/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>21438225
Pay your taxes.

Never sell and buy stuff with crypto instead.

stop being a centerlink bludger and pay your taxes

>>21438225
you cant get ruined by CGT, you only get taxed on profit, its not that fucking hard, if you swing into a coin and lose money, then just cash out and your loses will cancel out your gains its not fucking rocket science

>>21438225
its no different than the taxes any high income earner pays, you make money on crypto for the year, you add it to your income and pay income tax on it

>>21438247
>>21438269

>paying taxes when 2/3 of our largest corporations pay $0 in tax

Fuck this country if I really truly make it I am moving somewhere else.

>>21438225
Leave prison island and cash out overseas.

>>21438247
I mean, duh? Just seems like I'd be kind of locked in to holding maybe longer than I'd necessarily want?

You hold for over a year, dont make trades outside of AUD -> TOKEN once and then you pay 30% on your profits after that year when you sell.

>>21438269
>dole bludging
nah m8, this is jobkeeper bux. For the next couple of months I'm earning damn near double what I was pre-covid, why shouldn't I gamble on funny internet money?

>>21438329
>>21438291
Based anons, ty for actual advice

If you're on scomobux, and you're getting into crypto just now, you won't make enough money to actually pay CGT in any real amount.

CGT is included with your ordinary income. So if you buy 100 link at $10 and sell them at $100, you have 'made' $9000.

If your total scomobucks for the year is $10k, and you make another $9k off that, then your taxable income is $19,000. This mean you only pay 19% tax on $800. So your tax for the year will be $150. Easier to pay and have the ATO leave you alone than otherwise.

>>21438225

Stop being frightened of the ATO. Profit is literally just whatever the total amount of money you make is.

You put 5K into AAVE, it does a 50x and you have 250K. You withdraw, that's 245K capital gain. Half tax if it's over a year since you bought.

>>21438225
Don't wanna pay taxes? Don't cash out.

>>21438329
any trade within crypto-to-crypto are also counted as CGT events

All these green IDs. Good shit cunts keep it up. we're all gonna make it

>>21438304
Its because they declare losses you dumb cunt. Even a tradie with an ABN declares his wifes boyfriends phone bills as his business expense to go into loss and claw back returns

>>21438491
Holy fuck really.

how the fuck am i gonna figure out the CGT by swapping eth for pnk and pnk mooning in the next 3 months?!?!?

i wish i wasnt so fucken autistic and the world was simpler

>>21438447
I'm going to use this as an example of why people shouldn't be so scared of the ATO.

Buy $5k into aave @ 1c = cost base
Sell all LEND @ 50c = $250,000
Capital Gain = $245,000
Held for over a year? -50%
Capital Gain with discount = $122,500

Tax liability assuming no other income:
= $54097 + (122,500-90,000x.45)
54097+14625
=68,722
So you walked away with $181,278.

Now you can register yourself as a business to pay less tax, write off "working from home" expenses, get your phone, laptop, and car paid for, and whatever. With an inventive accountant you might pay much less but even if you do your taxes yourself, a free $180k for contributing absolutely nothing or doing any work is pretty good.

Another overlooked strategy is to trade as a business. But you'll need to have a sales volume of at least 20k p.a. to be considered. If you do this, your accounting becomes cost based and you pay taxes based on the difference between your beginning of year and eoy balance sheet. This is easier to track than doing cgt on token to token trading, and is less messy.

LOl fuck you cunts, gov doesnt know anything about my crypto and im a uni student.

one of my parents were born in Europe so i can get a passport easy and live anywhere i want. Going to move to germany when im ready to settle down since it's a crypto tax haven. Get shafted cunts.

IF i do want to cash and have to py taxes, do they take away everything i've deposited over the years from the total taxed?

say if i put in 30k over 1 year, then i withdraw 100k. Will only 70k be taxable?

>>21438564
It's a pain but manageable. How much did you get the ETH for and how much was the ETH that you turned into PNK worth? That's CGT#1. If PNK moons and you wanna cash out, Use the value of when you turn ETH > PNK vs how much PNK when you cash out. Capital gains is taxed the same as your income bracket unless you hold for more than a year, for which you get 50% off on capital gains.

>>21438699
And what happens in exchanges you traded on 3 years ago are closed? if you 'lose' a wallet seed?

if you can't prove how you got the crypto? if it was gifted?

>>21438659
Godspeed you glorious cunt

>>21438659
>he doesn't know
losing tax residency in Australia is a CGT event. You will be arrested if the ATO decides you need to pay the tax, put a warrant out and you return to the country. This is a common occurrence and is regularly enforced.
https://www.ato.gov.au/General/Capital-gains-tax/International-issues/Changing-residency/

>>21438697
If I understand this right, 30k is your capital so yes. Only profits get taxed.

>>21438699

fuck i dont know this kind of information... i need to keep a graph of this shit.

>>21438733
What if i just slowly turn it into cash through the mail?

I can get up to 10k sent in the mail at a time at a 6% fee from a guy.

Probably the easiest way to go about it.

>>21438699

and does the fucken wallet exchange costs and gas fees count towards a deduction towards the CGT?

>>21438640
>Held for over a year? -50%
Is this real? I see it mentioned often but when looking for it on ATO.. no dice.

>>21438225
Buy link, hold for twelve months at least, and pay your taxes so that dan Andrews can fund the lifestyle of the guaranteed voter base that he imports en masse from Africa and the Middle eastern immigrants so they can spread corona.

>>21438720
If it was gifted, then it is still a CGT asset and you will pay tax on it as though you bought it for $0.

If you 'lose' a wallet, the Commissioner will deem your assets to be x amount based on an extrapolation within reason, but the number will probably be higher than what the real value is. After all, if it wasn't higher, you wouldn't have a reason to be trying to avoid tax. Then the onus is on you to either
a) fess up and say which wallets you own (they likely know this anyway if you've ever gone through a KYC exchange)
b) pay an exorbitant amount of tax on an amount of crypto you don't actually own. Unsurprisingly, everyone chooses the former.

You can also sign an affidavit saying you've lost the keys but you will be immediately red flagged. If you ever live beyond your means and they get suspicious, they will find out where the money came from and charge you with perjury and actually prosecute to send a message to other crypto traders.

but seriously how shafted am i if they found out about my 80k+ holding in crypto, especially when i havent reported it to Centrelink, etc?

i only pay when i withdraw to bank, right?

>>21438720
>And what happens in exchanges you traded on 3 years ago are closed?
I don't about this. They usually put the burden of proof on the tax payer. Yes it's fucked.

>If you lose a wallet seed
You can claim this but if you suddenly get an influx of money and they notice, You might get fucked.

>If it was gifted
If it's worth a lot of money, Gift tax is a thing.

>>21438784
It's 50% for individuals, and only if you're an australian resident.
https://www.ato.gov.au/General/Capital-gains-tax/Working-out-your-capital-gain-or-loss/Working-out-your-capital-gain/The-discount-method-of-calculating-your-capital-gain/

>>21438770
Be careful anon. Crypto only works because it is a public ledger that will exist forever. They already use analytics programs and computers aren't getting any slower. Even if they don't find out now, they probably will in 5 years after mainstream crypto adoption.
>t. also plans to move to germany but will pay his taxes first

>>21438225
start a company and pay company tax/personal income/dividends to low income earners that you trust

>>21438777
I think so. Fees are usually considered an expense. If you can prove it, You can count it as capital loss.

>>21438640
>now you can register yourself as a business to pay less tax
You seem like a smart anon. Given that I'm only planning on playing with maybe 3k-ish, do you reckon I should go through the hassle of getting myself an ABN?
Or is that other anon saying you need 20k+ turnover to be considered a business right? That seems untrue, but I'm too dumb to know where to look

>>21438733
"Changes to the law on 12 December 2019 may affect your entitlement to claim the main residence exemption on an Australian residential property if you:

are a foreign resident for tax purposes at the time you dispose of your residential property in Australia
inherited it from a foreign resident."

The thing is i won't be moving there for tax, i can be calssed as an actual citizen. So i can say im just moving there because i want to.

>>21438803
You're probably fine. It depends on when you started the payment. Any time since March and asset limits are sky high. So long as you have less than 400k in crypto they don't care.
https://www.servicesaustralia.gov.au/individuals/services/centrelink/jobseeker-payment/how-much-you-can-get/income-and-asset-limits

>>21438858
Resident for tax purposes is very different to regular residency/citizenship. If you plan on leaving Australia for a period greater than 6 months in the year, you will be losing your residency for tax purposes and will be liable to pay CGT prior to departure.
Lots of Aussies living abroad aren't residents for tax purposes but are still citizens, for example.

>>21438803
Centrelink isn't that smart. They only know BTC when I reported that I was investing on it. They considered it a "hobby".

>>21438564
>>21438699
Is there some kind of service that actually keeps track of this? I was planning on just using Coinbase and doing it all manually (and also never trading one crypto for another because that sounded too tricky), but if there's an easier way I'm all in

>>21438640
What's the minimum required cost to set up a business? just like an abn fee?

>>21438897
So what if i say that i only started investing once i was in Europe if they ever asked? say when i was in aus i managed to lose it all or my wallet got hacked into and it just so happened they turned into into monero and sent it off?

>>21438803
If you cashed out of Link into USDT - that is the taxable event - not the FX trade back to AUD
I hope this helps - anyone that has something to lose, and has made above 10K probably should see an accountant
t. not an accountant

>>21438915
500$AUD

>>21438897

Yeah seems like a fuck around. Maybe i'll just get a normal job and get cash sent in the mail and and just put it towards a house or some shit lmfao. Or just pay with cash where ever i can.

>>21438924
why are you trying so hard to commit a crime?

Fellow Aussie here. I use independent reserve to buy BTC / ETH then Xfer it to Binance or Kucoin.

Would recommend VIDT and PNK both show a Fuckload of potential for gains.

>>21438944
Trying hard? lmfao how would that be hard in the slightest?

>>21438910
I think Coinbase manages your taxes themselves and report to the corresponding tax office. They usually have a report on it for you to see. It's when you're trading on a decentralized exchange is when you do it yourself.

>>21438944
Mate this is all figurative talk, of course none of us would be committing these crimes in real life. we are law-abiding citizens!

>>21438954
Isn't this exactly how you get fucking raped on CGT, because the transfer is counted as you cashing out, despite the fact your money is still wrapped up?

Is Orchid a meme to avoid? Someone redpill me on it cause it hasn't been shilled much here so don't know if thats a good or bad thing.

>>21438915
>>21438854
If I were you guys I would remain a sole trader (i.e yourselves). This is for a few reasons:
a) CGT discount. You won't get this as a company and unless you're pulling millions in crypto, you would probably pay more in tax when you cash out and pay "dividends" to yourself than just by acting as an individual. The system was designed this way.
b) It is EXTREMELY hard to get registered as a trading company. Day traders have been trying for decades and they have been closing the loopholes. You would need to have consistent gains spanning years (very hard in crypto), absolutely meticulous records, and represent yourself as a business. And they mean really represent yourself as a business - website, social media, the whole shebang.
Again, they have created the tax system to disincentivise this for a reason and it usually just isn't worth bothering with. You could do some creative accounting by having your plumbing company or whatever invest in crypto """on the side""" but if they think it's a tax scheme they will come after you like bloodhounds and the penalities are always way harsher than potential gains.

Nothing but pure imagination, right guys?

>>21438995
Thanks for the info anon.

>>21438979
Wew. Decentralised markets are good because they let you buy funkier cryptocurrencies or?

>>21438225
another ato thread

with ato shills telling you to pay theft tax

>>21438991
Unironically buy PNK. It is the most revolutionary project in crypto - an oracle network which doesn't require a dedicated oracle setup. People haven't realised how huge the ramifications of this are but they will soon, once people start seeing beyond the pajeet/judge judy memes.

>>21438924
Crypto is a permanent ledger. You just can't really lie about it because every transaction you've ever made is there forever. Just be content with making more money than 99% of any other asset class and pay your tax.

honestly thought it was just "pay tax on what ever you withdraw, we dont care about trades as long as we get out tax money"

>>21439049
Kinda. Most news coins usually get listed first on decentralized exchanges since they usually don't give a fuck. Coinbase has to worry about not getting fucked the law.

A lot of glow niggers itt, I've traded for 2+ years now and never kept track of a single thing. I'm waiting for them to show up but they never will

>>21438225
Ya mum's givin me gobbies ya softcock dogface drongo. Mummy loves you! She said she'll be home soon once she finishes givin me slobby gobby bouncy headdo.

>>21439059
I don't want to pay it either but worrying about getting fucked by the ATO on top of
the worry that comes with tradingg with crypto is just not worth it for me.

>>21439063
Most countries do that but Australia being the cucked country that it is decided to follow the Murican's lead when it comes to crypto.

>>21439085
They will.
It took those faggots 6 years to catch up with me.
I've mostly lost money though, so won't be paying them fuck all.

>>21439063
You can use it to your advantage. If you haven't made much money one tax year, you can uniswap wash your coins to trigger the CGT event to pay less tax, and will be liable for less tax in the future because your cost base is higher. Remember you can claim back uniswap fees and gas fees on your tax.

Alternatively you can give your crypto to a family member in germany and pay CGT on what you give them now. But Germany will probably have a real CGT crypto tax by the time your PNK is worth millions, so I wouldn't bet on it as a sure thing. The system is designed to incentivise tax paying and unless you've sold coke or something clearly illegal to make your money it's always better to just pay.

>>21439108
Honestly thought this whole time as was one of those countries and i've told everyone it is...

Fuck me.

>>21438998
yeah, everything on this website is satire, except when asking for a friend, then it's serious business.

>>21439130
OMG LMFAO I CAN KEEP MAKING SHIT COINS, PUT ETH INTO THEM AND THEN BE LIKE "OH NO THEY LOST ALL THEIR VALUE I LOST ALL MY MONEY TO SHIT COINS"

AHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAH AND THEY WOULDNT BE ABLE TO DO SHIT.

ausfag

for the first time doing my taxes this year there was an opt in to say wether or not i had made gains or losses in the crypto space. I've been in since 2017, but only ever made losses, up until a month ago.

CGT is going to fuck me a bit i think. But we will see. Hopefully the bull run lasts longer than a year and i'll be able to cash out well into the profit.

Thanks for all the guidance in here anons, i'm going to start taking far more care and write down my trades a bit more concisely. Cheers.

>>21438225
Buy OTC

Funds can never be traced back to you

Trade as much as you like and then sell otc

>>21439085
based tax evader

>>21438834
>It's 50% for individuals, and only if you're an australian resident.
Thanks. Of course citizen, not just resident.. not sure why uber pajeets would be browsing biz.

Serious though, can i just make shitcoins and invest, rug pull myself and say "coins worth 0, got nothing to tax"

>>21439378
It's possible. You better figure out a way to cash out though. If they figure it's you, They're coming for that ass.

>>21439232
If you still have records for the capital losses, I think you can declare that to cancel out capital gains and therefore paying tax on it.

>>21439378
how are you planning to cash out if you rugpull yourself. Even if you have a new wallet drain the liquidity you'll eventually have to turn that into fiat.

>>21439470
>>21439535

You can get cash sent in the mail... They charge a 6% fee. So if i cash out 10k then i pay 10.6k in crypto for AUD

I still haven't filed my taxes for 2018-2019 because near the end of the tax year I found out crypto to crypto was a taxable event and I'd spent the btter part of 9 months flipping and day trading shitcoins over like a dozen exchanges, many of which I didn't keep transaction records on. Figured it was better to not file than lie since I know some of the trades would be reported to the ATO by some of the exchanges. Keep in mind we're only talking about 5-10k max profit as I was just fucking around with spare cash at the time while bored at work. Haven't gotten a letter about the fact I haven't filed that year or that I traded crypto, so no clue when it will catch up to me but I'm just procrastinating dealing with it. It's all so tiring considering I never cashed out any of it at all so I never realized any profit in a meaningful way, but our fucking stupid system means every fucking time I sold something even if I only held it for a day before market selling it into another shitcoin is a taxable event, it's impossible to track unless you made detailed records at the time you did it. In the end they'll never accept my laziness of not doing so as an answer and I'll probably get fucking ass raped for having the initiative to try make myself a little richer, but I shouldn't have expected anything different.

>>21439551
Sounds like a decent plan. Go for it. I wanna see how it turns out. Get back to me and I might do it your way too.

>>21439578
I feel for you anon. Just bite the bullet, I reckon. It will catch up to you, and it'll be better if you force it to happen sooner rather than later

>>21439578
Most of my records are in etherscan and I can figure it out from there. Honestly, You're right. It is a pain in the ass. I don't want to do it too. You can probably get an accountant to fix it up for you but you'll have to pay for that. I tried doing taxes for some of my trades and it took ages due to how hard it is to keep track.

>>21439125
>>21439283
I'm just enjoying life until I get that letter/phonecall, then I'm going postal

>>21439643
This all makes crypto feel not even worth it wtf.

I wish i tracked my trades from 2017 to now but liek i said, always thought it was just "pay tax when you withdraw thats it"

What about when something like swipe comes to australia? how will they even know you're using it without ever purchasing anything that requires government involvement?

>>21438961
>>21438980
why are you replying like this? you realise we can see you samefagging

>>21439378
I'm a little bit retarded and pissed (mainly pissed) but what does rug pull yourself mean

>>21439634
>>21439643
It's just so annoying, there is no feasible way I can assess what I should be paying them, hell I did so much trading on so many different exchanges I've forgotten what ones I even used. I went onto Livcoin the other day and found out they don't keep trade history outside of 90 days, so that's gone. I deleted my kucoin account so all my trades on there are gone. Even if I paid an accountant to work it out there would be massive holes everywhere. It's fucked. Can't they just send me a bill for what their software has worked out I owe them? After all they will no doubt compare what I send them to that anyway to work out if I'm lying to them right? Fucking ridiculous man.

>>21439705
I had more to add to what i said but obviously can't fucking edit an already sent comment can it?

>>21439738
Like uniswap, when you ivnest into an unknown crypto that is new, and liquidity is provided by the people to give it value.

Rug pulling is when that value is withdrawn by the person who pooled it into uniswap, thus rendering your crypto you have worthless.

>>21439762
I hope they eventually change the laws to just "pay when you cash and if the crypto you cashed was held for more than a year then only pay tax on half, enjoy your gains anon"

But nope.

>>21438640
im a brainlet but how did you do your tax liability calculation?
where do those numbers come from?

>>21439823
Income tax bracket.

>>21439704
this why just wait until people start dealing in crypto. fuck the ato and their bullshit rate

oi lads so whats the capital gains tax % for under 1 year and over 1 year?

so lets say you buy $1k of link it becomes 10k of Link , u supposedly cash out
you would pay 30% of 10k if its under 1 year in CGT? and only 15% if its over a year?

And why the f wouldn't u just move shit into XMR and wash it??

>>21438291
Ok, so what would happen if I accidentally accepted some pajeet's swap from eth to some obscure shitcoin BUT the pajeet set the coin's price 100 higher than it's supposed to be and I didn't notice? It would be a loss right? And there's no telling what pajeet might do with the eth in other countries.

>>21439934
word. Im never cashing out directly into bank. Im weither getting ash in the mail or paying for something with crypto when it gets accepted.

I'll do that with anything that isn't government-related, if i want a house ill jsut get a normal shitty job with the missus as my partner and get cash and just do extra cash deposits to pay off or some shit, jsut say i won on the pokies, gambling or selling some stuff around the house.

>>21439962
If your capital gains is below $18,000, You don't pay tax. By your example, Your capital gains would be $9,000 which means no tax paid. That's considering you have no other income.

>>21439986
and the pajeet managed to rug pull and leave you with a 10k to 20k loss lmfao - keep .1 eth for liquidity in

>>21440023
Sorry if my writing is fucking shit, just hyped from the government raping us.

>>21440037
Hey it doesn't matter if it's sus as long as there's no proof right? Pajeet could use a local boomer crypto facebook page to sell eth for cash in a foreign country that isn't australia, and then it would be pretty hard to follow the actual cash, wouldn't it?

Pay your taxes you leeching cunts.

>>21438225
Get a real job

>>21440102

Lets theoretically say you make a new wallet and create a contract through that and crypto through that. Then you get funds onto the account through a cash deposit or some other way (maybe a gambling site with a fake email, etc).

Then you list your erc-20 token, lets say 10k of them for idk, 1:1 eth or something? this is all theoritical i defiantly wouldn't do this... :)). And then you buy that pajeet coin for that price, and oh no, you got rugpulled? then all of a sudden the coins are swapped to erc-20 privacy coins again and disappear without a trace to follow.

The 10k you had in crypto is now worth 0, so you just had a 10k tax deductable loss to your crypto, considering it's worth 0 now as the liquidity is gone. OHHHHH NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO how sad :(.

All my gains gone. THIS IS COMPLETELY THEORETICAL AND I'M NOT SAYING ANYONE OF US WOULD BE DOING THIS AND WE ARE ALL LAWFUL CITIZENS, right? right.

>>21440185
I will, dickhead. I just wish it wasn't such a cucked process calculating it. We should only pay taxes when you cash out.

>>21440243
Definitely**

>>21440256
Your fault for not reading the law beforehand and keeping track of your trades. I hope the ATO raids you you leech.

>>21440256

So do we only have to pay our tax once we actually withdraw? or do you need to pay your trades taxes every year even if you don't?

When does capital gains tax apply?

A CGT event occurs when you dispose of any cryptocurrency, such as if you:

>Sell or gift cryptocurrency
>Trade or exchange cryptocurrency for another crypto or fiat currency
>Convert your cryptocurrency to fiat currency (eg Australian dollars)
>Use it to obtain goods or services

If you make a capital gain when you dispose of cryptocurrency, you’ll need to pay tax on some or all of that gain. For example, if you buy cryptocurrency as an investment and then later sell or exchange your digital coins at a higher price that yields a capital gain, you’ll need to pay tax.

However, if you hold your cryptocurrency for more than a year before selling or trading it, you may be entitled to a 50% CGT discount. And even if the market value of your cryptocurrency changes, you won't make a capital gain or loss until you actually dispose of your holdings.

On the other hand, if the proceeds from the disposal of the cryptocurrency are less than what you paid to acquire it initially, you will experience a capital loss. Capital losses can be used to reduce capital gains made in the same financial year or a future year, including investments outside of cryptocurrency.

In other words, don’t sell

>>21440185
Couldn't this scenario work better by just using a somewhat more legit coin? I remember there was a way to do one on one private swaps between eth and erc20 tokens or maybe even between two erc20 tokens. Person 1 would set up the contract that outlines how many of which coin gets sold for how much eth, and person 2 accepts. Except whoooops you forgot to check the decimal point and paid x1000 more eth for the erc20 token than its market value on crypto markets.

>>21440185
>>21440281
How is crypto related to the government in anyway faggot

>>21440288
you need to record every trade as a CGT event yourself (also as proof if you get audited), and report the total capital gains or loss in your tax return

>>21440027
cheers mate and what if you made like 50k in income that year and this 10k was on top as CGT

>>21440357
Mmmm sounds interesting. You could do that.

Mate a crypto is only worth what you are willing to pay, rememebr that.

And if you would pay 10k for it and everyone else only values it at 1 cents... then it was your choice/bad wasn't it, and since no one else values it at that price then who's to say it's worth 10k? and if yo uchange your mind and say you don't value it at that anymore and no one else does, then that will be fact and there is no way to get you for anything other than a major loss.

how do ya cunts even cash out stuff over 10k? eg. you made 25k and u wanna take it off the exchange and into your bank ? would it just go thru smoothly or would some triggers go

>>21440538

cash in the mail, only way i know.

>>21438564
When you make it, hire an accountant. Done.

>>21440538
You will be arrested instantly for breaching covid19 money distancing guidelines. Long arms of the law will materialise from your monitor and put you in handcuffs before the AFP break down your door.

>>21438225
Yeah, buy products that you are comfortable holding for a year or two. Capital gains discount if you hold longer than one year. Fiat will be dead in 2 and government in chaos. Probably forgiving taxes because economy fucked at some stage before then like the US is considering.

>>21440458
Look at your income tax bracket. If you hold the crypto for a year, You only pay tax on the 5,000 capital gains you made.

>>21440538
$25k would definitely ring some alarms, especially if you don't tell your bank in advance that some money would come in.

>>21440671
>>21440734

cheers

lads, 2020 is the year of holding while we can't fuck off
by 2021 this time we should all have heavy gains and fuck off to south east asia and live like kings

>>21438225
australian here, moving to estonia for a better life
take the estonia pill already anon
>no crypto taX
>hot girls
>cheap asf good quality housing
>cheap land to build urself
>internet access literally across entire country its that small
>access to old soviet goods such as AKs

>>21438548
fuck out of my board ATO

>>21438640
>pay $69000 to a government that has done nothing for me or my people, fucks over the country eternally and imports chinks and literal poos

yeah go fuckyourself and die ATO, i know im on your fucking watchlist, you know who i am and i have NEVER paid a cent in taxes to this shithole southern chinese satellite state AND NEVER FUCKING WILL.

>>21440853
>>21440903
Drop those cunts, cunt

>>21438247
> he pays taxes.
ngmi

>>21440826
How many of the locals speak english?

>>21441303
almost 100%

>>21441323

I've been trying to figure out where i'm gonna live before Australia turns into China 2.0. maybe i'll seeya there anon

>>21440826
are there any asians? i love asians

>>21441447
some day anon
>>21441481
No.

A few optimistic people in here. I CBF responding to every retarded thing in here.

I work in Big 4 tax. I deal with the ATO almost daily.

You can be rekt by CGT depending how you look at it. To those saying you only pay on "profit", that's true however you are technically supposed to calculate that "profit" (capital gain) on every trade to find your total CG which is then added to your assessable income.

However, losses can only be deducted from future gains. This means if you make $2,000 capital gain one financial year, don't pay your taxes, then make a $5,000 capital loss the next year and exit the market or whatever else, you will still have to amend and pay taxes on that $2,000 and cannot retroactively apply that subsequent CG loss.

That capital loss will likely only arise if you sell at a loss of course, but keep this in mind.

You can make up your own mind as far as how much of a risk you think it poses not to do things correctly but understand the ATO has invested very heavily in big data analysis to generate risk flags etc to perform strategic audits. We've receive plenty of tax alerts about crypto lately because they are aware of it. The ATO is known internationally as one of the most aggressive tax offices in the world and I expect it to worsen given the enormous budget deficit and the government's desperate need for revenue in the coming years. Personal income taxes are the gov's largest revenue source at ~40% of govt revenue or so, twice as much as corporate taxes. If you're evading, they'll be far worse. They will come for you with GIC, misstatement penalties, penalty rates on restated returns, etc, plus charges.

Also understand if you are audited the burden of proof will then be on you to prove your disclosures despite us being a "self-assessment system". I saw someone the other day suggest just making shit up to the ATO about lost keys. If you can't prove it they can impute a different set of circumstances and reconstruct your return.

>>21441520
What if someone robs my house, steals my ledger with my seedphrase in it?

>>21441520
would the best thing to do be just to hire a legit crypto tax accountant?

>>21441520
On a serious note, what is the best way to go about sorting this all out especially if i don't have access to all histories?

>>21438225
True advice here from an Australian that just did his tax two days ago and has been trading crypto for 3 years.
Pick a good project and hold for more then a year. Your CGT on the sale of that asset will drop by 50%.
Also, buy your coin directly if you can and no swing trading, as every crypto to crypto trade will be taxable and you could end up owing a significant tax obligation without having realised any profit. I say buy directly because I took me around 3 hours to calculate a total of -$220 in losses last year because I kept making small swaps between link, bsv, matic, eth, RSR, done over around 4 different exchanges. Never again. I have purely held my link since March 2019, to keep my tax low if I choose to sell any this year.
Dont try to dodge tax. The second the ATO gets wind that you trade crypto its likely they will audit you. Australia is pretty strict on this stuff and the ATO is out to screw you this year to get their neet bux back.
You can also offset your CGT with capital gains losses from other assets, for example, I could utilise my boomer stock losses to reduce my crypto gains tax. So if you have an under performing asset or coin, consider also selling it when you take profit on one that is doing well as it will allow you to cut your losses and benefit from the loss.

Another point is it's not always just CGT. If you trade a lot and make a lot of money you might be deemed to be carrying on a business, in which case you seriously will need the services of an accountant.

Someone above suggested starting a business. Please understand if you are loding a return as a company then yes you can make deductions for expenses and yes you will pay tax on bottomline profit, however the 50% discount for assets held 12mo< will not apply anymore, which makes sense because again your income is your trade profit and CG is something you add to assessable income etc. You'll simply pay the company tax rate on overall profit and that will affect the tax effectiveness.

>>21441637
Then they'd probably ask for receipts of purchase and police reports as a starting point. As far as what happens on the tax side if you prove it, it is likely to be some involuntary disposal. I'm no expert on that but you'd get a loss which you can deduct against capital gains in the future for it.

>>21441672
I'd recommend it.

There are services (e.g. Koinly, CryptoTax or whatever they're called) that can help you interpret the data output from your exchange as a start. I'd see if you can use them to get a picture of your gains and losses then get a good accountant to sign it and lodge for you. They can help you determine if you've been carrying on a business etc and how to be tax effective.

>>21441690
See answer above.

>>21441690
I use cointracker.io
They will try to get you to pay for the service of calculating your loss/gain, but it is fairly easy to do yourself with a chunk of time and a lot of maths. You can link nearly any exchange and it will document your trade history and transfer history and calculate for you how much you made/lost in each trade along the way. You just go through and add it all together for the year.
Mine was only really difficult as I had around 800 trades in 2018-2019, plus I had received a lot of the free coinbase crypto and had been swing trading it. This years tax took me all of 2 minutes to calculate a loss of -0.21 for the year, as I have made almost no trades and only held link.

>>21440281

> you gotta keep up to date whenever we move the goalposts, goy.

>>21440240
>be student
>have job (3 actually)
>hours in primary job get cut bigtime because covid
>now i receive jobkeeper
suck my fucking nuts - how is that not a real job?

>>21441520
If I buy 200 link at $15, and then a month later 100 at $17 and then sell 240 link six months later at $25 how do they calculate my profit?
Buy
$3000
$1700

Sell = $6000

Still holding 60 link.

What is my actual profit?

>>21442748
Well your DCA is $15.67. If you bought link directly from an exchange with AUD and have kept it there.
CGT would be $671.76. You would get $5328.24 back and $1567.44 would be profit.
((240*25)-(((240*25)-(240*15.67))*0.3))
Remember though, If you transfered it (eth fee's) you can claim those as losses and would need to factor it in. Also if you bought eth/btc then traded for link, you will need to make sure that you didnt make losses or gains due to price fluctuations in those assets prior to changing into link.

>>21443140
When you get to your accountant though, you just give them the numbers you gave me and they will work all this out exactly. I just went with a generic 30% tax rate.
You could also put my calculation into an excel sheet and change to 240 to number of link sold, and 25 to link price on sale. That way you will be able to easily get a decent idea of you CGT based on your estimated sales (for example when link is $1000 etc.

>>21443140
Thanks mate. Fucking just learnt about DCA. Figured it would be some kind of average but didn’t know the math. So any idea what coin should I buy then? Is xrp going anywhere? Looking for x50 - x100 return over 12-18 months.

Figured I'd give cointracker.io a go, apparently kucoin doesn't have my trade history anymore? What kind of shit exchange just loses your trade history entirely? Seriously how the fuck do they expect us to have an accurate tax assessment when half the exchanges are pieces of shit?

>>21443585
Wonder how the ATO will like me sending them this screenshot of kucoin just deleting all their old trade history.

>>21443525
I can only give my honest advice here, and it may be biased due to how the investment has gone for me.
The only crypto I hold now is chainlink. Started buying in August 2018, messed around with a range of other cryptos but nothing that I thought would actually do well. Currently have around $180k's worth with a DCA of $1.05.
To give perspective if I think you should invest in it, if it hits $20 (USD) in the next few days I will be selling 20% of my stack to take profit for the first time and because I have held for over a year.
I wont be selling again until 20% at $50, 20% at $80, 20% at $100 and 20% to stake indefinitely.
If I was in your position I would likely still buy chainlink and I would just hold it until 2023.
The only other cryptos I regret not investing in is BTC at 3k back in December 2018 and ETH at $220. Would have both been good investments, but at that stage I was still putting all my on hand money into link trying to get to 10k.

>>21443585
Its unfortunate but you should be alright. Means ATO also cant check there, but you can look up historical prices. I had to do that fro huboi as I couldn't get it to work properly last year. As long as you are above board with anything and try to do the right thing you will be fine. Just find the historical price that your asset was prior to transferring to ku-coin and the price when you transferred out, treat that as a crypto->crypto trade and pay tax on it. Worst thing that will happen is you will probably pay a little more tax then you need to and if the ATO audits you and manages to find the trades, they will let you know how much you owe.

>>21444006
Oh, because your Australian ill let you know this as well. Most of the XRP stuff you see on here is just people taking the piss trying to get new people to buy it instead of link. That's why you see it shilled so often in link threads. I myself have made around 4-5 posts today encouraging people to buy it but I honestly know very little about it.
Take everything you read on biz with a grain of salt. It is a toxic environment and nearly everyone is out to screw you in some way, but there is the occasional diamond hidden in the muck.
I would advise you to read this: link.smartcontract.com whitepaper

If you can't be bothered, invest in whatever you think is best.

>>21444006
I mean you could do that with chainlink which is reaching euphoria stage right now with niggers starting to shill or you could do it with monero which is primed to repeat 2016 and is basically the safest long term hold in crypto. Or both. But yeah these tax laws really favour xmr.

>>21444006
This is sound advice to me. Unfortunately like OP I have limited money to invest and looking for that golden ticket. 50-100x is not unheard of I realise it is a pipe dream. After speaking in person to folks that have really made it and then lost it all it seems that they lacked a goal/didn’t have a plan so never really took any profits, just fucked around and now have serious concerns about the ATO catching up with them because of the trades they made during that timeframe. Not having a plan screwed me years ago in the stock market where I saw 20x growth in eleven months on one purchase and watched it evaporate overnight on a government legislation decision that tanked the stock. Was waiting for that +12 month to cash out. Again it was a small investment so no big deal.

>>21444665
I can't help much then unfortunately. The only real crypto investment I have made has only been a x25 for me so far.

>>21439172
>posting this instead of remembering it for later
>ATO already knows you trade crypto because of the independent reserve alerts now
>also spending welfare money on investments
you're gonna get the cunts down your arse pretty soon dumbcunt
i bet you smoke menthols you fucking bankstown fuck