/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>24456565
It is because the amount of bullshit involved with buying/renting/building/getting permits/insurance/natural disasters for like 20 - 30% returns is incomprehensible when I can click a button and get 20 - 30% returns

Real estate? More like just a bunch of hyped up bullshit with zero guarantees, just like crypto. One of them requires work

>>24456565
I don't know but I have 2 rental properties if you want to hear about them.

>>24456565
>buy land
>do nothing
>make money
What is there to discuss?

>>24456645
yea, some questions:

- zipcode / town?
- when did you buy?
- have you invested much in improving them or has most of the cost gone into maintenance?
- has it been difficult to find reliable tenants?
- What's been your total return so far?

>>24456565
In a city right now it makes sense to rent because maintenance across the country is absurd. Otherwise, in a suburb/rural makes sense to buy if primary residence because of mortgage interest tax deduction and 2.5% interest rates. That's it. Past your primary residence, real estate is a lot of bullshit for limited gains unless you're a chad agent, have family in the business, or have the necessary connections. Better off sticking with shitcoins or waging.

Is Fundrise a viable option for real estate investing? Honestly, I'd rather buy a couple acres and start a homestead than buy apartments I have to maintain

>>24456565
>Why is there no thread ever on /biz/ to discuss real estate investing with likeminded real estate bros?

Because, quite frankly, you inherit or buy real estate, and sit and wait, and whilst you do wait , you pay taxes, make necessary repairs, and collect rent... so you at least don't lose money while you wait. Much like BTC. If you need someone to hold your hand, try the faggot next door?

>>24456627
Enjoy your shitcoin going down 50% in a single day. Oh, you made 20%? Congrats, Goldberg gets 50% of it.

Rent's due next week kid

>>24456733
>zipcode / town?
UK here
>when did you buy?
2009, 2013
>have you invested much in improving them or has most of the cost gone into maintenance?
Bought both from brand new, very little work done since
>has it been difficult to find reliable tenants?
Yes, somewhat. You'll often churn through a few tenants that only stay <6 months before getting one that wants to be there longterm. Both my current tenants have been there like 3 years with no sign of leaving.
>What's been your total return so far?
Dunno. Current income is about £1100 a month combined, which is considerably lower than it used to be, but lowered the rents for various reasons over last few years. Could raise rent again but would rather keep reliable tenants for now. Mortgages are around £450 a month combined.

>>24456804
choosing the right market, getting into a market at the right time, doing flips, etc. - there's a lot that goes into it. Prior to covid, there were buyers markets across cities/suburbs in the midwest as well as Florida. Sellers markets in most other parts. Since Covid, rural and suburb prices have gone up across the country. Some softness with downtown condos in certain cities.

Point being, there's more to it then just pointing your finger at the nearest For Sale sign, buying that one, and making money over time. In the long run, sure, but there are many real estate investors that choose to operate within 5 year spans (or even within 6 months) of execution with a goal in mind

>>24456627
I did the math just now on my real estate investment bought in 2013. If I sold today I'd have 250k profit.
If I would have taken that money and put it in the stock market (SPY) I'd have 200k profit. Both the stock market and real estate were both beaten down in 2013, I'm no expert but real estate probably had better upside.

This isn't considering capital gains on the stock which make real estate clearly the winner. Both markets are pretty frothy right now but IMO the stock market looks stupider than real estate now. Historically they're pretty close together. Not so much due to one investment being better than the other, but based on the sheer power of how much the Fed devalues the dollar through inflation over decades. You have to get your money out of cash. But try to have a bit of cash ready for crashes.

>>24457224
you could have already been a millionaire right now if you put that 250k into crypto.

there will be more threads on the topic come spring/summer. simply put, there are too many people with less savings, income, and jobs than previously. bankruptcies are beginning now, and evictions/foreclosures begin in january. allowing for delays and whatnot, march should get the ball rolling for cheapies and county tax auctions

>>24457283
I am a millionaire. Several times over. Really. No larp. I have never put 250k into crypto. Never. 50k at the most. And it went extremely well. And I did not only listen to /biz/ ... I guided /biz/ a long time before my unfortunate absence. Due to legal problems. Bow to me, and you shall be rewarded.

>>24457283
Lol true. I have essentially all my liquid worth in Bitcoin now though, so no worries.

Don't listen to /biz/ is a fucking meme. You just need to figure out what to listen to.

>>24456627
Your investment is high risk, mid to high reward. Aka gambling. I bought a condo in 2012 for 150.000, it's worth now 320.000. Now tell me you made comparable money with shitcoin chasing. Nothing wrong with gambling, but you see, it's not sth to perform volume style investment with. Only larpers in here claim to put 100k in xyz coin.

>>24456565
Real Estate is a slow moving boomer bubble at its very peak rn.
This generation spends more time in the digital world than the physical. No one here is interested in buying boomer bags, you can listen to 'old wisdom' and ride their old cocks OP but you will never replicate their luck with Real Estate

>>24456565
Companies are moving to a home working model, many business downgrading office space, flexible working will increase prices in countryside, but city real estate gonna crash big.

>>24456565
real estate is literally the easiest asset class to go full retard on

>buy property without too much leverage (20-30% down)
>rehab if necessary
>find renters
>hold forever

Where you get in trouble is trying to speculate on flipping. Just build a portfolio and hold long term, pay the shit off with other peoples money, then keep holding even longer.

>>24457447
WOW DUDE it only took you eight years for your property to double that's so sick!

what all did you pay in taxes and maintenance over those eight years?

>>24457996
>rehab if necessary
buying real estate makes you dependent on drugs?

>>24457388
checked but go fuck yourself for the vagueness in this post.

Real estate is low IQ.

>>24458800
Just fucking myself now... no time to explain... give me a few fucking minutes

>>24458852
alright. I'll allow it, anon.

>>24458985
I will take this permission to cut later, ok? If the judge asks why we did it, I will say, I had Anon's permission. Should be suffice

>>24459136
wtf am I agreeing to here? I thought you were gonna brush your teeth and tell us how you became a millionaire "many times over". I might have to write you a citation, m8

>>24459221
A, I see. I misunderstood you. I inherited, and did silly things to make sure my investments with that inherited money would go well. I thought I was smarter than the law. Maybe I am. We'll see

And here is the real danger to them. To the system. People who know and dare abuse it. Welcome.

P.S. And by KEK, we are not the first ones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FfFbcbGaTMY

>>24456565
Nice get
It’s putting 100 bucks in xrp is easier than putting a 20k down payment on a duplex.
t. Landchad

>>24460383
I would advise XLM rather. XRP is a wild card that went well wild... Long term XRP might be doing better, although that is really not my area of expertise. Just saying what I think now :)

>>24457996
>>find renters
landlordism only works until the economy can't sustain all the parasites anymore. Look at landlords during covid. Everyone is moving in with family or just refusing to pay rent because they need to eat.

>>24460455
Xrp banks on the banks.
Xlm banks on the individual.
Banks win every time.
I’m not huge into crypto tho, I’ve been grinding real estate.

>>24460594
I got really lucky so far with covid.
I only bought in suburban areas and ruthlessly vet my tenants.

>>24460648
Based, fuck commies

>>24460605
Lets face it. I give advice on 4chan, I give advice to faggots who know to decrypt this info into what it means really. So my advice to you_ stay away from alts. Except maybe link. And know (not believe) know that BTC will actually happen now again. And drag etc all the way up with it.

>>24460780
Do you think real estate will crash given pandemic

>>24460811
No. At least not in Europe. I cannot solo speak for USA

>>24456565
/biz/ is full of priced out poorfags

Imo I have found a new Gem!

Take a look at DDIM on Uniswap, it seems like the DuckDAO platform made a revolution among investment systems. Take a look at duckdao.io, share your thoughts about it

>>24460907
/biz/ is full of people I actually know irl or via email. Priced out? You are completely off Anon. More like, lets do it again, Janet.

>>24460780
I have limited vested in crypto.
60% btc
20% link
20% split in xrp and ada (I want to believe)
Less than 3k total.
I already went the real estate route and it’s working nicely. Anything happens with my crypto is just a bonus.
>>24460811
It might, doesn’t matter a whole lot as long as ppl need a place to live and you provide that for them.

>>24456627
>bullshit with zero guarantees
>zero guarantees
why?

>>24461026
Will you get into dividend investing as well

In the end. Real estate is a valuable store of value. You own LAND. Think about that alone. And other than that. it will never moon 1000% in a few months. But it is a safe and sound basic investment. One that you might need if you put money on ONE and shit like that. You need to read 4chan the right way. Button I am back. I will be Satan again and only people with at least half a brain remain.

>>24461371
Most likely not. Just because I don’t understand it well.
I get real estate. It’s easy.
Buy in a good area that’s only going to increase in property value, vet your tenants, put 25% a month away for vacancies and repairs... profit.
I kinda understand crypto so I’m only kinda investing in it.
The only thing I kno about dividends is that Kevin O learys mom wouldn’t invest without them.

>>24461371
Absolutely, you needed to all the way. Key to investing successfully is spread it all- And not spread it amongst shitcoin x and y. Because they fall with BTC. Or rise.

>>24461917
Do you recommend something like DIV index fund or actual dividend stocks?

>>24461917
>>24462027
Monitoring this conversation

Landlord here, let me drop some knowledge on you losers with 4 figure shit coin portfolios.

You get into real estate so you can use a mortgage or so you can abuse the gap between financable and cash only homes. Mortgages are hands down the best form of leverage average jack offs can get, you literally can’t get margin called unless you miss a payment. The point isn’t to make money off your money, it’s to make money off someone else’s money. The brainlet tier ROI calculus I see in this thread isn’t accurate because you aren’t taking into account rent or the fact that you bought the property zero money down so that house that you bought for $200k and sold for $300k isn’t a %50 return, it’s more like %3000 return because some other chump has been paying your mortgage for you and you only had to front up the $10k for closing costs.

Second, real estate is by far the best asset class if you want to dodge the taxman. Having a real physical property allows you to justify all kinds of stupid shit as a tax exemption and the IRS doesn’t blink twice at it. If you want to ball all your assets into an S type corporation, you absolutely should have some real estate.

Lastly, real estate is scalable. Assets like crypto and stock create complications the larger your portfolio gets. Real estate is the opposite, the more equity you have in it the easier it is to expand because banks love loaning to real estate investors who display consistently good stewardship.

What scares people away from RE is the commitment time frames and the amount of work you have to put in. Escrow is 30 days so it’s pretty difficult to panick sell your property at the slightest whiff of a downturn.

>>24462027
You won't like my honest opinion about buyable ath stocks now.

>>24462203
This is accurate

>>24457447
anon you do realize 8 years of QE eats pretty deep into your profit right?

>>24462203
leaf anon here, thoughts on investing in unserviced land in Vancouver area? What can I do with unserviced land?

I bought a house in late 2015 and now it's doubled in price on Zillow and I get calls every week or so from randoms asking if I'm interested in selling. I'm already getting nearly twice my mortgage payment in rent payments from it so I'm just letting it ride while I dump all my free money into crypto. If crypto moons I'm planning to move back there and remodel it while living the NEET life on the cheap. Then after two years (for tax reasons) I'll sell it, pay NO taxes, and move out to a really rural area to build a Waco-proof bunker full of artillery.

>>24463339
>doubled in price on Zillow
He thinks the zestimate is in any way accurate

>>24463544
I know it's not because of how my house is currently laid out which makes it shit to live in even if it looks good on paper. However, I'm guessing the people who won't stop calling me don't know that, and I could probably sell it sight unseen if they're cold calling me.

As it is, even if I sold it now, taxes would rob me of basically all my profits. It's not worth selling until I can live in it for two years or it triples in price from when I bought it.

>>24463085
I take unserviced land to mean bare land with no utilities within 1000’

I’d stay away from that as a novice. The most profitable thing you’d be able to do without investing a ton of money would be to plant trees and wait 20 years. Bare property that’s away from an urban center is the domain of big dick land developers.

>>24463644
>because of how my house is currently laid out
The zestimates are all fucked up regardless.
>I could probably sell it sight unseen if they're cold calling me
If they aren't realtors looking for a listing and actual buyers you are probably in a high demand neighborhood and might be able to fetch a good price.

>>24463644
Pro tip: your actual “house” is the least important thing in determining the value, at least if you don’t live in the middle of nowhere where you can get acres of land for 5 figure sums. If you are close to any real population density, what matters more is the zoning, schools, property line layout (EG: not a shitty flag lot), and the amount of bed/bath you can have. Your “house” is $60k in plywood and drywall.

>>24456565
This Canadian chad sold over three billion in real estate during his career. Think that made him more money than crypto? Read the book, anon. If you're not doing real estate, you're a fool.

>>24463968
I only read books written by white males

>>24463653
https://www.rew.ca/properties/2937295/lot-4-st-marys-avenue-north-vancouver-bc?property_click=map

I just want to build a small house myself

>>24464270
You got $700k cash to buy that lot?

>>24464027
Why would you read or follow anything else? I mean white isn't even noteworthy. It is self speaking Anon.

>>24464470
ye, the max I could spend is 1.5m tho
I would prefer to build a small, concrete house because of the plywood mcmansion meme
but honestly I know nothing about real estate/house building, want to hear what anon suggests

I have met my fair share of really twisted anons over the years. And I want to remind you that white is not something to note. it is standard. It is white or over.
Hail Satan.

>>24464524
You need an accurate picture of what permitting and utility install is going to cost you and once you have a solid estimate for that, you use that in price negotiations for the property.

You need a very solid path to a completed home before you even talk about buying the property. Think about it this way, there has to be something wrong if the permitting and utility install is being put upon the buyer or else the owner would have already pulled permits and had a site cleared with utility drops.

I’d recommend looking for a lot with those things already there.

>>24463968
Canada also takes 60% of your income in taxes. And their money is worth less than the american dollar. If you factor that in plus convert the left over number to USD, this leaf has only made 900 million.. Not so impressive now huh?

>>24464829
Good advice anon.
You ever thought of getting into RE development? Or too much risk compared to landlording?

>>24465101
Risk and a shitload of work. I wouldn’t be able to do it all by myself. Meanwhile, I can pay a monthly pittance to a property manager and do almost nothing as a two bit landlord.

>>24464829
thanks for the help, anon

>>24463339
>move out to a really rural area to build a Waco-proof bunker full of artillery.

Nice. Bleed it dry, dump your bags and then fall back and shell the town. Can't do that in crypto.

>>24464896
yeah, leaf income tax sucks. capital gain is okay though. it's like 25% effectively

How would a schizo neet be able to utilize leverage in the real estate market? Would I need to own a house and utilize collateral loans or would be huge sum of money be enough maybe like half in qqq and the rest utilizing down payments and rent.

>>24459453
it always comes back to the 'i' word. always. not defeatist, just realist. grats anon

>>24456565
Own 1 two family and closing in a second.
It’s honestly hard work with all of the maintenance. With school and work I’ve had barely any time to keep up. You basically have to grind like this until you can afford to hire maintenance people.