/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>1761988
Because it was a given.

Do you need someone to hold your hand big guy? By 16-18 you're a grown man. You have hair on your ballsack, so why can't you figure out how you want to live your life?

You're just a lazy moron who played world of warcraft or whatever game. The normal people actually built their futures and realized that magic doesn't happen, what you do now is what you'll do in 5 years.

You can go back to college. You can establish your own enterprise. You can develop a plethora of skills, starting with simple fucking licence like a excavator operator. Taking exams that a literal chimp woul pass.

>>1761988
because 26 is still ridiculously young.

most people switch careers entirely several times even if they went to college. Most people go bankrupt and have to start over. Most people don't start to seriously make money until they're well into their 40's.

nothing you do at your age matters much financially.

>>1761991
This.


What you don't realize OP is that everyone tells us from like 5th grade and on that we need to take responsibility and work hard.

By the time you're a freshman in highschool you have people helping you plan your life (that counseling and career center you refused to visit because you had a few dank memes to look at and a few raids to grind in World of NeetCraft after school).
>why didnt anyone tell me I had to be responsible
It's nobody's fault but your own that you didn't acknowledge the legions of adults who were literally paid to give you advice for free - all you had to do was pull your head out of your ass and take your hand off your dick just a little bit.


Enjoy being a lonely, no motivation faggot that wasted his youth and will let that wasted youth eat away at his life until he dies, alone and cold.

You fucked up anon.

>>1762037
>Enjoy being a lonely, no motivation faggot that wasted his youth and will let that wasted youth eat away at his life until he dies, alone and cold.

>implying he can't go to college now
>implying he can't get into the air force now

>>1762037
this.

Everyone told you to work hard, your parents - your teachers - the school counselors - it was all over every form of media. you can't turn around and now say "Why didn't people just force me to do the right thing! :(" as if you would have listened.

I know your pain.

But you know, I finished uni at 30. So you can still change things around.
And when I was 31 I realized it's better to become a memetrepeneur and I wondered why nobody told me about that option before.

If I were you I'd study IT, so you can get a proper job and easily start things at the side.

In my opinion, people really have three good decades to set themselves up. And drifting through them have increasingly bad consequences.

20s- half of these years, you should be in school. The other half should be to set up a career. Drifting in this stage really has the lowest consequences, but you will "feel a bit behind"

30s - This is when you should be making better money and investing diligently. Drifting through this decade is more serious and you will see the start of irreparable consequences.

40s - This is when you should be at the top of your game and consolidating your life plan. It's a decade of paying off debts, restructuring investments and preparing for the downswing in energy and potential in your 50s. The consequences of drifting through this decade is large and irreparable. Unless a large amount of luck comes your way, you'll probably go into retirement very poor.

So, in short, if you're in your mid-twenties, there's lots of time to establish things. But the clock waits for no one, so get cracking.

Hope that helps

>>1761988
Mostly what >>1761991 said. Sorry, OP. Honestly though, you can plan what you want to do but you'll more than likely end up doing something completely different. I wasted my degree on creative writing with a media minor, hoping to do something in entertainment. Now I'm working as an email marketing developer making about $50k~ a year. A lot of it is just pure chance, I hate to say.

College sucks to be considered for anything you just have to do it.

>>1762056

Did you not go into work and just become a memetrepeneur? How'd ya do it

>>1761988

That's not true, you just have not seen the light yet.

I got into a trade at 27 and turned everything around.

You just gotta find something lucrative, beg your way in, then work your ass off, then leverage your abilities (including jumping ship to a better job)

you can do it.

>>1762053
>>1762037
This isn't spot-on desu. The people you are talking about didn't actually just say you need to work hard, they propagate this idea that to be anything you have to go to university, and that any university degree is worth doing, when in fact these days probably 90% of degrees are absolute bullshit and not worth the paper they are written on nevermind $50,000+.

What these people should be encouraging people to do when they leave school is WORK. And if you really want to go to university, do your research about what skills your degree will actually equip you with.

People jumping into degrees at 17/18 without a clue about how the world works is how people like OP are created.

I know that feel OP.

Except in my case, I only wanted to do one thing and one thing only, draw. I wasn't exactly sure what I wanted to do with drawing however. In highschool, I just wanted to draw fun characters and come up with fun stories, so I thought what I wanted to do was draw comics or do something with animation.

I didn't go to a traditional college, I ended going to a trade school for drawing comics/cartoons which had the promise of making connections with the industry. Unfortunately a lot of the people who went to this school were much older than me, like mid-late 20s, who had more drawing experience under their belt, and/or probably went to college, while I went to this school right out of high school.

We had portfolio interviews with editors from studios like DC Comics or Marvel, and some of my older classmates were handed business cards and contacted right after graduation to draw comics for them. My reviews were basically "you're good, but need to hone your skills more"
While, I improved a shitload at this school, I wasn't considered "industry" standard. It kinda sucks when your go to school for three years and are told near graduation that you need to practice more. Sometimes I wish I could go back to school so I can have the excuse to draw with all the time in the world.

After graduation I went back home to my parents, and they're wondering why I haven't gotten a job through my school. I can't get the job I want without practicing more, but practicing more means sitting at home for hours which was frowned upon by my parents.

Thankfully 3 years after graduating, an alumni was able to get me a job at a game company that just required my skills in photoshop. While I finally got a good paying job, it was 9-5 with an hour commute and it made it hard to find time to draw so I can one day get the job I want. Now 3.5 years later I have been laid off, so now it's finding a new job again.

>>1762078
TL;DR version. My only skill is drawing, but I'm not good enough for the jobs I was trained to do and now I don't know where to go. To get the job I want, I need to practice a lot to get good, but I feel like I have no time to do that because I need to make an income. Unfortunately I have no other skills besides drawing.

Consider getting into a trade. I started a union electrical apprenticeship at 22. I'm 24 now, making $40k, and in a few years I'll be at $80k+. Like you, I also live at home still and don't do much outside of work besides video games. You're not that unique and certainly not as "stuck" as you could be.

>>1762082
what does your art style look like?

>>1761994

this. u can always learn a trade or get some IT certs

kill urself

>>1761988
save up 5k, 100x leverage btc
if fail: claim bankruptcy, save 5k and repeat
if win: congrats you have tens of thousands of dollars please repeat process until u have a house

>>1761988
dont be too hard on yourself op it doesn't help
best case scenario for people in their 20s is they are working a full week at a career they dont hate, living somewhere cheap enough to save for a deposit on a house, getting to save most of their money but still enjoying life

OP your situation wasn't intrinsically conducive to you finding your feet early, simple as that

Some people know what they need at 7, some people only figure it out when they're 70

Some people die before they find their path

All you can do is seek truth at all times and never be satisfied, then trust in the idea that just needing those things will guide you to fulfillment. Who gives a fuck about the nature of that fulfillment because this life is a stupid fucking game anyway

Fuck everybody else's standards and be a selfish prick, it's the only way

I turn 21 next month and I don't know what to do, I don't want to go back to working in retail and I thought about joining the Navy but I just can't do that stuff. I don't have the money for college and even if I did, it seems like a very bad time to go to college and most of the degrees are worthless anyway. So basically I'm fucking stuck, and my only real options are to work at Wal-Mart for the next 10 years while I scrape by community college part-time so I can get a fucking associate's degree which MIGHT get me a 5% raise, and get shit on by all the smug assholes who had their university paid for by their parents. I might try /r9k/

>>1762075
That is such a fucking meme jesus.

All throughout school I was told to pick one of the following: Go to College (work hard for those internships and GPA, get good money in the future), Go into the Military (Instant career that can usually be continued for life, and also serves and an amazing resume builder), Go to a school to learn a Trade (always a market, always room to grow), or finally to just think up my million dollar idea and entrepreneur it
EVERYONE knows these are the options, if you think the only reason you wasted 80k on a lib arts degree was that a teacher told you to, you have WAY more problems than bad teachers

>>1762078
What school did you go to?

>>1762174
This.

It's just an excuse to find someone to blame. EVERYONE said work hard, no matter what you do.

And besides, even if they did. Do you not have a head on your shoulders? couldn't stop for a second to think "Hey how will this $80,000 investment in the Performing Arts pay off for me?

What are my future career prospects?

Do I NEED this degree?

Does it improve my life?

What will the future hold for me with this degree?

What will I have with this degree that I won't have with another option?

What is my opportunity cost?

What are the results of my current actions. What will occur 4 years from now if I pursue my choice? How about if I pursue a different choice?"

Like are you HONESTLY going to tell me you spent FOUR YEARS DOING SOMETHING, THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS and didn't yourself the simple question: "Why?"

You cannot tell me that's anyone's fault except oneselfes.

>>1762185
To be fair this kind of thinking isn't really encouraged so much as to just getting in to college and figuring it out along the way, which is retarded

>>1762265
Even if it isn't you should still have a brain.

To not question what your arts degree will be for is just so insanely irresponsible I don't know how people even breathe.

>>1762111
What a dumbfuck

>>1761988
Heres a secret, tard. The prerequisites on job applications do not always apply unless youre applying to a serious job that requires a real degree (STEM subjects/vocational degrees).

>>1761988

trade school

don't get memed, sonny

>>1762274
Oh yeah I agree with what you're saying. But most kids are expected to go to college immediately no matter what they study, even if they just "pick something." I don't know what OP's situation was, but considering the huge culture and pressure surrounding college and university, I can understand why he feels the way he does

>>1762174
>>1762185
>>1762265

Exactly. NOTHING is encouraged except going to university. At least, that is my honest experience. I never heard anyone talk about trades unless it was to say that trades were for people too dumb for university. I'm not saying that this is the only reason that people waste money on stupid fuckin degrees but it is a big problem.

>>1762311
2nd-ed, i'm gonna be making 17 hr next month which I can turn into a house, some education and some savings. America still kinda works yo!

https://www.zarfund.com/ref/726b10b6d7/register

>>1762265
>this thinking isn't encouraged
Are you fucking retarded? From kindergarten and on we get the concept of "work hard", do you think that just means going with the wind and doing whatever the fuck you want whenever you want?

No. They taught you to plan, to study before a test and do your homework so you get a good score. Grow some hair on your balls and realize that being an adult is just scaling that up to bigger projects than just getting a good homework grade.

>>1763004
See
>>1762174


Everyone knows there are other options than University. Even though I was in GT/advanced/AP classes all my life it was still pretty fucking clear that you either get a trade, get a degree, join the military, or work a shitty highschool diploma job and hate yourself.

Stop blaming laziness on anything that is not yourself.

>>1763004
>no one encouraged me to do anything
everything is everyone else's fault right?

>>1763013
Not everyone's an ubermensch anon, with no genuine encouragement and empty platitudes from those around you, most won't aspire to much.

>>1763022
Maybe some people were never meant to be much.

Maybe we're not equal.

>>1763004
>trades being for the dumbies
No offense to any trade workers out there, but that is essentially true. You only go into a trade if you think you won't be able to suceed in school (I;e - getting scholarships so you don't go into debt, keeping a 3.0< GPA, and working internships)

It isn't a BAD choice, but people recognize it isn't necessarily the BEST choice - which is arguably going to Uni so you can get a higher paying career.

All that being said, getting a trade is an awesome career path if you don't want to go through higher-ed - WHICH ISNT FOR EVERYONE

Tl;dr - You're the stupid one for not looking into things for yourself.

>>1763024
By much, I mean a reasonable 9-5 white collar job anon.
Think back on your life and ask yourself did you get any encouragement from anyone of note?
A parent? Maybe a close friend?
Not everyone has that, and if you didn't and still made it, you probably deserve a medal.
Not a participation medal either, a genuine endorsement of fortitude.

>>1763025
>the degree scam should be allowed to continue because 17 year old kids trust their teachers and parents

>>1763037
Are you trying to seem retarded?

Teachers push the university deal because if you put the effort into doing well, the rewards are FAR higher than anything else.

If you are that gullible at 17 to not think ANYTHING about your future post-high school, then you deserve to be poor.

Like me and the other anon have said multiple times, if you have hair on your balls you should be able to start doing a little planning.

>>1763037
>i sleep in class and never bothered to go to school counselor for advice, but it's not muh fault!!!

>>1763045
>tfw extreme narcolepsy
>wow dude just don't sleep in class lol
delet

>>1763044
This is such BULLSHIT. Teachers literally tell kids that getting a BA in Fine Art is a smarter decision than learning a trade.

>>1763055
$250,000 in the hole later and you wont be qualified to clean toilets LMAO

>>1763055
Never heard that once in my life

>>1763058
Where on Earth would you rack up $250k?

Get better bait anon

>>1761988
At this point bernie sanders getting elected and getting lucky with cryptocurrency is your only chance

>>1763045
>Implying my school counselor actually gave two shits

>>1762125
This.

I am currently on a similar boat. I would love to go to a decent college for a useful engineering degree but I absolutely won't if it means going into 50k+ of debt and not being able to take a breath of fresh air or start a business because your loan payment is due..

Ideally I want to be a memetrepreneur.

>>1761988
Jesus christ...these feels right now. Im right here with you bro you are not alone. How much debt do you have?

>>1761988
>deep deep shit
lol?
just cause you're not some wunderkind 23 year old millionaire doesn't mean shit

>>1762125

dude...

trade. fucking. school.

it's typically extremely affordable

>>1763123

you too, fucko

go to trade school

>>1762311
>>1763205
>>1763206
Do NOT listen to this man. He is your ENEMY. I'm willing to believe they don't even PRACTICE trading in these so called "trade" schools.

>>1763246

Look at this cuck who doesn't know what tradeschool is

I hope your just memeing and aren't actually so detached from reality that you think the economy is just people sitting on their asses moving 1s and 0s around to different computers

>>1763261
What, the "don't even practice trading" part didn't make it clear enough?

>>1761988

Dig in and prepare for a long frustrating ride; you're not alone. Chalk it up to crappy direction from disconnected parents, your own naivete, over paid counselors. Find a way or make one.

>>1761988
Crappy full of shit mentors

>>1762064
>50s. The consequences of drifting through this decade is large and irreparable. Unless a large amount of luck comes your way, you'll probably go into retirement very poor

Wait, how the fuck does that work? I mean if I learn a new skill or fail to get a promotion at that age, then it will have a much smaller impact on my total lifetime income than if I'm slow in my twenties.

>>1762073
>then leverage your abilities
How do you do that?

>>1761988
I'm afraid I'm going down the same road as you. I'm 20 and I already switched majors twice, and will do it a third time this year (from ComSci to Economics + PolSci). I hope I can finish it this time bacause I've already wasted three years of my life.

I always thought I knew exactly what I wanted to be when I was a teenager, but when I started studying ComSci I found out it's not what I expected.

My family has a business and basically every single family member works there and earns a lot of money, but I "wanted to go my own way" and ended up getting fucked.

>>1763345
There's more to life than just learning new skills

He's saying you have to have a certain amount of prep work done by your 60's or you'll be so old you'll hate life when you either retire poor or work till death

How do I figure out what I want to do anyway. I don't want to get a degree and end up not liking my profession or being unsatisfied with it

>>1763345
If you fuck around until you're 50 years old, you'll almost never catch up. How is this hard to understand?

Start your own business

Sit the fuck down
grab a pen and paper
think of an idea

Do this everyday until you come up with a decent business idea. Fuck college, fuck minimum wage, and fuck working for other people. Come up with a brilliant idea and then collect royalties. Rinse and repeat.

>>1761988
Start selling drugs or smoking cock op

>>1763357
>ComSci I found out it's not what I expected.
What do you mean?

>>1762010
>nothing you do at your age matters much financially

i somewhat agree with that but you still have to pull up your sleeves and gather skills, no matter what

>>1763675

he wanted video games but got C++

I'm in a similar situation, OP; after dropping out of school as a failed animation major, I'm now about to get my AA and going to get a BA in Technical Communication. I also plan on doing a double major, but I'm not sure what the other major will be. I'm already over $20,000 in debt so I'm scared I'm making another bad decision, but I have to move on with my life somehow.

>>1762082
Furry porn
I'm only half joking desu

College is a gamble, but it pays off if you are lucky. The trades are a solid option when you are young, but they take a toll on your body.

IMO there is a 3rd option; working your way up in a kitchen. I am talking about real kitchens, not fast food.

>places are always desperate for people and will train someone who is motivated. The whole "apply in person and give a firm handshake" meme still works
>so few people give a shit so moving up to kitchen manager is doable in 2-3 years.
>you can get the drug and pussy filled haze of the college experience all while learning new skills and making money
>there are some lucrative endgames like executive chef, food sales rep, starting your own restaurant
>girls love a guy who can cook

The pay and the hours do suck, but a good cook will never be out of work for long.

>>1763347

>get good at something
>start talking to everyone in that industry, all the owners, employees, etc..
>find out where the most money can be made
>jump ship to that place
>do all this behind your employers back

>>1763592

Is this really Barron Trump's art?

Kid is more glorious every single day.

>>1761991
Even that's not an excuse. I played Everquest 40 hours a week during high school and switched it to WoW during college. I still got great grades in a major that I picked based on the large amount of well paying job opportunities I knew it would offer (accounting).

There is no excuse for claiming you didn't know it's important to have your shit together, I know 8 year olds who already know they'll need a good job when they grow up

>>1763330
Best advice in this thread.

>>1761988
It was over since day one. You'll never be the chad that fucked all the prime girls during HS, why bother?

All those college cucks that get the leftovers and marry them while wagecucking have it even worse.

Prime aged girls will never look at you with desire. It was over since day one. Moneycoping and careercoping is cringe.

I was "warned" by father around early 20s if I dont get my act together I'm going to lead a shitty life

Honestly I could care less, old fucks can't relate to men in their 20s/30s, there's no job security or loyalty, employers will kick you to the street if they get a call from some commie faggot claiming you're a "racist"

Haha no thanks, you small few who put in the effort and are reaping some reward, realize itll be short lived and ur wife will cuck/divorce you

>>1763668
Have you done this?

>>1764935
(Steven Bauer in Scarface voice)
Look at those titties

>tfw studied history

Comfiest major for aspiring hobos. At least the library's warm, lads.

>>1765157
Whoops, forgot my face

Here's something my loving father told me when I was young and all through my youth: everything in life is sales. Whether you're selling your labor, your knowledge, or ad space on a website that gives away free money, you are really not doing anything but sales.

Fucks sake OP, we have the Internet now. Spend a year figuring out how to set up a drop ship or a content driven blog and sell chink shit or ads.

How anyone with ample free time ad internet access can't leverage those to make money these days just blows my mind tb,h

>>1761988
Just keep it up. Maybe go back to a trade school or get a factory job making 12 or 14 bucks. Overtime helps to get cash to move out.

Life can be a bitch anon.

I dropped out of 2 junior colleges and am 31. Make $18.50 with about 10 hours of overtime a week.

No point stressing about it now anon. Just buckle up and work towards better income unfucking yourself.

Been in debt simce i was 15 and finally realising that debt can be good if u do it right.

Not sure wtf to tell you on the gf thing.

Been married near half my life. I do remember that having balls helped in school. U old enough, hit up some drunk bitches at the bar. As long as they arent slobbering drunk snatch one up. Most of the time its why they are there.

Good luck anon.

Make a plan for later but dont let it eat at you. Or you will wind up checking into a mental health facility like half my friends...

>>1761994
I liscense to run a hoe?

Wtf.

My boss sent a guy home for showing uo late and said get in the cat 345.

And i was a hoe operator for a year...

>>1762125
Nah man. Just shootbfor a much needed trade like hvac or welding. Its pretty easy and hell, my oipline buddies all moved a shitty canoer city up to the school. After 9 months make over 100k day one out of school. Most of them get a new dually and build a bed after graduation and make over 150k using their own stuff.

Some will even goband list on as a hekper even tho they both pass. Then fuckoff all day and split 150k a year.

>>1763261
Look. Rather than fight tooth and nail can we not all agree that trade school is an alright alternative? No u wont make hindreds of thousands but it teaches you a lifelong skill so u dont starve or flip burgers. Anyone not wanting to do man work in there 60s should do this and pay cash for college

>>1763366
Or fuck up like me and depend on physical labor and working harder than everyone around me. Only to become a fucking gimp at 24 and not able to walk for shit... guess i will die now...

>>1763592
Just guess and run with it. Pretty much roll the dice or flip burgers and die. One of my shittiest jobs got me the skills to get the job i have now. Awesome for the most part.

Make more money than i ever have. Treated well. Pretty much do wtf i want and bounce around listening to the radio.

Turns out what i really want is financial freedom at nearly any cost.

Study oersonal finance daily now.

>>1763668
I would try and have a descent job unless you truly have the stomache for this. Most dont.

I dont.

I do as long as i dont suffer broke anyway. If i can keep my day job and do this then fuck yeah.

>>1765123
Such shit advice...

>>1765264
m8 I think the trades are great and all, Dirty Jobs with Mike Rowe is a great show and stuff but I'm a huge fucking pussy and I would never make it in a trade like that. I've heard from people who went into welding, who are like me, that it's absolute hell and they want to get out of it ASAP, that they get screamed at all day and the work is hard and dangerous. That sounds like my worst nightmare and the average welder's salary is like 35k a year so it seems like a meme

Same with HVAC or any trade, really

>ITT: Everyone had the same elders and people to look up to

Just because your own situation gave you constant barrage of "work hard and you'll succeed" from older people doesn't mean everyone was growing up in the same way you fucking retards.

My high school guidance counselor was a fucking dipshit. My teachers berated students, and the only thing I had going for me was my mother who constantly said she's proud of me no matter what I do because I'm her little pitbull. Once I bought into an idea I would lock down hard and never give up.

I got kicked out of college at 22 with just associate's to my name, started ironically working at the college I got my associate's at as an advisor the same year, and then pursued a math degree and industrial engineering bachelor's. The only things driving me forward were a complete hatred for living paycheck to paycheck, a strong desire to prove my counselor who said I'm not cut out for college wrong, and my Mom. Life is excellent now but it wasn't always tons of encouragement from every source around.

Shit happens OP. Just keep your hopes up high and your head down low. Honestly figure out what you enjoy, and find the closest avenue to making a living out of it. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. It's not too late to go back to school dude.

>>1762037
Thanks, this is my life, I'm a POS with severe depression and psychosis. I got halfway an undergrad degree in STEM, but now I'm fucked financially.

>>1761988
No one told you because most people older than you don't have their own shit figured out.
Young adulthood is like this pitfall and you see a bunch of assholes fall in but you're too naive and full of yourself to figure away around it. So you sit on your ass and be a delusional turd until finally you hit that pitfall just like everyone else and you're fucked.
If you sit back and audit your decisions up to now you will realize you had every chance to avoid the trap but you just didn't do what was necessary.
Lucky you, you're still 26, there still time to rectify you situation before you really get into the shitter and there will be no turning back.

>>1763675
>What do you mean?
Assuming he went to a school with a good comp sci program:

>first semester you take some piss easy programming 101 classes to weed out people who 100% should not be there
>second semester you take advanced programming classes with some math classes to weed out the rest of the kids in the wrong major
>three more years of math, logic, and some specific areas of programming

My first semester as a comp sci major there were two simultaneous 101 lectures with ~250 students in total. By the time I graduated there were 12 students left.

>>1765643
More specific to the question, 95% of the kids who dropped the major only went into it because "dude I spent my entire childhood playing vidya and building computers" only to realize that it's a pretty difficult field.

>>1762037
man all that projection would really make a man's ass hurt. try some bengay old pal

>>1762073
what u choose?

>>1762111
what do u mean leverage?

>>1763357
whats the business? you fucking idiot, you know how lucky you are? thank god your family owns a business, so fucking make that business baller as fuck. you need to donald trump it up and make it the best god damn business ever. you fucking idiot. here i am scratching my own ass and your family already has a fucking business.

yall are idiots. by the way, what biz u got?

>>1763592
its called jobshadowing. look it up.

>>1765295
what is it that you do?

>>1764999
hahaha you are a fag and a caricature, high school pussy means nothing.

>>1765203
> everything in life is sales

I like this. Shit even at this moment I'm selling people on the idea of your post.

>>1761988
I turned 18 and was like, holly fuck that was 22.83105% of my life, I better figure out what the fuck I'm going to do before it passes me by.

>>1761991
Except your brain isn't fully developed until 25

>>1766232
it's 99.99% "developed" physically by 15. you just don't know anything until about 25+

>>1761988
This is a big failing of many of our parents (not mine fortunately). It's their responsibility to tell you that. Many universities nowadays will tell you to come and just sorta try whatever might interest you. That's wrong. You need to pick what you want to do, and then pursue that thing. The earlier you do that and start building some funds, the better.

>>1761988

OP I sympathise and empathise.

The people on here criticising OP are just plain ignorant and stupid. There are so many bits and pieces of career advice that would prove invaluable to many people yet are almost unwritten rules. I see ignorant shit every single day on every single 4chan board I browse relating to career advice. And I don't mean people who know they're ignorant, I mean confidently ignorant strident people.

>hurrdurr, don't do an arts degree

Oh, so people who do English at yale will be poor?

>hurrdurr, just do an engineering degree

So people who do engineering at Shit state U will be successful?

>Hurrdurr, just work hard!

Oh, so someone who goes straight to Walmart after school and works hard will be more successful than a private schooler who goes to Cornell, lives a comfy 4 years of multiple parties a week and less than 40 hours of work, then instantly gets an $80+k job after graduation? Who worked harder? Who is in the better position and valued more by society?

>Hurrdurr, just do a trade

Yeah, in the information age the thing for any ambitious person is to hit two bits of metal together just in time to meet the hordes of open border enabled immigration ready to flood the job market... Yeah, I'm sure the fact that LITERALLY ZERO rich families go in to trades is a pure coincidence...

Real talk OP but living at home in your 20s blows dick as it drains you of that "drive" required to make drastic to your life in order to improve yourself.

Look at my case OP as I am 24, living at home, no debt, university educated, and career experience in my field and I am just as miserable doing white collar work and doing "everything right."

Right now I am trying desperately to join my country's national police as I know if I do not do something extreme I will just waste away in my parent's basement watching my youth disappear. If that does not work I will be doing JET or something similar; anything to get me out of the house.

Anyway OP being a wagecuck is not for everyone and if you figure out to learn to love minimalism then you can have a pretty exciting life that 99% of the world dreams about. You can buy a house when you're 50 and pay it off when you're 60 so don't worry about that shit.

>>1765751
Took a job at a quarry with a bumb foot.

Was a truck driver and came home to drive truck for buddy.

Truck is kill.

Get job with another buddy bulding a church.

Shit falls and takes me down.

Metal plate holding my foot together now.

Get the job at quarry. Treated like shit. Paid like shit. Constaint pain. Considering just getting on dissability when they put an office building at a quarry near town.

Less hours, better pay, better treatment, better benefits, better everything.
I suggest everyone without an education jumo in some equipment. Can get a job anywhere and is a fast and easy skill u can always have. Some days suck. But id rater run a hoe in the rain than roll around in the ditch guiding the hoe.

Pic related. Work was average. But after 3pm havent done shit. Me and duffus here just hanging out shitposting for another hour

>>1765326
Well, i worked just as hard at pizza hut as i did pulling wells.

I guess it comes down to work ethic. U can get a shot job sacking groceries and just coast until you figure out a plan or die of old age i guess

>>1767121
>Yeah, in the information age the thing for any ambitious person is to hit two bits of metal together just in time to meet the hordes of open border enabled immigration ready to flood the job market

I've never even met a Mexican electrician before. Not all trades are as simple as "hitting two bits of metal together".

>Yeah, I'm sure the fact that LITERALLY ZERO rich families go in to trades is a pure coincidence

Doesn't really support your argument that trades aren't worth it, just that people with rich parents generally don't pick career paths which involve manual labor.

>>1768214
>I've never even met a Mexican electrician before.
Never been to California?

>>1767121
>So people who do engineering at Shit state U will be successful?
As long as it's properly accredited, yeah.

>>1768286
Californian electrician for 12 years here. I've never seen or even heard of a Mexican electrician in residential or commercial, union or non union. Very few Mexican (and by Mexican I mean all Mexicans including Guatemalens, El Salvadorians, etc) plumbers or HVAC guys either. Lots of Mexican carpenters, fair amount of lathe/plaster/paint guys.

>>1768294
All my trashy cousins married mexican tradies. Mostly granite and carpentry but a few electrologists and line workers.

>>1761988
>Why didn't anyone tell us
Someone had to tell you, for you to realize?

>>1768587
There is such a thing as having the ability to assess your situation. Did you have to be told not to drink bleach? You should drink some bleach. I am telling you to since obviously that is how you get all information in your life.

>>1768598
I think youre agreeing with him senpai

>>1761988
Exact same thing happened to me, advice:

1. The ONLY person you can count on ultimately, is yourself. Your mom/dad/family etc may love you, you might have great friends, you might get a girlfriend or wife, but ultimately every one of those people have a limit to how many fucks they give about you and your life. The -ONLY- person you should *ever* trust to always have your back for anything, is yourself. This is why people get disowned by parents, cheated on by long term bf/gf/husb/wife. This is why peoples kids hate them and never speak to them once they move out. This is fundamental knowledge when in your situation, because you need to realize only *YOU* will improve your quality of life and success at this point.

2. Try to adopt a more positive mentality in general - this sort of situation can lead to severe depression, or worsen an already existing case (I have fought depression since childhood). It is very easy to shut down and give up. I've spent literally *years* sitting on my computer, in the dark, in my childhood room, while im 25+. As pathetic as it was (and I was fully aware of it) - I couldn't make myself budge. I would build up courage and willpower enough to start trying to work on the situation, but would quickly become demoralized and fall back into the negative pattern. Your emotions will have a direct effect on this inability. This process will take time.

(cont)

>>1768605
>but ultimately every one of those people have a limit to how many fucks they give about you and your life.
tru

>>1768605

3. Ask yourself what your ultimate goal is - what is required for you to smile peacefully on your deathbed knowing you've lived a life close enough to what you wanted in order to be happy? Write it down. From there, work backwards, figuring out every goal that needs to be achieved and decisions that need to be made, step by step, until you've reached where you currently are. You now have a map to happiness. This process may take minutes, hours, weeks, months, even years, don't get discouraged if you can't figure it out immediately. If you've never considered these things before it may be hard to get the ball rolling. Keep coming back to it. Remember, keep your goals realistic and obtainable. It's fine to shoot for the stars if you want to do something amazing, but that's later, right now were just trying to focus on repairing the immediate and get the ball rolling.

4. Try to create "side quests" - smaller, minor goals you would like to accomplish that are not mission critical to dying happy, but still have interest. These may be things like hobbies, exercise / physical improvement, getting a gf / socializing more, etc.

5. SOCIALIZE - we are social creatures. Being alone can and will hurt you typically. Even if you're scared or thing you dont know how to talk to people/make friends - DO IT ANYWAY. Read "the game" by neil strauss. Absorb everything in it and put it to practice. The skills you will learn with this directly translate into general socializing, people skills, confidence and you *will* increase your social circle in time. In all honesty you'll probably wind up with a girlfriend within a year if you actually stick to it and try.

>>1767121
let me redpill you,

90% of 4chan is hurrdurr

>>1762010
I can be clearing 6 fig salary by the time i'm 26. Fuck off with your excuses poor cunt

>>1768640
whoa you must be so badass

>>1768643
Ya, my M5 will be pretty badass

>>1762065
>Now I'm working as an email marketing developer making about $50k~ a year.
What are the odds you're bald and have a beard?

>>1761988
>>1761991
>You're just a lazy moron who played world of warcraft or whatever game. The normal people actually built their futures and realized that magic doesn't happen, what you do now is what you'll do in 5 years.

More accurate version is ". . . what you do now is what you'll do in 5 years if you don't get your shit together now."

Look, OP. I made terrible decisions too. You're not alone in this. It's most of the workforce actually. I'm not going to paint a rosy scenario for you, because it's going to be a tough climb from here if you want to get ahead, but it's far from impossible. You just need to hunker down and make a plan for once in your life and stick to it.

Let me give you a recap of my story on the chance it will give you a little motivation and help you avoid further pitfalls.

>25, never finished college, no skills, no trades, etc.
>closer to $8/hour at a shit job

Eventually I worked my way up to nearly $10/hr after a couple of years and a small promotion. We were still underpaid in the supermarket I worked for, but the promotion put me working as the nightly "bookkeeper," counting money, making deposits, blah blah and supervising and training new hires. Trust me, like you, I put up with a lot of shit for very little pay and zero respect from customers and most co-workers. (not that much was deserved I suppose). After nearly three years in, the cash office experience started getting me interviews with banks, which pay about $12-13 for entry-level spots for idiots like me. Still nothing compared to some people, but it was more than I deserved. Your situation will be a little different, but this is how you climb your way out. Get a few raises from there, another promotion ,and you're at $15/hour. Spend your free time earning a certification that your employer needs, and possibly will be willing to pay for. There's a lot of them in banking and IT. Best of luck, anon.

>>1768704
kek

>>1761988
>>1762037
>You fucked up anon.

Don't listen to this faggot. Yes, he's right that you fucked up, but you don't have to stay at $9 per hour forever. Are you likely to be able to get a top tier executive dream job at some Fortune 500 firm at this point? Hell no, so put that out of your mind. Don't let it depress you though. Half the workforce earns $30,000 per ear or less. Yes, that's right--half! And no, before some retard suggests it, that half is not teenagers and retired people working at wal-mart. Most of the workforce is poorly educated, poorly trained, and made shit decisions all their lives exactly like you did. The problem is that virtually none of them ever decide to try and do anything about it after high school or dropping out of college because they think life is fixed at that point. To a certain point it is; you're not going to Wharton, Harvard, or whatever, but you have options available that will give you a decent shot at being able to support yourself. Life isn't over.

>>1768652
>buying a BMW

kek

>>1768764
This, always time to improve yourself. At the very least learn a trade, plumber, electrician, carpenter. They make absolute loads of cash.

My plan
>Pick the education that pays the most
>Graduate work the job even if I fucking hate it
If I hate it I will power trough it for 2-3 years and the earn enough to retire early because I will live frugally as fuck.

Your typical 21 year old anon here, having similar problems as OP.

Finnished my a-levels about a year ago, applied to a random university for a random bachelor's degree and quit after 2 weeks.

I've grown content with living a rather minimalist life, dumping my precious time into shitposting, lurking and VIDEOGAMES.

Is there any hope left if I am just trying to live a semi-NEET / shut-in life?

I started sending out applications for an apprenticeship in a trade, but I worry about not having the work ethics to work a 40-hour week. Might just bite the bullet and do my 3 years of apprenticeship anyway so that I can atleast work part-time, doing stupid IT shit like managing networks, perhaps even move to the US.

Life hasn't been kind to us thus far, and it's only going to get worse, so I'd appreciate a little bit of indulgence.

>leave college at 19 to write software for medical device company
>have mental breakdown, go to mental hospital, lose $30,000
>recover, go back to work for big famous tech company at 21
>another mental breakdown, lose $10,000
>approached by startups for cofounding, too unstable to work at the time
>now NEET with no money at parents house trying to figure wtf to do for the rest of my life with this shit body


either healthcare needs to be reformed or I need to shoot myself, this is too much guys

>>1769586
Mental health problems are the worst because medicine can barely help in a lot of cases.

>>1769594

I was put on "medicine", it made me retarded, emotionally dry, and fat, I literally couldn't work while on it so I stopped taking it

worse is that /biz/nisspeople and /pol/iticians are psychopaths who want their gibsmedats on the backs of the suffering so research into the most neurologically altering substances can't be done because they've made them Schedule I

I wrote software that possibly saved a medical company millions over the years and my thanks from the healthcare industry are tens of thousands of dollars in bills

I've dropped out of college twice. Average intelligence level, above average laziness level. I'm joining the military. Gonna get a sense of discipline, and have freeeee school. You should see the benefits of your state's National Guard, cause mine are great.

>>1769607
You got goyed

>>1769607
Maybe you had the second mental breakdown because you refused to take your medication? You need to address your problems somehow or you're going to end up in the same cycle.

>>1769614

>because you refused to take your medication

I did this because I literally couldn't perform at work without it, if I can't perform at work I can't afford the medication, if I can't afford the medication I have an episode anyway

>You need to address your problems somehow or you're going to end up in the same cycle.

I look into alternative treatments (illegal), mental and physical discipline helps, my recovery abilities are increasing

but maybe America should address its healthcare problem unless it wants a bunch of broke mentally ill people with guns with some grudges against the industry

>>1769628
>>1769614

*couldn't perform at work with it

>>1769586
What happened when you had a mental breakdown?

>>1769637

auditory hallucinations, then minor visual hallucinations, blurred sense of time, strange psychic/physical paralysis, thought I was going to be tortured by doctors (ended up being true, financially)

>>1769655
You were evolving to a higher level
Unfortunately society tells us these things are bad

>>1769607
i dont get it. did you know that this software was gonna be so amazing? did they compensate you fairly for doing this?

>>1769684

>did you know that this software was gonna be so amazing?

I was young, all I cared about at the time was that I was impressing my manager and teammates, I was pulled aside by my immediate manager after implementing one thing and was told that I deserved to be paid at least twice what I was being paid at the time, but he did not have the power to decide such things. The tool I made completely automated a system that was programmed by another person, when the next round of layoffs came, that person was fired, and I received 0 compensation for my labor.

Let that be a warning to any hopeful engineers or innovators; if you can be automated away you will no longer be relevant, and if you automate one of those things there is no guarantee you will enjoy the rewards.

The lesson I learned was to do as little as possible to stay an infinitesimally above-average employee, and nothing more. Progress is not rewarded if you do not control the rewards.

>>1761988
there must have been something you wanted to do by age 20
what was it?
why didn't you pursue it?
what did you do with your time instead?

>>1768587
kids are dumb
you might say "oh I wasn't dumb as a kid" and you're probably wrong
even if you weren't, you were in the minority there

>>1761988
>i make 9$/h
fuck you i have 3 years of experience as programmer and i make 4,5 usd. I wish and dream every day about being born in usa and going to silicon valley meme(i won't get visa), sadly i don't have courage to move out of this shithole and start. And please don't tell me about remote jobs, there are impossible

The US needs a state regulated apprenticeship system. It's extremely beneficial to businesses and young people. What's the downside really?

This board is a prime example what happens when you offer no opportunities to young people.

>>1761988
dont become like me OP
I was an extremely talented cunt back then. I speak 3 languages fluently and play violin at near professional level. Then I smoked pot and raped an underage teen when i was 19. Went to prison for like some years. then worked manual labor for min wage for 2 decades. My info is posted all over the sex offender site and i get harassed by random people. It's a good month for me when my windows are still intact. I also lack health insurance and got chronic pain all over. Sometimes I wonder why I didnt off myself by now.

>>1769750
have you tried something like freelancer.com?
the trick is to whore yourself in your first bids until you get enough good reviews

>>1769971
>Then I smoked pot and raped an underage teen when i was 19.

shit bait.

>>1769750
>i don't have courage to move out of this shithole and start
Have you tried to stop acting like a cuck?

Moving is easy.

For someone who isn't good at math what would be a secure major to get into?

I was thinking something computer science related, would have loved electrical engineering if I was good at math.

What about Business Administration? I always imagined with a degree like that I could work as some corporate manager until I saved enough to start a business.

>>1761988
53 here and just wanted to reinforce this reality

I never expected to live or at best always assumed I'd find soemthing with my big brain and high IQ

I didn't

its every bit as horrifying as you can imagine.. get retirement settled asap

>>1762037
Well, fuck man, I'm in a very similar situation to OP.
Should I just neck myself?
Honest question.

>>1769750
Hey man, I'm from Indonesia but now I live in Germany. Moving out isn't as scary as you think.

>>1762075
You're conflicting your own message.

You say you have to work hard but most degrees are worthless. That's wrong. No degree is worthless, but if it doesn't have any immediately apparent value then you have to work even harder to derive value from it. Humanities degrees, art, psych, whatever are all important and lucrative fields but you have to be way, way better than replacement level to offset the relative lack of job opportunities compared to STEM.

So you're original message is germane you're just not taking it far enough.

>>1770527
You have to be adept at soft skills if you're going to be a BA major. If you're comfortably extroverted in real life and can gain a thorough understanding of practical business concepts, it can open a lot of doors.

>>1762274
it's so you can still get a white collar job. in australia it's difficult to even apply for a job at a call centre. literally you need minimum a 3 year university degree to answer a phone. it's just a ticket saying that you had higher than lumpenprole class parents and understand business culture. if you dont want to try and arnt very clever, you can literally present a rock you find on the side of the road as a final art piece and pass an arts course.

Most people who are successful from the get-go had parents who had been to college or who were smart enough to prepare their kids properly for reality. For the people without parents like that, you just have to learn it yourself, which puts you behind. Just remember it's never too late and that at 30 you're still pretty young.

>>1768214
You must not live in the south, clearly

>>1763058
>Earth would you rack up $250k?
Any school which is know for its name has a tuition which hovers around $50K+.
$50,000x4=$200,000

>>1769713
>Young buck go-getter gets f'd-in-the-a by the most basic of corporate manipulation
kek
I think their should be a course at Uni where they basically show you how many options companies have to fuck you and how you can negate or at least benefit from them.
I've NEVER made something for my company that I didn't milk for maximum profit.
>This program will automate three peoples jobs bringing the company this much
>Ergo, since I'm the only one who has designed it, knows how it works, and even built in a "fuck you" failsafe, you need to pay me the equivalent that you'll save
>We'll think about it
>can you make a lighter version
>Nope, sorry, i'm really busy with the other projects you've given me :)
>Okay, we'll give you a few people and you can habve your own team
>Nope, I'm really busy with the projects you've given me
>We'll pay you double
>Nope (ibid.)...
>We'll pay you the equivalent of two people plus a base salary increase and bonus
>(Negotiations later)
>Ahhh, we'll think abou-
>Oh look, another company is interested in my project because I wasn't dumb enough to do it here, at work, in office time, so it's mine
>FINE we'll settle for the original amount
>Nope :)

Anyway, I'm basically going to work for four more years, then cut back my hours, then semi-retire and start my own small company so I don't get altimeters.

>>1761988
Not true unless you buy into the 'college straight outta high school' meme.

And why the fuck can't you join the air force now?

>>1761988
You never really find out what you want to do.
you just peruse what you think and give 150% and eventually, you will fall into it.
Success, is where Opportunity meets preparedness.

>>1762355
Doesn't justify tough, i mean, everyone with half a brain around the 17-20 margin can understand that what he decides to study will give him x ammount of income, and the chances he has of finding a job, only people unable to understand this is most of the females and some retarded males

>>1762265
>>1763004


The fuck are you talking about? Every teacher I had in high school didn't say "lol just go to college for anything", they said "Math, computers and/or business". Guess what, they were right. I got my degree in econ, and learned programming on the side, and I don't have a dime of student debt to my name and live very comfortably.

Granted, they didn't talk up the trades nearly as much as they should have, but this meme of "I went to college for anything like they said, I dindu nuffin'." is the biggest pile of horseshit lies you guys tell yourselves.

>>1772567
Also, starting in the 7th grade at my school, you were required to look at the BLS in every required career planning class they had going forward.

You know, the same BLS that point blank gives you occupation forecasts, average salaries, unemployment rates, and the EXACT education people in those fields had to take. That shit is FREE and available to everyone of all ages.

>>1769609
I agree, 100% free, high ass wagae if you rank up proficently, wide variety of fields, literally, your life is secured as long as you don't fuck up, the only drawback is that you'll be in your country forever, thing that i don't want

>>1772581
>BLS
you must have went to a good school or something, cause I didn't even know what that was until just now lol. Testing was a way bigger deal than seriously considering your future and what you're about to get into

>>1773508
... In my experience, anyway.

>>1761988
>Why didn't anyone tell us
Because your parents were dumb and didn't guide you. Everyone else doesn't give a shit, we're not your parents.

There were so many tons of complete shit advice I got while growing up

I am sooo glad to have been raised by a Jewish father holy shit

>>1765162
>>1765157
I mean, how bad can it reasonably be?
The meme of jobless history majors has been around since my fucking father was in uni during the 70s.
My main question about the major isn't career availability, but what you can do with it besides taking the place of the professor who taught it to you.
It seems like the only real profession to go into after graduating is teaching it.

"follow your dreams" is literally the worst advice
so many lives ruined

follow opportunity.

>>1772581
Do you honestly think every school is like this?

>>1774089
When will people learn that majors don't teach people how to work a specific job? They teach you skills that you can later learn to apply to many different positions.

If you apply yourself and have the drive, there's a whole host of different occupations you could get into.

I say this as someone who has a liberal arts degree and actually does work in the field I studied, but I understand I am an exception to the rule.

>>1766203
And now you're just slaving your life away like the good little wagecuck you are, right?

>>1769722
I can't remember...

>>1765203
shhh, if everyone does it, it will make it more difficult for slackers like me to compete with minimal effort. These options are in the early to middle age of maturity as a way to make money, once they fill up we'll be fucked until the next new thing is found.

>>1761991
END
THE
THREAD
THE END

/thread

----------------------------------------------------------

>>1765617
haha

>>1774196
Mine was a public school.

Granted, it's the public school in town where all the Jewish old money families send their kids, but if you're too dumb to just look around, maybe you deserve your fate.

>>1770643
No. Lifespans are increasing, people switch careers in their 50s successfully. Get rid of your debt, buckle down and learn a profitable trade and you'll be fine.

It's not how you start that you'll remember or regret, it's how you finish.

>>1773508
>on /biz/
>Has never read a jobs report, or even a summary of one

>>1761988
I mean take this as you will, but I dropped out of Uni and started selling swords at 28.
I'm not rich, but I'm pretty content and secure.
I love waking up at 6am feeling fully alert because I know that today I get to do something related to my dreams of being a knight I had as a kid.
I love going to the festivals and fairs. I love helping and giving public lectures at museums. I love that three evening a week I get to teach people how to use based on old book.
I'm not rich and never will be, but for the first time in a very long time since my parents passed away and my sister was paralysed in a car accident after my girlfriend since high school dumped me, I truly feel happy.

>>1761988

I'm in the same boat as a lot of the people in this thread.

At 22 years old, I just finished my degree - a bachelor of arts majoring in writing at a shit-tier university. I didn't know what I wanted to do when I finished high school so I just started a bachelor of arts and picked the subjects I though looked interesting with no real direction until my second year.

Before I finished I decided I wanted to go into the military so I started that process. I've been recommended as a Marine technician in the RAN but unfortunately the ADF hates straight white men and will take literally anyone over such a privileged guy like me. I'll likely be waiting till 2018 to get in.

Don't really know what I'm going to do for the rest of the year, or if I will even want to go into the navy by the time I get my offer. I've had lots of experience doing shitty minimum wage jobs but I've never had a real job and that makes me nervous to apply for one.

I'm even considering blowing off the navy and going back to uni to study something worthwhile like a double degree in econ/law or econ/finance but I'm not sure if I want to go back to the uni lifestyle.

>>1763261
you're not helping with the 'tradespeople are dumb yokels' stereotype.

>>1761988
Dude stop making excuses for your bullshit life. You make nine an hour? Go to college and the government can provide you poll grants. Or start studying at home in a field you'd be happy and enjoy and push yourself. I broke into the IT field with a poli sci degree and I made 10an hour. No degree. I took compTIA certifications and four years later I make over 50k. I'm about to specialize in cyber security and hacking. Start a company when my skills are solid. I'm 29.

So at 25 I was basically you with a degree that got no where but I had a gf and pussy. You have neither. Nothing can hold you back but you. Don't be a bitch.

>>1771034
How? Did you study there?