/biz/ - Business & Finance

YASSSS buy imaginary shitcoins and get into a stock bubbles, DO NOT I repeat DO NOT invest into actual goods that people actually need such as oil. Especially not when it's cheap, at least wait until it's expensive

>>18404497

lols at OPEC (namely KSA) begging for everyone to cut production after they started this bullshit which Trump is having none of it, he literally committed to do nothing as he convinced the prince of the desert that the market itself would narrow down US produce. Also extra points on him for helping out the Mexicans w/ KSA trying to bully them into complying into their shit, now Mexico will lessen its hit and the US won’t even notice the 250k difference and at the same time, both nations will benefit from Mexico’s notorious oil hedge that prince al-bin-camel is losing his nuts over

most prob KSA was just throwing Mexico under the barrel just as an excuse to pull out from the deal and continue their BS

>>18404472
How short OPEC OP?

>>18404553
SCO, DTO, DWT etfs

So will prices ever go up? If so, when?

>>18404636
Doubt it heavily, IMO. Everyday new oil patches are being discovered, cars are becoming less fuel inefficient, new countries are beginning to produce their own oil instead of importing.

>>18404651
Interesting because the idea of going long on oil stonks right now such as XOM has been kind of popular here and on other forums.

I would've expected a return to 'normal' prices by end of year.

>>18404472
Short on oil and wants us to pump his bags

>>18404497
Long on oil and wants us to pump his bags

You can now discard 90% of the other threads on biz, which follow a similar pattern

>>18404697
Now tell me what you, the rational thinker on /biz/, would do

>>18404697
>twenty neets on 4chan putting their weekly allowance will pump fucking exxon

>>18404472
lmao, a barrel of oil at 2$?

gotta be a troll.


The truth is, that the United States will never allow the price of oil to stay that low. The more expensive oil is, the better for the US. Why do you think Trump is jawboning to try to raise the prices? Because he wants to help shale? Lmao

Its because the petrodollar is what keeps US industry competitive and US banks on top.

>>18406009
you seem wise. how long do you reckon the prices stay this low?

>>18406009
>Because he wants to help shale? Lmao
Why is US oil production so costly relative to other oil producers? Shale requires such a high per barrel price to break even; is this an issue of regulations, mismanagement, scaling, etc.?

>>18406073
Below a certain price it takes more energy to produce a barrel of oil than you get out of the ground, making it not worth the cost of production. The cheapest and easiest fields to develop have already been tapped out, new production is from more marginal fields that require more advanced techniques to extract oil from.

>>18406009
This. Not to mention an empty barrel costs more than $2

>>18406056
not very long in the grand scheme of things. Prices wont recover until the economy comes back, and the economy wont come back til prices recover... so its hard to say. My gut (the one that knows nothing ever changes, and the bad guys always win) tells me it'll recover in the next year. Then again, its possible that this whole oil price fall is a stealth policy of encirclement of Russia. We've been pretty aggressive w Russia lately (sanctions, ukraine) and it just might be that this is how we destroy them. Sad thing is it will also hurt our allies, the Saudis. Oh no!.

>>18406073
Shale is expensive just because all the cheap shit has already been extracted. Before fracking technology is was even more expensive to extract, and that's why we didnt. Fuck, people were so insane back then they actually developed the tar sands in anwar. (the tar sands are a huge joke. To extract the oil they literally fill abunch of oily dirt into big trucks that burn a fuckton of gas, then drive it to a processing plant. Oil sands are a meme, cost of production is like $75/barrell

>>18404472

there is always the posibility of war to fix the price of oil

>>18404497
>don't buy gold or silver goyim
>keep buying my shitty worthless wall street paper
> - t. buffet

>>18406009

petrodollar is a meme for retards

oil trade is not even 10% of all trade in the world

>>18406140
The key player is obviously Saudi Arabia.

Basically, Saudi arabia is a client-state of the United States. We support the regime with weapons and oil extraction technology, and in return the House of Saud is able to remain a monarchy in the age of democracy.

The Saudi's have been running out of money lately. In the last few years they started running government deficits because they ramped up spending on local gibmedats (bread and circuses so the Sauds could keep their power). So their sovereign wealth fund needed to sell some assets to generate cash to pay bills. The US didn't want them to sell their US treasurys though, because we are having enough trouble selling them ourselves; if another lot of them was dumped on the market, we'd have to raise rates to sell them. (this is coincidentally, the same reason that the Fed is lending $ to other countries w swap lines. If you lend them the dollars, then they dont have to sell their US bonds to get dollars and crash bonds.) So the US investment banks found a new way for SA to raise cash: sell 5% of saudi aramco, which is a huge deal. The Saudi's initially nationalized the oil company and stole it from the anglo americans.... now they're selling a piece of it back. For shame, Saudi Arabia, to fall this low.

The best part about it is that SA;s cash hoard is already earmarked. They have agreed to spend like 2 trillion in infrastructure to create a new modern city, called Neom. They will use the 2 trillion to pay US multinationals to build that city, thus paying back their masters.

>>18404472
thanks, I just went long on oil price

>>18406185
just because retards spout "petrodollar" without understanding it, does not mean petrodollar is a meme.

The petrodollar is not important because it forces people to transfer their assets into dollars before buying it. This does add a bid for dollars, it encourages foreign CBs to hold dollar reserves to pay for future expected oil purchases, but that is not the most important aspect of the petrodollar system.

The most important thing is the power to price oil, regardless of what currency it is in. If the US and its allies can ensure that its enemies only have access to oil at higher prices, then the US coalition will ALWAYS be more efficient at producing energy intensive industrial goods. These businesses have razor thin margins already. Oil is more expensive in UK than in US. In EU than in UK. In China than in EU. There is a global pecking order where the most favored nations get the cheapest energy, and thus have more competitive industry.

The second pillar of the petrodollar is banking. Basically, the reason it is good for the US to have a high oil price (besides the fact that we also produce lots of oil) is that the more expensive oil is, the more dollars flow into Saudi Arabias coffers, the more dollars they deposit at the Chase bank. This constantly liquifies the balance sheets of US banks and makes them have a liquidity advantage, which ensures they are the most competitive banks.

>>18406209
US is going to pass a bill to remove troops from Saudi if they dont cut back production

Saudi's will then sell oil in other currencies and a new war will begin, check it

>>18404472
people have been saying the exact same thing since the 80s lmao

>>18404472
nice just bought 100k barrels.

>>18406269
Lmao.

You realize that Lockheed and GD and Raytheon weapons all come with a kill-switch backdoor?

Even if the US troops withdrew, we could re-takeover Saudi Arabia in a second.

The fact that trump is threatening this is only more evidence that Saudi Arabia is being extorted as a vassal state.

>>18404689
Go long on natural gas, not oil. Wait for the virus bullshit to blow over, then we will eat through stockpiles of oil, then price will go up

>>18406437
I know, thats what I was saying. Saudi's are stupid and now they are being pushed and will realize theyre just a satellite state, theyre going to piss off the US and it will end up exactly like the Iraq war

>>18406256
You sound like a pseudoinellectual nigger, the US isnt determining the orice at all, dipshit, and it is Europe's fault for not developing their unconventional plays and being fags about oil thats why their price is high.
Funfact, there is an oil shale formation that has between a few hundred million and a couple billion barrels recoverable under the paris region.
Guess who is too faggy to get it, and would rather give their wealth to shitholes like Algeria, so they dont have to get their soft little hands dirty?

>>18404472
>As discovery's of oil patches ramp up

You have no idea what you are talking about.

>>18406558
Please explain.

>>18406551
you write as if France has a choice in the matter. There are huge shale deposits allover the world, but the only ones that have been really developed so far have been in the US. Do you really think that's because the French dont like money?

You sound naive.

>>18404651
>less fuel inefficient
What an awkward phrase. “More fuel efficient” is the way to say this, ESL friend.

>>18404651
>Everyday new oil patches are being discovered

Nobody is paying for exploration at these prices.

>>18404472
>At the same time, major bills are coming due. North American oil exploration and production companies have $86 billion in debt that will mature between 2020 and 2024, and pipeline companies have an additional $123 billion in debt coming due over the same period, according to Moody’s.
>https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/20/business/energy-environment/coronavirus-oil-companies-debt.html

you're an idiot if you think we won't take drastic measures to boost the price of oil. it won't be in the form an obvious war. it will be covert operations or even covert training of proxies to attack extraction sites.

>>18406558

really, small and historically ususable sources can now be harvested because we are entering the Smart Economy era. local production and ressource management will become more effective because of global trade incertainty. there will be a lot of opportunities but most of us will stay indoor doing nothing.

>>18404651
Are you an idiot? Do you not understand a thing called the cost of production? People aren’t working, plants are closed etc so nobody needs oil now, once everyone opens back up the oversupply will be sorted in a few months then that shit will be back to 40-50 a barrel. How can anyone think this shit will hit $2 a barrel and stay there, Jesus some of you fuckers are dumb

>>18407134
Ah meant $2 a gallon ;__;

sry fren.

>>18407134
>Dude just have like tesla robots do the work like lmao upvote him to POTUS, wtf I love science
Until nuclear energy is allowed be widely used and not shilled against by all other energy sources, oil will remain king. Looks like many here think it will just shrivel.

>>18404533
It'd be nice to have the kingdom of Saud go back to riding camels in the desert AND have Mexico achieve economic and political stability.

>>18406551
They just don't think digging up Paris is worth the cost of the oil production.

>>18406750
America is also uniquely positioned w/regard to geography, topology, climate, demographics, legislation, and credit to exploit shale in a way that nowhere else is. Take the Peter Zeihan pill, fren.

>>18407920
RIVERS AND FARMS BITCH!

Whats your guys nat gas and energy positions that are going to benefit from this deal if it goes through?

>>18404472
Don’t you think every state is looking at that 1.59 gas saying shit these goys were fine paying 3.00, jack those gas taxes up!

>>18408886
Kinda of. In Commiefornia, state representatives in the legislature where arguing for hiking the gas tax based on the environmental disaster that cheap gas is going to cause if it stays at those price.

They basically wanted to fix gas prices.

>>18408842
Just USO. I have no confidence that this will affect oil positively for more than a day, if that and not just an hour. Likely prices and companies fall on Monday so betting short short term and long term (least for a while until more news). Oil will fall more, a lot more. Speculative prices will come down, and the pumps on these oil companies will begin to transition to massive sell offs as basically every opportunity for help recently has been shirked or given the most minimal token possible.

>>18409034
Should I take my gains and run? I have no more powder.

All In APA.

>>18408842
FRO and tankers bc no matter what the world will run out of land storage

>>18404636
Monday

>>18409051
It’s going lower guaranteed. Take them and run and maybe buy back in a month when it hits the bottom.