/biz/ - Business & Finance

Surely it's done on the price that you cash out at? You haven't made a mil if you haven't cashed out yet.

Yeah that's literally what happened in 2017, same as the UK.

If you put 1k into BTC and it went to 100k, you owe tax on 99k of it.

Disposal of assets is classed as a lot of things, including converting to shitcoins.

If your 100k of nano tanks down to 1k, you still owe the queen 20% of your 99k original investment.


The system is designed to keep people poor, never forget that.

>>26113286
No. Capital losses count just as much as capital gains do. If you make a loss you are owed tax.

Right..?

I've been using koinly to calc my taxes in the UK and losses are taken off your tax bill

Reposting:
>>26097709

>>26113360
Which means that your 99% loss in nano would negate the tax you owed from your 100x in bitcoin

>>26113391
Wrong one

>>26097677

>>26113203
It's really easy. just DON'T REPORT CRYPTO-TO-CRYPTO TRADES
>b-b-but I did a bunch of daytrading and shitcoin swapping on coinbase!
That's your fault for being a fucking idiot. Do that shit on a DEX or somewhere you're not KYC'd

>>26113360
>>26113410
The problem here was that people flipped their BTC to altcoins in December 2017. Altcoins then peaked and crashed in January 2018. That's a different year. You can't apply those 2018 losses against your 2017 gains. You can only write it off as a loss for the next year's tax filing. And eve nthen, at least in murica, you can only write off a net loss of $3k a year.

>>26113649
unbelievably based

>>26113203
Yes I hate it here. I want to move to South America some where. Maybe Costa Rica or Panama. I would already be gone if I didn’t have my dog to worry about too. USA is retarded. I’m hoping the one good thing Biden might do is change the crypto tax laws.

>>26114545
Don’t be a fool. Biden is going to tax the ever living fuck out of everything especially crypto because this is the end game and the elites want to permanently destroy the middle class.

It's a great meme to pretend this is just an American thing and the rest of the world can laugh at Americans. But most countries tax assets this way. Sure, a few explicitly do not, and many others are so vague about how they tax crypto that you can get away with not reporting it and nobody will care. But the general principle applies in most Western countries. If you trade one coin for another, you make a taxable event. Because you couldn't have bought as much of coin 2 if it hadn't been for the rise in price of coin 1. That shouldn't strike you as some out-of-nowhere revelation. You realised a gain; you owe taxes on that.
And yes, you can write off your losses against your gains to reduce your tax bill. People seem to forget about that because they get so worked up about their tax bills. Exiting bad positions at a loss should be part of your strategy.

>>26114930
Dumb you don’t actually realize a gain untill you actually cash out

>>26115440
Yeah but that's what the KKona guberment wants.

>>26115440
You missed the point completely.
You buy 1 BTC at $10000. Then when it's $20000 you trade it for a shitcoin that's still underpriced. You can buy more of that shitcoin with $20000 BTC than you could with $10000 BTC. That's a realised gain.
Just because you don't spend it in a shop doesn't mean the gain isn't realised.

>>26113203
Thats how taxes work in Denmark as well where I live.

>make r*ddit thread
>>Oy vey goys I'm so fucked, I made money but I'm fucked now, fuck don't you goys ever try this
>6 gorillion upvotes

basically as a USA citizen, I serve the american government, and I must pay tribute in the form of a percentage of income OR profit. even if it's overseas. even if it's 20$ I made sucking off a thai tranny. yeah, that's the gist. also, the tax guys are just about the only government structure worth their salt, they are bloodhounds. I think they also get a return of 3$ for every 1$ they spend on tracking our money and extorting us for it.

>>26114930
Imagine that you buy a 1 dollar coin for 10000 dollars and it shoots up to 2000 dollars just one day before December 31. Then it dumps to 1 dollar on January 1 one day after. Suddenly you owe millions in taxes overnight while actually realizing nothing.

>>26116722
Only if you sold it in December, in which case you realised that gain.
What you mean is if you bought Coin A in Year 1, it went up, you swapped it for Coin B also in Year 1, then in Year 2 Coin B drops. Yes, you still owe taxes on selling Coin A for Coin B, because you realised the gain on Coin A at that point. What happens to the price of Coin B after you buy it doesn't affect that, and if you don't sell it until another tax year you can't use the losses to offset the gains from the previous sale.

RETARDS RETARDS

As long as you NEVER convert your BTC into shitcoins

You are NOT taxed until you convert it into FIAT

I REPEAT NEVER CONVERT YOUR BTC INTO SHITCOINS YOU WILL SUICIDE BELIEVE ME DONT DO IT. THE GOVERNMENT CONSIDERS IT A REALISATION OF PROFIT ON AN ASSET AND YOU WILL GET RAPED

>>26117817
EVERY CRYPTO TRADE IS CONSIDERED A TAXABLE EVENT

IF YOU CONVERT FROM BTC TO ETHEREUM FOR EXAMPLE, THE GOVERNMENT DOESNT GIVE A FUCK AND TAXES YOU AS IF YOU CONVERTED IT INTO FIAT

>>26113749
correct answer

>>26113749
Capital gains losses max at 3k a year but you can do that every year until the total loss is realized.

Lose 9k in 20? 3k loss in 21,22,23

>>26113203

>>26113203
Even if it's shit you should be able to finalize the loss in a trade and it will count as "Capital Loss". And Capital loss should carry over in years as a tax credit until it's gone from Capital Gains. How did he fuck it up? Or is USA some backwards shithole that limits Capital Loss carryover?

>>26117817

> I REPEAT NEVER CONVERT YOUR BTC INTO SHITCOINS YOU WILL SUICIDE BELIEVE ME DONT DO IT. THE GOVERNMENT CONSIDERS IT A REALISATION OF PROFIT ON AN ASSET AND YOU WILL GET RAPED
lmao amerimutts

>>26113274
The issue is that trading it for other coins counts as a taxable event. If he was just holding I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be an issue at all.

>>26118011
>>26118011
Yeah but the point is that if you did something like in that reddit pic (and actually fully reported your trades like a retard), you'd be deducting that 3k/yr until your dead. And meanwhile you'r still fully responsible for paying off the 2017 cap gains

>>26113649
Fuckin retard

>BTC goes to $50k
>go to cash out your 20 BTC stack
>you made it
>govt: hold up bud where did you get that $1 million dollars huh? trying to launder something? didn’t report holdings and earnings in previous years?
>get ass fucked

yeah real smart nigger

inb4 just wait until you can buy things with crypto

kys

>>26117817
>implying I won't go to a country that is more friendly to crypto before the IRS tries to take what is mine

>>26119251
You can use crypto on Newegg.com

Just buy 500 hard drives or some shit and sell them for cash at a pawn shop. Easy.

>>26113203
It's fairly logical. You're taxed on gains when you realize those gains. If you have a loss, you can use that loss to offset the taxes on capital gains. To get JUST'd you would have to buy an investment in 2020, have it moon, sell on Dec 31st, invest all of that money into a shitcoin on Jan 1st, and then lose all of your money. It's your fault for not setting aside the money you owe in taxes when you recognize a capital gain.

>>26119251
You can literally buy RV campers with shitcoins and sell it later for money. I know for a fact that I bought one 3 years ago before the crash. They were lucky to cash out but got fucked by taxes.

>>26119380
> You can use crypto on Newegg.com

The goal is to buy a house and steady index funds and blue chip stocks so you never have to wagecuck again, not buy a 8k gaming rig

What are you going to do with a million in cash under your mattress?

Holy Shit i did not realize this so what are the most crypto friendly countries right now ?

>>26119886
any country if you aint a retard

>>26119477
this, it makes perfect sense. Crypto to crypto still counts as realizing your gains. It might only seem somewhat arbitrary because you're not thinking of the numbers on the screen as "real value".

Imagine if you cashed out $500k profits without paying taxes and buying a lambo for it. Then the next day you crash the lambo and later on, the tax man comes for the taxes on that $500k. Do you think that "b-but I already crashed the lambo I bought with that money" will exempt you from taxes? Ofc not, same applies to shitcoins

>>26120139
I like your lambo example.

>>26117817
>>26119251
ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME RRRRRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

I TRADED MY BTC INTO CHAINLINK RIGHT BEFORE IT DROPPED DOWN TO $35K

>>26113203
it depends on the year that it happens
if on december 30th you trade a shitcoin that went from 0.00001 usd to 10000 usd and you make 1 million, you get taxed at a capital gain of 1 million
but the shitcoin you cashed out into goes from 1 million worth to zero on january 1st
so that 2 day change ends what tax year it is, and you now owe tax on the 1 million made (for that year) despite losing everything the following year

>>26120037
Lmao retard there are a handful of crypto friendly third world countries left and they won't be for much longer. The crypto dream is dead

>>26121815
lmao retard, you literally cant into simplest ways to bypass those pathetic regulations, and you call someone a retard
fuck off boomer
> The crypto dream is dead
right and 7 figures I cashed out, and 7 figures that still remain ofcourse will perish and disappear, right? right? wrong.

>>26113286
>you owe the queen
pretty sure your taxes have gone straight to parliament since charles 1st got DOMED by cromwell

>>26113203
I just wouldn’t file shit

But do I really have to pay taxes before I cash out? Do I have to pay every year even if I don't cash out?
Does converting to other cryptos count as cashing out?

>>26113203
Repost. Honeypot. We all pay our taxes here so nice try faggot.

>>26118011
How do you prove the carry over. For example you had 30k loss in 2018...so you can carry over 3k losses until 2028. How do you prove this? You are still attaching 2018 trades to your 2028 tax form to show there is still some losses left from 2018....and somehow they are supposed to know you aren’t bullshitting them?

>>26113203
>If I made a mil in a trade but then that asset dumps to -99%, I'd have to pay as if I still had the mil?
In a year. Whatever your total at the end of the year is, thats what you get taxed on. So add up the gains and losses, thats taxed. Its called tax loss harvesting. Selling old shit to lower tax rate on your gains. Where retards mess up is they made money in 2017 off btc then lost it all in 2018 Jan. For 2017 tax bill they are expected to pay up a lot.

>>26120797
You are fine if you left enough to pay taxes on what you sold in BTC.

>>26113203
how new are you

>>26113203
I had to pay taxes on about 30-50 trades in 2017 after holding my bag with most people through the correction. It was like $800. Was pretty annoying having to pay my goy fee considering I didn't ever cashout.

But once I was there, it is clear sailing territory. Just hold. It doesn't matter what the market does and I can worry about my long term cap gains tax when I sell. Two things people should consider;

1). Build your strategy around hodling out for long term cap gains territory. You can't avoid paying the goy toll.
2). If you want to play cyberanoncryptoboi then you should have been prepared with a strategy to maintain your anonymity from your fiat on-ramp to cashing out.

Personally, I'd rather pay some annoying legacy fee's and be able to easily do my taxes with an exchange api and sell without any fuss.

It may be intimidating/scary to deal with the tax side of this but it really isn't that bad do do yourself and you can get cryptotax cpa/lawyer on retainer for a really fair price if you're up for that.

Fear is the mind killer. Don't miss out on being an early investor in web3/blockchain/defi/decentralization, you won't get this chance again.

This thread is full of larpers trying to scare people into thinking the government are after them

How the fuck are they gonna know how much profit you made from "daytrading" shitcoins? The changs at binance won't give a fuck when the IRS calls them up, they don't owe them anything

Cashing out to fiat bejng taxed makes sense because a capital gain has taken place if the government has classified crypto in that way, but so called profits on trading shitcoins being taxed is the dumbest thing I've ever heard and is extremely hard to be enforced