/biz/ - Business & Finance

>no women

You are a stupid faggot if you haven't seen the influx of women trying to become coders through those bullshit bootcamps

>>16187410
Coding is going down in demand in the west. It's all going overseas. Only professional careers exist now, sorry incel who didn't go to university

>asking retarded questions on /biz/
Try suicide OP it will pay off better for a fag like yourself

>>16187544
but i did go to university anon

>>16187447
Nothing compared to the roasties working in HR/advertising/marketing etc

>>16187544
>You can only make money by working for Shekelstein, anon. Don't attempt to make money by working for yourself, don't you dare try it!!!
Back to plebbit, cuckold.

>>16187410
it is, if you use it for you and also know a lower level language and you shit daily on frameworks and other js front end garbage

>>16187410
>>Extremely high demand
then why does nobody hire me

>>16187410
web dev here, ama

>>16188033
how much do you make

>>16187410
I only write real programs with C++ and Java.

>>16188046
I'm in the suburbs, so less than city people make. But ~175k.

I had an offer in my local city for ~210k.

>>16188023
start low paid make yourself irreplaceable due to precisely that then work from home far away then slowly raise

>>16188072
I don't think you understand ANON
literally NOBODY wants to hire me
my resume gets 0 responses

although to be fair I only sent it to only 3 places like 4 days ago
but it's a certified 0% success rate! Oh man if I don't find a job soon (in the next 2-3 years) I'll become HOMELESS and DIE
DO YOU UNDERSTAND ANON???
THE SITUATION IS DIRE

>>16187410
It will eventually level off like everything else. I give 10 years before ais are doing mdot shit and everything has been simplified thag no one needs programmers. You're in an industry where you can not only be automated out, but you can be automated out quicker than any other ever has. It will happen. Save your shekels

>>16188048
Noob try c and assembly

>>16188069
oh fugg. i live in a fairly large metropolitan area with a lot of startups and fortune 500 companies but my rent is cheap as fuck. I would live like a god off of 210k.

What was your background education wise and what langauges/frameworks do you use most often?

>>16188128
and do what exactly? what won't get automated out? And are you fucking retarded by chance? 99% of industries are getting automated out soon. Tech is one of the few that won't. People won't be doing the exact same thing but there are MUCH worse jobs

>>16188128

>the automators are in an industry that is more susceptible to automation than average

Ways I know people don't understand programming, much less automation

>>16188106
That sucks. I got my first dev job after only a month of applications. Now I make $87k and literally haven't done anything in past three weeks as work has been slow. I've made $5k in this time, in the equivalent of studing an the public library for 7 hours a day, learning more music theory to get better at composition, deciding which fansubs to archive for my ongoing anime collection, and studying dev stuff I haven't dont before to leave for another upgraded job start of next year, shooting for $95k+, then $110k at the job following that one.

Plan is to work dev job now, while the money is flowing fast, stack USD and wait for the economic DOOM, to hit, then scoop up some boomer stocks and houses at 70% off when it all crashes and burns. Then, I retire and move to passive income projects, move to remote hire work, and buy a cabin in the mountains to live in at random times throughout the year.

>>16187544
came here to say the same thing. even 5 years ago it was a very different field, these days the market is saturated. its not what it once was.

>>16188361

What market?

>>16188069
Is this larp? Ill take the bait.. Are you a full stack dev? What stack, do you recommend then

>>16188334
it's a larp dude. 'web dev' doesn't pay that anywhere in the world. you'll find senior and lead positions in the valley for 200k, but you'd never hear anyone at that level call themselves 'web dev'

>>16188106
>resume

don't you have a portfolio/github?

>>16187980
I kekd

>>16188398
doesn't really matter, but some trends I see.
ruby/rails has the most remote gigs, followed closely by python/django, so if that's your goal than those stacks are where you want to specialize.
java and C# for enterprise software positions, but fuck java.
shit like haskel, closure, rust for west coast startup gigs.

>>16188434
I didn't add those to the resume since it doesn't align with the jobs I'm looking for, or my past employment experience, it's mostly webdev or crypto stuff

u guys were supposed to encourage me I've been jobhunting for half a week
don't tell me all is truly unironically lost

>>16188048
>I like real sports

>>16188128
having a solid programming background is a skill that lets you create, you have a very high edge over most of the people on earth and regardless of money you can actually do many things useful, for you or for others. it's like saying hammer and screws are useless because machines can do it. machines won't have human creativity anytime soon. things can always get optimized, especially when new technologies and discoveries happen all the time.

>>16188494
>jobhunting for a half a week
>lost

shut the fuck up zoomer

Who /.NET/ here

>>16188569
I'm comfy as fuck with my .NET + Typescript

>>16188559
thanks anon I needed that

>>16188334
I have a BS in Computer Science from a large university.
Mostly Java and React at the moment.

>>16188398
Yes, full stack. Learn Object oriented programming from an accredited university and you'll be fine.

>>16188587

I swear by .NET being the comfiest stack. People don't know what they're missing with C#.

>>16188621
>OOP
Why isn't Functional more popular?

>>16188681
Functional programming has its use cases and is becoming more popular. It just isn't used nearly as much as OOP. You'll learn both in any good CS course.

>>16188681

It's fucking terrible for readability, for starters

>>16188681
because most people are stupid

>>16188681
Because it already was when FORTRAN was a thing

>>16188048
>Java.
Pajeet detected

>>16187410
Yes, but you have to be careful. Some companies actually have lots of women due to push for equality. I'm talking literally 50%.

If you can get a remote job and live in a low COL area working for a smaller company it's a real comfy life. This is what I'm working towards, got the remote part on a contract now and am moving back to my home town from the big city. 85k cad, rent is $700, not bad for the moment.

>>16187410
>>Good money
uh huh...
What with filipinos and indians willing to work for less than a tenth of what a western CSfag out of college would ask for minimum...

lol having fun getting replaced by pajeet who will do your job for 1/10th the pay and A.I>

>>16188106
>NOBODY wants to hire me!
>btw only sent out 3 applications
>>16188494
>yeah I have a github!
>no I didn’t add it to my resume why would I do that?

>>16188106
>thinks sending out resumes is how to get hired

>>16188556
based. It's really one of the best creative skills because of how generalized it is.

Ok so I want to get to the fully remote work promised land as soon as possible. I just started my first "real" SWE gig, which turned out to be basically full stack web dev, at a non-software company (they're building out their own new custom CRM to replace the more-than-a-decade-old one currently in use)

Pls help. My boss is pretty old-fashioned, allows me to work from home sometimes (with prior "permission"...patronizing) but I already got in trouble once for WFH for an entire week that he was out, without telling him. Lol whoops

Right now our stack is
>backend: PHP & Symfony
>frontend: React

I assume my best bet is to go the freelancing route (which I have done a bit already - have an upwork profile with like 4 jobs completed) but I have no idea which skill to try & focus on and build up experience with.

Is frontend or backend usually considered less saturated/better-paying? And should I even be doing webdev over something else AT ALL - it seems like it's the software field most likely to be crowded with Olaf from Ukraine and Ranjeer from Bangladesh etc.
Before this I mostly did Python. Made my own trading UI for bitmex and hooked it up via websockets.

>>16188460
>>16190252

>>16191553
What I've kinda been thinking lately is possibly just learning Django, (bc experience with python already), and going the backend route perhaps focusing on making API's, (bc experience with rest/WS connections)?

Or, is it worth it earlier on for me to suck it up and put in extra effort to master the full stack?

>>16187447
This. Five devs on my team. One guy from MIT another from CMU. The two women? Bootcamps, one did marketing before this. The whole industry is being watered down.

>>16187410
>Extremely high demand
There's a demand for highly skill developers, which there aren't that many of. The job market is overflowing with desperate CS, STEM, and bootcamp grads wanting to get into the field.

>no women
In many places, they hire women ostensibly for diversity but it's really for the gratification of men.

>>16188106
Ultimate job hunting spoiler. You have to go there. In person. Multiple times. Inquiring about the job. Otherwise you're pissing into a hurricane

>>16187410

Unless you go solo your upside is severely limited. In UK the top paying dev jobs are in finance, investment banks, hedge funds etc but the mega tech firms like Google and FB also pay well. The top top end of comp in these roles in about £200k all-in, with the top for most people being £140k. If you compare this to someone in trading or investment banking it's the money you're earning four years out of uni. Even big law pays better after four or five year after qualification.
The rates will only go down as more worked is outsourced to Asia and Eastern Europe and more people in those countries move here which drives up supply.

tl;dr: being a dev is ok but there are better jobs out there and long term the rates will only go down.

>>16192172
This. Every pajeet can learn coding, work for a western company and shit in Mumbai. Looking at the current rate of central state failure especially in the security department it would pay off more in the mid and long term to get into the real life security field, like jumping through the loop holes getting weapon carry licences and a bunch of specialized security related certs in Europe than wasting time on coding which is highly dependent on a high functioning economic and high security environment, which simply will not be given in the west if there isn't a total political change

>>16192199
JUST RISK YOUR LIFE EVERYDAY FOR 50 YEARS BRO

What's the current state of C/C++? Used to be a thing once.

>>16187410
>first job to get replaced by ai (ten ai devs can soon do the work of a thousand normal developers)
>easiest job to outsource
>powerless in a cultural context
no

>>16188106
apply to mcdonalds

>>16188866
this object oriented programming is noob tier. functional is much better for asynchronous programming

>>16192825
No! I'm gonna be a big boy programmer and program cool things! And and my mommy will be proud! Y-You'll see!

>>16190289
It's not a problem in the real world. No one wants to hire those people because they write low quality code and can't communicate with clients.