/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>>/pol/

Realising you now have a product that is much cheaper to manufacture, thus you can decrease the price and force your competitors out of business. End result is more wealth and less work, which is fucking brilliant.

>>1669567
But if people don't have jobs, they can't participate in that wealth.

>>1669570

That's why you don't think of this as jobs lost, but as tasks done, freeing people to do more complex/ meaningful tasks.

>>1669512
That's where basic income for all comes in, anon.

>>1669578
NEETS can pry my taxes from my cold dead hands before I support UBI

This is a fuckin neet dream anyway. This will never happen. They can already use a robot to fly a plane,land and take off. But they still have humans on them. They will do the same shit for truckers.

>>1669512
If the labor market becomes redundant expect mass depopulation. While an automated economy can have effectively infinite labor it will never have infinite resources or energy so the useless eaters will have to go.

>>1669597
Noone cares if you support it or not. If it doesnt get implemented the economy will collapse and we will ALL go to shit,

If noone has any income people wont buy your product for example, etc.

Just think about how we will survive if 70% of people in first world countries are unemployed.

An UBI is necessary so we all benefit from future technology you cuck

>>1669604
>(((future technology))) owns you
>cuck
shitty deal desu

>>1669604
I don't care if millions of lazy shitstains become technologically unemployed because they're too lazy to apply themselves. NEETs will have to work whatever shitty jobs are left to earn a living. They can all be murdering each other for scraps of rat meat for all I care. I will NOT support Basic income even if it means humans face extinction.

>>1669832
Why?

>>1669832
If you're employed at all, which I highly doubt, I bet you don't even pay taxes as it is so shut the fuck up cuck.

>>1669832
Realistically the government would give these unemployed a place to live and provide all their basic needs eg put them in prisons.

They a large number of stay at home neets with disposable income. They want a mulatto underclass endlessly clicking sponsored content.

pic related

>>1669570
>But if people don't have jobs
there will always be things for people to do even if its simple shit like cleaning the streets.

>>1669870
>there will always be things for people to do even if its simple shit like cleaning the streets.
>points out something so mundane it will literally be the first thing automated

kys

>>1669603
They may be useless as workers but will still be useful as consumers

>>1669512
Universal basic income will actually be a good idea once we've achieved a sufficient level of automation.
That won't be until after most unskilled service jobs are gone, though.

automation is a meme

the job market is being fucked due to other reasons not related to automation

>>1669578
Where then everyone becomes the same, except for the very rich.

>>1670403
When do you think automation will become so big that Universal Basic Income is implemented?

>>1670427
I think there's a good chance we'll have UBI by 2030.
I don't know if automation will have progressed to the point that it becomes necessary by then. It turns out it's actually very easy to program a computer to replace a cashier but very hard to program a computer to replace a janitor.

>>1670410
>t-the big bad automation monster isn't real
>r-r-right guys
you're so fucked.

>>1669603
You act as though those "useless eaters" won't violently revolt lol

>>1669604
These people are acting as though the rich won't simply be richer from a UBI, people need to stop bitching lol

>>1669832
You will literally be murdered.

This isn't edgeshit. If you are in control of a vast amount of wealth during an economic crises of this scale, you will very likely die in a violent revolution. That's the way history has always played out. Just like everything else, economics is a cycle.

>>1670496
Why haven't they revolted already?
Why should they? Keep em numbed with cheap entertainment and food and they won't even realize they're sheep.

>>1669601
And pay the unskilled monitors much less than fully trained pilots and truckers.

>>1670403
no, all thats going to happen is you get some basic GOODS and SERVICES for free but thats it.

you wont be getting free money to spend without restriction.

and thats the best case scenario if it happens at all.

>>1670265
>>points out something so mundane it will literally be the first thing automated
>kys
you wont be automating that for a while.

robot maintenance wont be automated for a very long time either.

good try retard.

>>1670514
except, you know, when they can't buy that stuff

>>1670524
They've already started, and you severely underestimate the progress of technology

>>1669512
Someone has to clean the jizz out of the hosts and there's only so much printing capacity for new hosts. Live frugal, save every penny until the inevitable singularity

>>1670541
>They've already started, and you severely underestimate the progress of technology
they haven't, feel free to find a source though.

even cleaning the streets half as efficient as a human is a century away.

>>1670550
>even cleaning the streets half as efficient as a human is a century away.

LMAO can't wait till your choking on those words in 25 years.

Technology triples in speed of progress every 10 years.

By 2030 UBI will begin to be implemented as we for the first time really see jobs being decimated, and by 2050-2060 it's going to implemented big time.

>>1670554
>still no source.
good try retard

>>1670559
You'll know you're the retard in 20 years.

>>1670550
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/trend-tracking/Bengaluru-to-soon-get-an-automated-street-sweeping-truck/articleshow/55478489.cms

Alsp Centurion, Roomba, and D79

>even cleaning the streets half as efficient as a human is a century away
They can be slower and less efficient and still pay for themselves since they don't need wages, just energy

>>1670565
you're as dumb as rocks.

>>1670398
They won't need consumers, the economy would be independent of labor. The robot mines, factories will just produce for whoever is left.

>>1670496
Depopulation would be done in a blameless way. They genetically engineer a virus or other pandemic or simple market forces keep people from reproducing, or they find ways to keep people in prisons. Or citizens are offered covenant contracts where they have to be sterilized in order to obtain welfare monies and live comfortably.

The last one is the most likely. Its been done before. A generation or two and word is down to sustainable levels, a few more and itll all be elites enjoying unimagimable wealth and robots.

>>1670571
Oh the irony

>>1670572
>The robot mines, factories will just produce for whoever is left.
>presumably, whoever is left will use what is produced
That's called consuming, by the way. Just saying

>>1670572
>They won't need consumers, the economy would be independent of labor. The robot mines, factories will just produce for whoever is left.

So eventually they can go back to the stone ages' concept where everyone produces only what they need for themselves?
I'm not saying that the economy is not sustainable in the way you mentioned, I'm saying business-owners are interested in growth, constant increase of capital, etc. And they can't do that without consumers. The larger the market, the higher the opportunities for growth.

>>1670513
>you will very likely die in a violent revolution.

yeah like the rich just stopped being rich after the French Revolution, or the Cuban Revolution, or the Soviet Revolution, or the Mao Revolution :^)

>>1669567
If you believe the prices of goods will decrease without government action you're deluded.

The reason they're doing this is to max out profits, not give their customer's cheaper goods.

>>1669512
>>1669541
>>1669567
>>1669570
>>1669577
>>1669578
>>1669597
>>1669601
>>1669603
>>1669604
>>1669615
>>1669832
>>1669849
>>1669856
>>1669866
>>1669868
>>1669870
>>1670265
>>1670398
>>1670403
>>1670410
>>1670424
>>1670427
>>1670441
>>1670464
>>1670496
>>1670497
>>1670513
>>1670514
>>1670519
>>1670522
>>1670524
>>1670541
>>1670547
>>1670550
>>1670554
>>1670559
>>1670554
>>1670559
>>1670565
>>1670569
>>1670571
>>1670572
>>1670573
>>1670575
>>1670651
>>1671301
>>1671304
Shiggy diggy

>>1671304
>If you believe the prices of goods will decrease without government action you're deluded.
Dumbest thing I've read all week. 10/10 congratulations.

>>1670496
>You act as though those "useless eaters" won't violently revolt lol
Violently revolt against the people with an army of AI security? Good luck. They were too useless to even earn money, they don't stand a chance.

This isn't like the old days when people actually did have power and leaders only had power as far as they could convince people to do what they wanted. In this future scenario people are literally worthless.

UBI is an incredibly retarded fantasy. Governments are about to collapse worldwide. No one is going to save you. Better stake your own claim in the ai revolution if you don't want to be fighting for scraps.

>>1669604
>Calling someone a cuck because they don't want to pay for you be a useless NEET.

>>1671301
You realize how many wealthy people died in these violent revolutions?

>>1671553
You literally know nothing about AI. If your just the rich dude funding it, the tech guys have all the power. Not you.

>>1669512
Normally, we should have left nature take its course and have continually less people being born in western countries, since we saw that people start adapting by prefering to have better children than more children.

But nooooooo.... (((((((THEY))))))) had to ruin it...

>>1669512
>he thinks jews have a master plan
fuck off, retard.

>>>/pol/

>>1669512
start UBE and we forever live in a cyberpunk corporate welfare state wast land
>soon

>>1672245

This. Basic state income for everyone. 90% unemployment. The whole population lives in VR's.

Hire people to write the algorithms, develop the robots, build them, maintain them, and train operators to run them.

Same thing that is happening right now. I get paid $21.50/hour to push buttons on automated machines and maintenance gets paid upwards to like $38/hour to fix them.

A pin just snapped off of a mandrel today. Machine would have kept running and it takes a human to fix it. I got paid to sit on my ass for 6 hours.

The day that they have self repairing machines that automatically know what to print, has automated fork lifts to go get it, can manually fix defects, etc. I will be more than impressed to give up my job. They can't even make a human controlled grinder these days that doesn't break down or clog up every 5 minutes. If they can make one that fixes itself on it's own then I'd say bring em on in.

>>1672257
wont let my memes be dreams

>>1669512
supposedly if a massive amount of jobs were replaced, the government would provide assistance

not that i believe it mind you

>>1669512
You are literally a Luddite

>>1672245
This.

Freetards should be the first to repulse a UBI. You're literally handing your life on a silver plate, you become dependant of big daddy goverment.

>>1669512
Anyway, even if we reached a level of technological development in which this is possible (this isn't going to happen soon, moore's law does not at all encompass the required mechanical advancements required for this), there's no fucking way the general population will allow it to happen.
And most of the world isn't run by corporations despite what WOKE AF in DATRUTH.org.net.ruz tells you. So it's likely many goverments across the world would intervine to prevent full automation of jobs without some form of safety guaranteed for the employees, there's already SHIT tons of laws all over the world created with the sole porpuse of protecting jobs.

And honestly I'd rather have companies be forced to employ real human beans than to have a bunch of useless neets freeloading, fuck that.

>>1669512
Service economy.
They just want to move the majority of the population into degenerate occupations.

>>1669577
It's still jobs lost, no matter how you spin it.

Eventually, there won't be enough people with jobs to be paying customers.

>>1672609
>is right

Just another way to widen the gap

>>1672695
>eventually
its already happening.
but its not because of automation. most jobs aren't manufacturing jobs anyway.
its because companies pump n dump employee's with pop up companies,tax evasion and pay-per-project type jobs.
company's do whatever they want. one day start a business,another day deploy in another country and so on.

>>1672200
My point still stands. In the past almost everyone was capable of picking up a gun and to a lesser extent a sword and being about as dangerous as anyone else. When ai is the only thing worth fighting with everyone becomes a lot less equal.

Those with power will be those with ai weapons. That could be people who can pay for them or only those who can develop them themselves but it won't include useless eaters without money or skills.

>>1670569
too bad they dont have a robot that teaches them how to shit in the loo

>>1673082
people will be able to destroy these expensive robot soldiers just like people now can sabotage a tank.
it will be a long time before using million dollar robots to fight people who can incapacitate them for a few dollars of materials becomes feasible

>>1670573
Oh the irony for you

Automated shitposting so you can't even be a NEET in peace.

>>1672263
>train operators to run them.

kek most companies dont even train their employees anymore

they expect 100 years experience from the start

>>1672695
Not to mention that not everyone is capable of doing highly mental tasks, a lot of humans, I dare say, most humans, are better suited for physical tasks, that's why there's only 1 leader for a group of dozens of employees.

Surely there will be parts of our future AI masters that require mouth servicing? We could wear our kneepads while servicing them..

>>1669597
KEK

>>1669832
>even if it means humans face extinction
not that it would ever come down to basic income to save the species, but honestly that's a petty reason to let everyone go extinct.

>>1674475
l-lewd.

>>1674484
Some people don't know the difference between rational capitalism and autismo-capitalism.