/biz/ - Business & Finance

I get that you're payed to shill here but literally why

- Gigantic marketcap
- Huge price
- No dip in sight

Are you just a bag holder?

>>22688901
>huge price
literally down 81% from ATH

>>22689002
$89 is disgustingly high for a project that touts itself as the currency for 21st century consumers, but is actually used by almost no-one. Inflated as fuck. Don't get me wrong I'll buy when it's at $10 but not a second sooner.

Thinking of going all in and paper wallet this bitch and fucking off for some years
Y/N?
Consider that I'm fiat-ed up right now

>>22689098
Then don't buy it. We don't care. We aren't moonboy faggots. Monero improves on Bitcoin's technology and privacy and long term it is the Satoshi vision that we idealize.
>>22689131
Up to you. Why do you like Monero?

bump

>>22689238
So you are just a bag holder. Have fun lmao, It'll take a few years to get that ATH back

>>22690770
>bag holder
Storing wealth is a use case, especially for monero.

Monero is the most usable crypto currently for the real world. Its literally digital cash and what bitcoin users think they are using.

>>22689098
I know you want to accumulate but FUD isn't going to change the price. Bitcoin's gonna drag the price down anyways so just wait a few weeks and top up :^)

>>22691025
8 blackball id. nice

>>22690770
Okay? I'm not a street shitting pajeet. I don't care if the price stays around what its at now for a few years. I am much more concerned with actual adoption, which is provably expanding if you look at daily transaction totals.

A 0.01BTC Monero would put it around $1,000 if Bitcoin hits $100K

A 10x from here is the worst case scenario

>>22691247
Do you host a node?

>>22691347
Yep. Cli wallet. Very comfy.

I will open me another beer. comfy.

>>22689098
what? currency for 21st century consumers? 89$ is high? newfag low information midwit spotted.

>>22691433
Checked. Me too. Also i have opened the rpc ports for light wallets:
./monerod --data-dir /xmr/blockchain --in-peers 100 --out-peers 100 --rpc-bind-ip 0.0.0.0 --rpc-bind-port 18089 --restricted-rpc --confirm-external-bind --p2p-bind-port 18080 --limit-rate-up 1200

token not needed

>>22692380
>token not needed
It is not a token, pal.

>>22689098
>actually used by almost no-one
In 2020 it is used by EVERY major dark net market. Bitcoin is only used by most DNMs with the most notable exception being White House Market, one of, if not the largest DNMs. Everything else has zero use but Monero is ranked 18th by market cap. $1.5B market cap for the best permission less currency on the internet. If you think that's not cheap then fuck you. Governments spend that on one mile of road ffs.

>>22689131
Y
Risk/reward is too good not to.

>>22691325
>if Bitcoin hits $100K
that's never happening, btc is bound to collapse sooner or later

I’m on the fence about taking the leap and dropping half my says into XMR. Talk me into it, or out of it, idc

>>22688595
only holding monero now should buy more rn ?

>>22693486
Buy an unknown amount or don’t.

>>22694283
That is sort of the plan, yes

>tfw no monero waifu

>>22693567
Could touch 70 euros maybe, but since the tx count is near ATH it is unlikely.

>>22693486
>>22693567
Buying Monero now is like buying Bitcoin in 2012. It's had its first hype cycle and has established itself as a useful currency on dark net markets. Coming up next, people start thinking about the future implications of that.

>>22688595
monero is great and all but what will happen once this get banned from exchanges?

>>22694692
Nice chart

>>22693486
Bitcoin sucks. The culture is that they will never make breaking changes to the protocol, because its value comes from widespread consensus of which chain is "the" blockchain. But this is silly. No one cares about the technical details. The technical details are supposed to implement the social consensus of what "Bitcoin" is. This is not what's happened. Bitcoin has reneged on most of its early promises. It's no longer "one CPU one vote": Chinese ASICs control mining. It no longer "banks the unbanked": the unbanked can't afford its transaction fees. It doesn't offer the privacy Satoshi hoped for in the whitepaper, even as early developers offered technical solutions. It barely works as peer-to-peer uncensorable cash: without privacy, the local government can simply find you and punish you off-chain for transactions they don't approve of.

None of this will change. We saw in 2017 an attempt to maintain some of the early promises of Bitcoin by increasing the max block size to a level appropriate for modern hardware. It was derided as an "attack" on the "consensus". This consensus is to continue running the same code, forever, as the world changes around Bitcoin, sacrificing whatever principles necessary to achieve deliberate stagnation.

Monero and its community build consensus around principles. Monero is now and always will be secure, private, digital cash. The technical details necessary to make this happen are not sacred. Monero can and does regularly hard fork to improve its implementation of these ideals. And remember that none of these strains of magic internet money have any "intrinsic" value imbued by their code or whatever. The value comes from shared belief in what our funky distributed database represents. If you want the vision Satoshi sold to the world a decade ago, Monero has the best track record.

You should move all your sats into XMR, not half, to be quite honest.

>>22694893
monero is great and all but
monero is great and all but
monero is great and all but

Hi again.

>>22695057
Valid arguments all but BTC at least has some brand recognition, even if it’s for money laundering and darkweb purchases. Monero has all the baggage but even less adoption

>>22694893
Because probation has always worked in their favour. Yes, quite. You know your history lad.
...

>>22695139
Because BTC is widely adopted? Compared to the current institutions? Not at all.
It's a non issue

>>22695139
let's hope you're right

>>22695139
Brand recognition, which is just surface level recognition of what something is, isn't really important in the long run. Normies never drive changes in society. Normies don't give a shit about Satoshi's vision and all that rot; they'll adopt crypto when they get offers for credit cards that are denominated in crypto. Or they'll buy some without understanding why when their friends are excited about the money number going up. People who actually need secure, private, digital cash will be forced to investigate more deeply than knowing whatever name is most familiar.

As the other anon pointed out, neither actually has very much adoption. The last time I checked, Monero activity is growing rapidly and Bitcoin declining slowly. The real reason to hold any crypto at all is belief that it will successfully overthrow aspects of the traditional financial system, at which point today's prices will be laughable. But they're all overpriced if they never increase beyond their current level of adoption. So, which is more likely to achieve that goal, BTC or XMR? If you answer BTC, is it 120x as likely?

>>22695138

>>22695057
Good post but I think this is a good opportunity to note that Monero devs announced they will be reducing the frequency of hard forks. I think they're talking about one every 9-12 months after the October update, just because it's taxing for users and applications to have to update so often.

>>22691478
meisels tastes like shit

>>22696180
Yep, it's true. Bitcoiners are right that there's a benefit to not pushing breaking changes. I just think they've pushed this principle beyond the point of absurdity and it's killed the project.

>>22696180
What do these hard forks mean in practical terms? Wallet updates? If I have a cold wallet that I don’t touch for years, do I have to worry that when I do decide to move some it’ll be fucked up?

>>22696517
Usually they're improvements to privacy features bundled with a lot of general bugfixes. I'm not sure on this but considering how much has happened in the past few years, if you had a cold wallet you might have difficulties if you don't update everything or whatever.

>>22696418
You got no taste.

>>22696517
forks will not just make your coins dissapear
you will just need to update whatever software you use when you want to move them

>>22696419
>killed the project
Lmao. Explain to me how rising adoption is a dead crypto currency?
>>22696517
Nothing to worry about for cold storage. The hard forks are upgrades in scaling and privacy

>>22696594
I’m thinking more if I buy today with the intention of forgetting about it in cold storage for a few years

>>22696694
Where is this "rising adoption"?

>>22696706
Your private key will always be valid. You'll just have to use the latest software whenever you want to move funds. One *possible* concern is that a particular hardware wallet might not have firmware available for future Monero versions. In that case, you would need to convert the hardware wallet's seed into a Monero seed, for example with something like this: https://github.com/LedgerHQ/app-monero/tree/master/tools/python

>>22696793
https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/monero-transactions.html
The rising adoption is happening on the dark net. We bring it up frequently in these generals because bitcoin first got started on the Silk Road.

>>22688901
>>22689098
>>22692380
DRNS zoomer shitcoiners BTFO

>>22696706
You just restore your seed with the latest wallet. You won't even notice. It's people using it already and then their wallet stops working because it's too old who are like "wtf".

>>22688901
>>22689098
>>22692380
lol at zoomer shitcoiners

>>22697031
Oh, I think you missed the context of my post. I was talking about Bitcoin getting killed, Monero is certainly growing in popularity.

>>22697167
Got you.
It will be interesting to see the cope from bitcoin maxis when monero takes over the dark net completely. What will their response be?

>>22697235
Ignorance, most likely. They're by-and-large moonboys who care about institutional adoption. I wouldn't be surprised to see someone like Adam Back cheer on Bitcoin for "shedding it's negative association with dark nets" or something dumb.

>>22697340
> see someone like Adam Back cheer on Bitcoin for "shedding it's negative association with dark nets" or something dumb.
yeah, this is what I think the majority will do.
There are a lot of OG maxis that love monero however and I think those ones will be smart enough to adjust their holdings and get more monero.
But it's hard to find counter arguments against the innovations that Monero has over Bitcoin in terms of scaling and privacy.

>>22697235
Probably an increasingly nervous refrain of:
>But Monero isn't a good store of value, it has an infinite supply!
>You can't even audit the total supply!
>We don't need the association of criminal activity, regulation is good for Bitcoin!
because they no longer seem to care about any principles other than "remember the 21 million" and ensuring that it will be easy to dump bags on future newcomers.

Someone please explain this shit to a retard.I know Monero is for privacy and being anonymous but how do you know that this shit is not a honeypot full of glowies?

>>22697471
explain to me how a fully encrypted and decentralized p2p currency could be a honeypot? That doesn't make any sense.

>>22693338
It is literally mathematically inevitable and you're a retarded zoomer who thinks unproven whizzbang tech and sketchy anonymous teams with a $50M ICO warchest and no functioning product are the future of crypto and institutional adoption. Get fucked, BTC and Monero are the only two projects in crypto after 11 years that actually do something useful and have interest from real people with real money and real institutional credentials (In Monero's case half that attention is negative from world governments - which is the MOST BULLISH INDICATOR for a privacy project you could possibly ever ask for)

>>22697500
I don't know shit about it, that's why I'm asking. Any good resources to learn more about how it works in detail? When you change Monero to fiat, don't you loose all the anonymity benefits of the coin? Also, given that many exchanges have delisted Monero how do you expect to trade it in the future?

>>22697715
sorry anon. I thought you were just spreading FUD. We get that a lot in these generals.
I'd recommend looking at getmonero.org if you want some basic information on how Monero works (the ring signatures, stealth addresses, and the obfuscated transaction amounts are what makes Monero fungible and therefore completely private). These concepts are somewhat difficult to understand but they are what sets apart monero from other crypto.
>When you change Monero to fiat, don't you loose all the anonymity benefits of the coin?
Nope. It is true that the exchange would know your information based on your purchase, but they would have no way of knowing what happens once you remove the Monero off the exchange. Monero can't be traced. In this manner, its similar to how getting cash from an ATM works. So once you remove the Monero from the exchange it disappears from any surveillance.
>Also, given that many exchanges have delisted Monero how do you expect to trade it in the future?
This is not true. Only a few fringe exchanges have delisted Monero. Monero is still very easily available. There are even wallets that are available -- such as cake wallet -- that you can send bitcoin to and that will auto convert the bitcoin into Monero. I'd check out Binance or Kraken if you want Monero from a popular exchange.

>>22697471
>>22697500
Well, you could imagine that the cryptographic techniques Monero uses have a backdoor, a mathematical weakness which glowies know about but the cryptography community at large doesn't. It's happened before: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_EC_DRBG
Or perhaps there could be some deliberate implementation bug that a glowie-appointed dev managed to sneak into the Monero codebase.
But these are unlikely. All the cryptography code used by Monero has been audited by third parties, and the underlying elliptic curve (Ed25519) has been in widespread use for years with no evidence of a backdoor.

>>22698017
A backdoor would imply that there is some sort of key that you could use to get information. But Monero doesn't work like that. All the information is obfuscated and even if you are able to make vague connections with transactions you can point to plausible deniability.
>All the cryptography code used by Monero has been audited by third parties, and the underlying elliptic curve (Ed25519) has been in widespread use for years with no evidence of a backdoor.
yeah I really doubt there is anything in the code that could be used by glowies. As it is, the feds have made it pretty clear recently that they have no understanding of how Monero works. But one thing about Monero is that the community is very self critical and any new patches or forks are looked at with considerable scrutiny from the team, which is a great thing. Privacy is a constant battle and you never know when those glowie cockroaches are lurking.

>>22697959
Thank you for the information anon, will definitely have to do some research. What would you say its the best way to store Monero? Also, I recently read that (((regulators))) and glowies are now targeting Monero, hence why I asked about it. Do you think this will affect the adoption of the coin in the future? Do you people panic selling or avoiding the coin because of this?

>>22698330
>What would you say its the best way to store Monero?

Exodus wallet is pretty good. So is Gui.

>>22697959
Thank you for the information anon, will definitely have to do some research. What would you say its the best way to store Monero? Also, I recently read that (((regulators))) and glowies are now targeting Monero, hence why I asked about it. Do you think this will affect the adoption of the coin in the future? Do you think people will panic sell or avoid the coin because of this?

>>22698330
np fren.
>What would you say its the best way to store Monero?
make a wallet and send monero to it. write down your seed. You don't even need to have the wallet on your computer. As long as you have the seed you will have access to your monero. For specific wallets, I recommend the Monero GUI or cakewallet. We'll help you along the way if you get stuck, and remember, do your own research before buying!
> Also, I recently read that (((regulators))) and glowies are now targeting Monero, hence why I asked about it. Do you think this will affect the adoption of the coin in the future? Do you people panic selling or avoiding the coin because of this?
It's pretty much entirely FUD. If you go back to 2012 when Bitcoin really started to get popular, many of the same statements that are made today about Monero were said about Bitcoin, e.g. "it's a drug coin", "it's only used by pedos", "it's only used by people laundering monery", etc. These statements are even dumber when you consider how many trillions of fiat cash is spent every year in the underground drug economy, and yet dollars are looked at as a very respectable means of transaction. Recently, Tari Labs (a sister company related to Monero) funded a research paper with lawyers regarding privacy coins and legality. It's a good read. You also have Kraken (one of the largest crypto exchanges in the world) who openly support Monero and are now becoming America's first crypto bank. Monero is going to be around for a very long time. I wouldn't worry.

>>22698591
Once again ty for the info, will definitely check out those wallets. Have a bump anon my friend!

Once again ty for the info, will definitely check out those wallets. Have a bump my friend!

>>22698191
That's a type of backdoor, but the concept is more general than that. An elliptic curve, and therefore software like Monero doing cryptographic operations on that curve, could be "backdoored" if there's an algorithm to reverse operations on it and no one but glowies know about it. But the curve Monero uses, Curve25519, is "fully rigid", which means this is unlikely to be the case.
More info: https://safecurves.cr.yp.to/rigid.html

>>22698783
np anon. If you ever see a monero general and you have questions we will be happy to help you out.
>>22698804
you are correct. But I think that breaking curve25519 is a pretty big if. Thanks for the link tho this looks like a great resource

>>22698945
Yeah, a whole lot of the Internet is fucked if glowies can break that curve. I don't consider it a realistic possibility, it's just a theoretical way a peer-to-peer system could still be backdoored.

>>22696636
nah just drank it too much now cant taste it

THIS FAT FUCK dumped on you!

you are not bag holders.

GET IT?

>>22700562
Pedo coin

>>22700562
>>22700587
You guys need to improve your FUD game. This is weak. >>22700587
>>22700587

>>22700562
look at that ALPHA CHAD UNIT

the market is shifting to using monero!

>>22701047
And it will continue in the long term. Why would people move towards less privacy?

Monero threads really seem like the only threads that actually discuss the coin and not just talk about the price

>>22701646
because it's one of the few coins with actual value

>>22701679
Sad to say but no-one gives a fuck right now.

Maybe one day people will be laundering billions through it, but not today.

>>22701713
Then why is adoption growing?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=errI-bKEKEQ

Monero is the future lads, not BTC, is either xmr or haven protocol

>>22701646
Idk if it's anybody else but the threads seem to be getting bigger. They go up more often and get more replies. It's encouraging compared to a few months ago.

Frens, is there a DEX where you can trade Monero?

>>22703066
Yeah, Bisq

>>22694692

>>22703066
Use cake wallet and send Btc

>>22697031

>>22689098
>5% as many daily transactions as Bitcoin and doubling every year while Bitcoin stagnates
>1% of the market cap

>>22698408
Bitcoin only got more popular after it became regulated - it was a form of recognition.

>>22698804
Monero confirmed safest crypto.

Have at least 1 XMR in 40 separate wallets by 2023. You'll thank me later.

>>22704758
Why separate wallets?

>>22689098
lol it's never going to $10 retard. the emission and supply is less than bitcoin.
i have to screencap this

>>22688595
how do I join the Monero train?

>>22705366
The simplest way, if you're not on any exchange that offers it, is to buy shitcoin xyz and swap it on MorphToken. The more private way would be to use Bisq or Localmonero.

>>22705473
is there any newfag way to mine for Monero?

>>22704354
The ideology behind Bitcoin is dead, when regulations and institutions started buying it was all down hill from there... The monetary benefit was there, but the IDEA of Bitcoin is long separated from Bitcoin

>>22688595
Sup LOKI guys

>>22705822
>is there any newfag way to mine for Monero?
depends on how newfag you are
you need a monero wallet.
kraken, gui, or cli will work (others too but that might be more advanced)
(i recommend the windows gui client, or a kraken account if you plan on buying.. not that kraken is great, but they at least support monero)
then once you have a wallet you need a miner
xmr-stak is supposedly faster than xmrig, but ive used both and they are both ok
then you need a mining pool.
i use moneroocean.stream
but they only pay after every 0.3 XMR mined, which solo might take a while (months) to get your first reward

pic related
my mining progress with my work computers.
several (older) systems

>>22688595
Erase this fucking threads, only/smg/ and /pmg/ is allowed.

Crypto faggots get the rope and nothing else

Reeeeeeeeee

>>22688595
Yeah im chillin

>>22706017
Do you know that metal mining destoys the environment?

>>22706017
Go shit up a STA thread boomer, Monero's the new gold

>>22688595
How much XMR to use the blowjob robot?

>>22706001
thanks for the info
at first I cant spend any dollar buying cryptocurrencies due to my country financial restrictions
>but they only pay after every 0.3 XMR mined, which solo might take a while (months) to get your first reward
is there a chart about flops/payment relation?
also I guess mining consumes 100% of every workstation

>>22706844
>is there a chart about flops/payment relation?
There is a chart at monerohash.com

>>22706844
well the 4930k@4ghz should be your benchmark system
it should help you guestimate your return
as you can see, even with all those systems running, it still takes me almost 2 weeks to get a reward
a ryzen 9 3950x is about 30KH/s
YMMV
Also power. lots of power
I mine at work because power is included in our lease

>>22705970
kill yourself raj

bump

>>22703825
>Use cake wallet
i still only use onlie exchanges like binance, coinbase
is this an offline wallet or something?
i haven;t been able to fully wrap my head around how all this works
(all I know is that metamask is a meme)

fuck it loki shill

>>22708701
cake wallet is a lightwallet. you do not need to download the blockchain.

>>22706844
supportxmr has minimum payout of 0.1 and minexmr is supposedly just 0.004

Just run xmrig with defaults to see what your hashrate will be and plug the hr into the calculator at one of the mining sites. Then you can setup a wallet and change the miner setting to mine for you.

>>22708701
>>22709523
You do download the blockchain with cake wallet but only from the day you started your wallet to the present and you don't store the blockchain like a full node.

Basically from best but most effort to least best with least effort:
Official CLI/GUI full node (PC) > Official GUI with remote node > Monerujo (Android), Cake Wallet (iPhone, Android)> MyMonero (iPhone, PC, web)

I love Monero

>>22689238
that's retarded why would i invest in shit that never moons