talent and vision

>>26145774
why is this gaining traction while algo hasn’t moved an inch in its entire history?

Avalanche and Dfinity. Algorand/ETH 2.0 are debatable.

Avalanche is considered more of a layer 0 than layer 1 blockchain like Cardano. You can't run blockchains on top of Cardano, only smart contracts. You can run blockchains on top of Avalanche, an infinite amount, each capable of a minimum of 4,500 TPS (On avalanche TPS is CPU bound, so when we say 4500 that is with the crapiest computer you can find in the past 10 years or so - i.e. raspberry pie). If you throw a 24 core CPU at it, it will be 15,000 TPS+++.

Cardano Ouroboros with the Shelley implementation will have 200-260 TPS. That's a massive difference from Avalanche.

Cardano has since also talked about eventually deploying a layer 2 sharding solution called Hydra which will increase that to 1000 TPS per shard. Hydra will likely take even more time than sharding on ETH. Note ETH2 with Sharding is targeted at 2022-2023! Avalanche already has massive scalability.. today.

If Avalanche ever needed more scalability it could add layer 2 solutions like Zk-Rollups, or Sharding like ETH2 & Cardano Hydra, at which point TPS would be in the many millions.

Cardano advertise 1000+ nodes but aren't honest enough to say that only 500 nodes can participate in the consensus.

Cardano in a way didn't solve the trilemma within their chain and stayed in the same ballpark as Ethereum.

Also, cardano has block times of 20 seconds (15s for ETH). Avalanche has an absolute max of 3s per block, with 90%+ of blocks confirming in sub-1second... WITH finality! (aka can't be reversed). This is the equivalent of 6x 10 min blocks on Bitcoin for example. One major advantage not talked about much is that with sub 1 second finality, DEFI projects can't have flash loan hacks occur. Before you can blink a transaction is confirmed, no time to execute flash loan hacks. Cardano approach doesn't query the vast majority of validators before a transaction gets added to the blockchain and has longer finality as a result.

>>26145169
Avax does. However they’re behind ADA and I doubt they will catch up.

>>26145825
It’s you again lmao ”why you still” get out of here you pajeet bastard

>>26145825
What does running a blockchain on top of a blockchain mean?

I have no understanding of what that means.

>>26145870
OP asked a question and this answer at least some of it. Nothing in that comment is a lie.

>>26144995
ETH will remain King, anything "overtaking" ETH is bullshit.

However, ADA & DOT will be number 2 & 3 though, in a crypt market with a mcap that will explode from here on, so still huge upside for ADA from here

>>26145825
Cardano is the most cited blockchain bar none, AVAX is only cited on biz on the last week.

>>26145960
Avax is blowing Ada out of the Water.

That staking return ooooooOOOoo

Avax Chad pumpanomics vs Cardano Virgin retrace.

Please person who totally didn’t copy paste notepad file. Can you tell me what running a layer 0 blockchain is?

I have no idea what the fuck that concept even is. Are you talking about virtual machines? Your vague ass copy and paste is making me go crazy.

>>26145938
I don’t think CASPER is a good consensus algo. Polka’s BABE copy paste job of Ouroboros is fucking bullish as hell for Cardano. No disrespect for Polka but a ton for Eth.

>>26144995
DOT and ETH. Both are wildly outclassed by ADA and will not fare sell, but they will survive.

>>26146039
>less than 10% of total supply out
>big staking returns for validators to dump on your ass
>good thing

>>26146039

Comeback when turk devs drop 300,000,000 coins and then we'll talk.

>>26146106
I like the technical details of AVAX a ton. It’s just a matter of mainnet being released post-ADA and anyone who knows crypto trusts in IOHK. It’s a billionaires narcissistic psychotic project.

Meanwhile am I really gonna research AVAX’s consensus algorithm vs Ouroboros? Is it a cardano killer? Seems like a coin that will die soon.

ADA is inevitable

>>26146141
How Many Tokens does IOHK Hold?

Cardano Foundation?

Charles Himself could send this back to 3 cents if/when he decides to release his bag into the market. .

>>26146276
Do you really think Charles is such a shithead he would personally dump the IOHK developers wallet?

Sell your Chainlink.

>>26146383
I only hold Cardano but I FUD it constantly.

>>26146276
You mean the coins for staking rewards? Clearly you have no idea wtf Cardano is and you just want to shill your pajeet pump and dump token.

>>26146423
Honestly high IQ Anon, I do this too with higher MC projects. The second someone breaks my fud I leave. It has been a great strategy.

MY EVEY HAVE SEEN THE GLORY OF THE TRAMPLING AT ZOO

>>26144995
THOUGHEST AND ONLY RIVAL IS ALGORAND (if you think different you are completely mistaken, it's fact).
Only holds ADA, but I respect this project.

There are not completely targeting the same branch of the industry/engineers/devs though.
Who the fuck cares, nobody knows about both of them yet, both will be >100 billion of market cap, probably before EOY

screencap this

>>26145825
>You can't run blockchains on top of Cardano
Cardano can, even Ethereum can
they're called Rollups

any platform can support L2 chains with a different operating environment, fee model, etc
(while inheriting the security of the L1)
not a USP of Avalanche

>Cardano has since also talked about eventually deploying a layer 2 sharding solution called Hydra which will increase that to 1000 TPS per shard
you're such a tard,
Hydra has nothing to do with sharding

Ouroboros Hydra is a state channel network that supports the same smart contract model as the base layer,
each Hydra Head (stake pool) adds 1000 TPS,
and we already have 1500 stake pools...

>Avalanche already has massive scalability.. today
are you stupid or dishonest?

a L1 being capable of doing 4500 TPS (without breaking) doesn't make it scalable

throughput = total possible TPS
scalability = increasing throughput without making nodes work 100x harder and store 100x more

Ouroboros is capable of 1000 TPS and higher with further optimizations,
but they are (rightfully) focusing on L2 scaling

4500 TPS isn't a selling point,
Avalanche consensus hasn't removed the challenges of validating, computing or storing that amount of traffic

SIMPLE transactions are often ~200 bytes,
that translates to:
>1 mb/sec
>60 mb/min
>3.6 gb/hour
>86 gb/day
>31 tb/year

Instant finality can be achieved on L2, to be settled on L1
(this is universally accepted with card payments)

and Avalanche consensus (if proven to be good)
can easily be modded into other chains

>>26147285
Just sold avalanche and bought 100k cardano

>>26146040
>Can you tell me what running a layer 0 blockchain is?
>I have no idea what the fuck that concept even is. Are you talking about virtual machines?
"layer 0" is just marketing talk
any smart contract platform can do this

essentially, you just create a new sidechain with some kind of bridge to the main chain
(Plasma and Rollups (on Ethereum) are examples of trustless sidechains,
even if the validators on these sidechains are malicious, users can recover funds)

this is (in theory) useful, because you can experiment with different operating environments (VMs) or fee models

in reality, it's likely to cause a lot of friction
because different dapps being on different shards creates a lot of unnecessary overhead (bridging costs and latency)
and most developers don't want to build their own chain,
they just want a robust system to deploy on

for example, you could build something like EOS as a L2 on top of Ethereum/etc,
so on the L2 you have faster finality and no transaction fees,
and the L2 can be monetized in some other way

Polkadot is another "layer 0",
but it's really just a sharded system where each shard can have different rules

the advantage of a "layer 0" is supposedly upgradability,
but when a chain was built properly (Cardano) then every element is modular anyway,
and can be swapped out for better ones later on

Cardano has a Hard-fork Combinator,
which is a state of the art feature that makes all upgrades a seamless process that don't break continuity

>>26146184
>I like the technical details of AVAX a ton
from what I've seen, Avalanche consensus *is* solid
but it's not enough to dethrone more well-rounded projects like Cardano

Avalanche doesn't have
>a massive, engaged community
>a formal commercial adoption strategy (multi-year long collabs with govs/corps)
>a sustainable governance/treasury model

so far crypto has been fine without fast-finality
and L2s like Hydra can provide it, if needed

if Avalanche consensus proves itself in the wild,
I expect the Cardano treasury to fund the necessary research
Ouroboros was always designed to be upgradable,
so I doubt it will take too long to write up Ouroboros Avalanche

>>26145825
>Cardano advertise 1000+ nodes but aren't honest enough to say that only 500 nodes can participate in the consensus
this is not some secret,

you're referring to the 'K' parameter,
which is being consistently increased by the Cardano community

there isn't some software bottleneck of 500 nodes

ADA will surpass the MC of Bitcoin. It's obvious to anyone who ever crossed paths with investments and tech development that Cardano will surpass BTC market cap this decade.

>The most advanced and secure decentralization tech in the world (1500 nodes vs 500 for avax and 300 for eth)
>Impenetrable by quantum computers, proof of stake and proof of work required (BTC only has proof of work - making it vulnerable to miner attacks)
>Can scale to infinity with instant payments and fees
>Compatible with Etherium and defi Dapps
>Founded by the most high iq Etherium founder who financed ETH
>High circulation means that it won't be worth much ($3-5 tops) which means it'll be used all over the world from the 3rd world to the 1st world
Here's the thing: This coin won't make us rich but it will change crypto forever. BTC will serve as a store of value and Cardano as a utility tool, but the utility has a higher market cap. It picked up pieces that Satoshi left off and they're coming together. You need to be 200 iq to understand the impact of ADA.

>>26147285
>Blah blah blah will be solved with L2

Literally defeatist cuck short term thinking centralized mentality retard. Imagine thinking going into the future of finance with a platform that can't even function on-chain, In the end of the day ADA have the same problems ETH have so how can we call it a progress or next gen by any mean?
My question is, Why not Avalanche if it does on chain anything that thought to be impossible before? There's still no argument against it.

Avalanche is simply the only platform that's ready for wide scale adoption and be the face of this space, Anything else is pure cope from bagholders including ETH holders.

>Avalanche consensus hasn't removed the challenges of validating, computing or storing that amount of traffic

They already did more than half the job with pruning, A better way to solve it is impossible even on paper at current moment, It's something that all platforms experience not only Avalanche you know? What kind of fud is this? Fudding the whole space and current technological knowledge in order to fud AVAX? top kek.

>>26148416
>with a platform that can't even function on-chain
because L1 should always be as decentralized and secure as possible,
so it's inherently better to scale via L2's so you don't centralize L1

forcing people to process such huge volumes of traffic inherently limits who can validate the L1,
and a decentral L1 is far more important than pure speed

Ouroboros Hydra will literally bring 100k - 1mil TPS this year or next
so why would you even want to operate on L1?

>Fudding the whole space and current technological knowledge in order to fud AVAX
nope, I'm shitting on projects that don't understand tradeoffs

L2 = district/regional courts, handles the super-majority of traffic
L1 = supreme court, resolves disputes from higher courts in a highly secure/decentralized way

Avalanche retards:
"duhh why can't every court be a supreme court"
"why doesn't the banking layer do Visa-level throughput"
"duhhhhhhhhh"

Avalanche's only selling point seems to be the consensus model,
so my question to you is:
what stops a well-rounded project like Cardano just adapting Avalanche consensus?

Avalanche has:
>less money
>less academic credence (no, having a PHD founder isn't enough)
>a smaller community
>no governance mechanism
>no decentralized treasury/funding mechanism
these are all far more important than "muh speed"

and it will take far longer for Avalanche to have those ^ points
than for Cardano to adapt Avalanche consensus to their needs
(if it even proves to be viable, which is still questionable)

>>26145907
"and this answer at least some"
pajeet, kebab, or chink

>>26145825
Suck a cock, avax aint got shit

>>26148416
>Blah blah blah
>Literally defeatist cuck short term thinking centralized mentality retard.

>>26148416
also:
>A better way to solve it is impossible even on paper at current moment,
>It's something that all platforms experience not only Avalanche you know?
you just admitted Avalanche hasn't solved the trilemma

the core problem with scalability and decentralization is 'inclusive accountability':

it's important for regular people to be able to keep up with validation,
or else they have to trust increasingly centralized 3rd parties to tell them the history of the network

generally users can only prune the state/utxo set once they have a fully formed copy of the chain,
which with Avalanche would be near-impossible

this is why L2s are preferable,
state can be more easily deleted
(all you need is the start/finish history, not everything in between that happened off-chain)
and users don't need to store and compute literally everything that happens


>>26149194
"and this answer at least some"
to be fair, it's only missing an S to be grammatically correct

any chance of ADA dropping before the updates in Feb/Mar?

ADA on Daedalus but best app/website to build a portfolio?

>>26149218
Explain why Radix is dumped to $0.09 and I'll buy 1K.

>>26145774
This is the most stupid thing I red today. Congrats.

>>26149714
>most stupid
>red

>>26149130
>because L1 should always be as decentralized and secure as possible

But Avalanche is the most decentralized platform currently operating (As of number of validators that vote to approve X transaction, aka no pools).

>Ouroboros Hydra will literally bring 100k - 1mil TPS this year or next
so why would you even want to operate on L1?

Hydra solution is to create state channels between a set of participants, whilst it may offer fast transactions between those participants on the same channel as they are being performed off-chain, the main chain isn't verifying those transactions, Meaning it's limited by the main chain.

Anyway Hydra is still a theory at this point, Why not use Avalanche today? Yet to see an argument against it beside being emotionally invested in X project.

>what stops a well-rounded project like Cardano just adapting Avalanche consensus?

Again my point above, What's stopping you from siding Avalanche rightnow then?

>less academic credence (no, having a PHD founder isn't enough)
TOP KEK. Ari Juel and Emin are probably among the most respect people in this space, The 2 most cited developers in this space, Emin created the first POW coin in fucking 2003 (Which was muh "cited" academically, It just didn't have the same ambitious vision as Satoshi first proposed), Vitalik and Sergey themselves approach him for criticism and advices. Emin is Ethereum and Bitcoin OG, He literally listed 9 possible compromises before the DAO hack, which of course 1 of those 9 found to be true.

Tendermint and Hotstuff creator (Cosmos/Facebook Libra consensuses respectively) left anything he's done to work under Emin.

>a smaller community

Avax is 3 years smaller and already catching up, Like i said, Already 750 nodes fully running at the moment and growing at 1-1.5% rate PER DAY.

>no governance mechanism
How's cardano superior here? Seems like last straw shill for me.

>no decentralized treasury/funding mechanism
As above

>>26149594
What do you mean? Excel? Google spreadsheet?

>>26149771
Can you deshill this image?

>>26145774
5 years is also "only a few years"

>>26149771
>Why not use Avalanche today?
Becuase all that TPS is not needed today. When true mass adoption happens, then it's needed. But by then, all major blockchains will have a 100 000+ TPS solution.

>>26150087
Avalanche cant even run dapps like ETH can because the dapps can't communicate with each other if they are on different subnets. Place 10 dapps on the same subnet and suddenly 4500 tps is not gonna be enough.
The truth is, AVAX was broken from the start

>>26150087
>Just delay adoption because my favourite coin hasn't nailed it yet

Don't care about both but your comment is pathetic.

Avax pays people to create memes and shill on biz

Keep that in mind, that’s why you see pajeet level shilling of it on biz

>>26150297
What? How is my comment about delaying adoption? If any coin is truly ready right now for major mass adoption, why isn't it adopted?

>>26149594
>best app/website to build a portfolio?
Blockfolio is good,
if you care about privacy, divide everything by 1k
(200k = 200)

>>26149771
>number of validators that vote to approve X transaction, aka no pools
Stake Pools ARE validators

Cardano has 1500 pools in circulation,
but only 500 are currently active in validating - as determined by the K parameter
(K is being regularly increased)

>the main chain isn't verifying those transactions
that's a GOOD thing

the L1 can guarantee validity of a start/end point
and everything in between doesn't need to touch the main-chain, but is still secured by it

state channel networks are known to be secure
the problem so far is a lack of expressiveness - aka they can't really handle smart contracts
Hydra solves this, read the damn paper

>Ari Juel and Emin are probably among the most respect people in this space
we're not talking about respected
(although IOHK's work is, and cited hundreds of times across the industry and beyond)
we're talking about formally constructed and peer reviewed papers,
from experts beyond our industry

>Vitalik / Sergey approach him for criticism and advices
Vitalik? his chain is crumbling, who cares?
Sergey? not even building something in the same category, and only has meme status on /biz/

(Cosmos/Libra left anything he's done to work under Emin
I bet Avalanche *is* better than Cosmos and Libra,
but that's not much of a bar to pass lol

>no governance mechanism
>no decentralized treasury/funding mechanism
Avalanche lacks these two core features, meaning:
>participants cannot come to agreement about key decisions in a decentralized manner
>most funding will be decided by a handful of insiders
in other words, it will stagnate like Bitcoin and (soon) Ethereum

Cardano already has a working treasury model (onto Fund3 now)
and full decentralized governance is not far off

>>26149811
is this accurate?
does Avalanche not even have proper composability?

there goes the "layer 0" selling point...

o/uBkXey is Charles Hoskinson, his writing style matches his twitter shitposting.

>>26150741
>o/uBkXey is Charles Hoskinson
thank you anon,
it means a great deal to me that you'd compare our writing styles

>>26150784
Bro did you learn anything from Vitalik, Satoshi, Steve Jobs? You have to move fast when you have groundbreaking technology. You're too perfectionist and taking half a decade. Do something big now

>>26150849
ok fine you got me

don't worry friend,
we have some massive releases Q1 and Q2

Cardano is about to break Vitalik's arm into 1024 tiny shards ;)

>>26150943
I like how you scheduled smart contracts for march. The shitcoin season makes everyone fomo in and lose their minds, it's better to time that when things calm down and I'm glad cardano is on track. But saying as an overall strategy, it's better to roll out the big stuff this year and crush Polkadot and no name projects like AVAX in the short term. Top 3 and eventually #1.

>>26150849
>Move fast and break stuff!
>Lose peoples money!
>It's ok, we'll just fork anyway!

>>26151067
Let them lose money, I'm sure it's less hackable than ETH. Better now then when ADA is used by banks. And launch a tutorial series on programming haskell and/or solidity for Cardano so we can start building something on it.

>>26151154
>. And launch a tutorial series on programming haskell
Youtube doesn't allow videos over 10 hours

>>26151201
There are 100K+ erc 20 tokens. If Cardano wants to achieve one tenth of that this year there have to be 10+ tutorials explaining step by step without book learning.

what's the top end of March?

>>26151154
Haskell isn't really easy. And programming knowledge doesn't translate well to it, even if I'm proficient in C++ and Python, when I move over to Haskell I'm nearly starting from scratch because it uses a different paradigm.

>>26151436
Cardano is complex af. For comparison Polkadot is simple. When you land on the DOT homepage you see "Web 3.0 - build your own blockchain" and everyone gets it. When you land on the ADA page you see "We're changing the world" and no one knows what's going on.

It's complex but can be equally simplified. For ex. a token generator for ADA would boost it's
value 10 fold in one year. If people can come on the Cardano website, use a generator to put in a token supply, name, etc, and generate their own token on ADA it would become the #1 developer platform overnight. And there should be links to buy and wallet ADA directly on the home page at max visibility.

The big brain shit on the back end and the pea brain shit on the front end.

I would like to invite the Jupiterbrains itt to our humble stakepool group:

t.me/bizpool_official
Ticker = 4CHAN

Am myself developing fulltime Cardano smart contract stuff, if anyone wants to talk.

There is so much stuff to do. Exciting times. This is the electromagnetism/computers/internet of our generation.

>>26151294
They don't even need to achieve that number of new projects when these projects take the bridge

>>26151553
But anon

>>26152762
Maybe he'll buy now

>>26152844
>>26152444
Damn I'm racking up the 4 gets

Sold my ADA for DOT, I like Charles but I see DOT having the better year

>>26152918
>shitcoin
>6 times more development than Bitcoin

>>26150943
Charlie when i /makeit/ I'm gonna send you a very happy tweet. 10/5 :)

>>26152762
Link it, I can't find it anywhere

>>26152985
Anon, if you've gotta work SIX TIMES harder than average to make something that BARELY FUNCTIONS, it's time to stop.

>>26153021
https://youtu.be/lj9SlvOIBgU?t=1122

>>26152985
You know what commits are right anon? You know that more commits != more development right anon?

>>26153068
You made me hopeful for a second. It's not live yet :''(

>>26153117
>It's not live yet :''(
It's going to be live in four weeks

>>26153144
When ADAswap/ADAmetamask chrome plugin?

>>26153357
>When ADAswap
I think some developer Anons are working on a prototype of it right now.

>>26153357
>>26153357
They keep saying March. Time will tell

>>26153357
>ADAmetamask
Emurgo wants to make Yoroi the Metamask of Cardano. It currently supports ADA and ERG

Really nice thread, can someone tell me if Elrond egold is shit or not ? It's not even shilled here.

>>26153097

More commits equal larger team understanding the importance of keeping the commit size small for obvious SWE reasons. Bullish.

>>26144995
wasn't this supposed to moon? it hasn't done fuckall.

>>26155293
16x since march 2020

>>26153413
Reporting for duty. We got the url locked down too.

.