/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>15048161
well i get free healthcare while the american die on the street

>>15048168
Who pays for your healthcare. I mean where does the government get the money?

>>15048161
If the government made apples free, then you'd kill off all the cheap apples, and instead have low quality "free apples", and high quality expensive apples

You can subsidize healthcare and you will get more healthcare, but that doesn't mean it will be price effective, efficient or good quality

You have to let the market find cheaper methods of healthcare, just as we allow apples to be sold at varying prices; treat it as a commodity

>>15048180
well does you road funding come from or Public school?

I've moved to Thailand and it has free healthcare.
People in the US need to stop making excuses and get their shit together.
Even Trump wanted free healthcare.

>>15048168
Poor people get to live as well as rich.
Pharmaceutical companies and lobbyists dont rule the government and force doctors to give unnecessary addictive drugs to the population.
Private health care is still and option and its insanely cheap because of subsidies.

>>15048198
We don't say the roads are free. Why call the healthcare free if it isn't? To deceive.

>>15048186
I live in the UK and the NHS is terrible. It operates in so many areas, giving away depression medication like candy, supporting obesity, transgender people, and even has blown money on homeopathy.

The only reason it survives is because criticizing the NHS is a taboo, and because the government just imports workers from poor countries who will accept the low wages from the NHS

>>15048209
People don't get addicted to medication because of the medication, they get addicted because the medicine provides them with a relief from prior emotional problems, namely traumatic childhoods

>>15048215
what example can you provide me where healthcare is top notch via free market? Doctors are meant to save people a free market will only incentive the greedy.

both are retarded and you're ruled by jews, who want to fuck you over by both ways of thinking

>>15048219
This is not true. Jealous American alert.
Wages in the NHS are fixed.
The WHO reports that anti depressants are being under used in the NHS.
on the other hand America has almost 40% of its population addicted to drugs, causing 740 billion dollars of lost revenue a year due to lost work days alone!
The NHS is over crowded but important operations happen quickly.

>>15048236
Igreee completely but when you have big pharma that proffits from creating addictive meds and a system happy to take money off the little man to buy them, then you end up giving the wrong drugs to the wrong people. Usually meditation and counselling will be far more effective.
Look at Purdue pharma

>>15048261
I'm not American you illiterate retard

>wages are fixed lol

No it's because they're poor

>achully the WHO thinks we don't think we give out enough happy pills!

Embarrassing

>America

I wasn't discussing or talking about America

>>15048161
with privatized health care, less people are insured = shorter wait time.

Plus, most americans avoid going to hospitals or visiting doctors due to insane insurance premiums.

>>15048161
go on /pol bitch GTFO

>>15048292
Wow you sound stressed. Better go to your doctor and get him to prescribe you some oxycontin

>>15048289
The government is one of the largest sources of this abuse, having subsidized single mothers, crappy education; giving soldiers PTSD; destroying towns with economic regulations and money printing

>>15048293
>Plus, most americans avoid going to hospitals or visiting doctors due to insane insurance premiums.
Is this not because of the bureaucracy and not the system(free market)?
>>15048313
STFU COINBITCH BUY SOME SHITCOINS

>>15048347
there is no free market. insurance companies cant compete across state lines.

>>15048161
The only point of leverage for state intervention in the healthcare market is that the poorest wouldn't get unconditional and complete coverage if they had to pay the cost.

The rebuttal to this is that this is a good thing.

>>15048347
To think of the American healthcare system as some bastion of Laissez-faire capitalism is simple naivety. The industry is a protected-class cartel. Low-cost, high-efficiency methods of doing things are simply outlawed for "the protection of the people".

How the fuck are amerifags this retarded? It is a simple calculus, do you want yourself and the people important to you to be held hostage by a profit-based medical / pharmaceutical industry, or do you want to be able to take care of health and medical issues as a collective? Boggles my mind, this.

>>15048363
>The only point of leverage for state intervention in the healthcare market is that the poorest wouldn't get unconditional and complete coverage if they had to pay the cost.
Should they though? If you could not pay rent is it the landlords duty to make sure you do not freeze?

>>15048392
Read the second line of the post lad

>>15048321
Again, I agree with you completely but that is off topic.

>>15048391
You're arguing that monopolies shouldn't exist in healthcare by promoting the creation of a monopoly

>>15048391
Are you a consistent communist or one who only wants communal healthcare?

>>15048161
euro here. Socialized healthcare is not "free" healthcare, but it provides a basic level of medical care that ensures you don't have to die of preventable issues. It works like our social security system prevents people from starving.

Healthcare providers are not paid by the state or state-run, they are for-profits, but they have to haggle with the state and the health insurance companies over prices.

The thing is, healthcare is not a perfect market. Either you let it run like one, but then people literally die in the streets because they are too poor to pay for treatment, and hospital chains and insurance companies engage in price gouging. Or you run it with an element of centralized planning and limit ROI of insurance companies.

Works for us over here, our life expectancy is higher than in the USA. Child mortality is lower (even though we have the evilz immigration army shitting out child after child) and in general are a failing continent as Bannon would certainly tell you if he was sober.

I live in Australia and our public health system is fucking fantastic. Everything from GP visits to surgery my experiences have only ever been excellent.

American healthcare is worst of both worlds, not free market, fucking morons. You'll find no expert saying the US system is a market comparable to most other goods

>Have free healthcare
>Break foot
>Get driven to clinic
>Pay
>Wait 5 hours while bunch of coughing shitskins are before you
>Finally a doctor is free
>Doctor looks 2 minutes
>"Your foot is okay, go back to work"
>Go back to work
>fracture becomes worse
>drag yourself to private doctor
>wait 2 minutes
>get x-ray, pain killers and a plaster cast
>Pay
Fuck free health care. Remove it, Remove all social security and let the genetic dirt die. Hail Darwinism, biological and social

Only fat losers and dying boomers support public health care. I live in Germany, even if you earn almost nothing (1k a month) you pay 200€ for insurance. Imagine what you could spend 200€ at the drug store for. I could've probably paid 500€ cash for the treatment I needed in the last 2 years as a fit guy and I still have to pay for every dying food addict, tranny and 90yo cuck boomer who needs his 6th knee replacement so that he can do nothing at all anyways in his last 3 years.

>>15048766
cant we really the same in australia. Went to private doctor once, paid a premium only to have the same advice as the free one, even more retarded.

>>15048785
Northern Australia here
I will never step a foot again into a public hospital
And if riots go off in the economic bust, I know where to throw my molotov cocktails, hospitals and old folk homes

>>15048161
Socialized healthcare takes good care of the young (because young will pay more taxes in their future lifetime), bad care of the old. Not a good idea to be an old person in socialism. Free market takes good care of everyone with money. Old people have generally more money saved up. I vote for free market.

>>15048848
+ young get cheap insurance so free market system takes good care of young and old.

>>15048239
Free market rewards those who give people what they are willing to pay for. What people want they pay for.

>"free" healthcare
biggest bullshit in history. it's only free when you abuse the system like a mad man, otherwise you are only paying for other people's imaginary diseases. people don't realise how much money they lose because of their "free" health care, and that's with their employers having to pay the other half of the costs, it's ridiculous.
t. from Cuckmany

>>15048848
it's the opposite actually
socialised healthcare takes care of those who voted for it once they get old, and absolutely rapes everyone else for eternity

>>15048161
>Socialised
Shit service, overall everyone pays more than it's worth, the more gibs and migrants the more everyone suffers. Also goes hand in hand with virtue signalling staff decisions which result in things like this: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/decapitated-baby-doctor-mothers-womb-delivery-death-vaishnavy-laxman-tribunal-ninewells-hospital-a8344696.html
But good if you couldnt afford ANYTHING else.

>Free market healthcare
Extortionate prices and drug costs are openly abused by patent laws, but healthcare is generally far superior to socialist systems

Basically if you could fix the extortionate costs and patent laws for drugs, you could fix free market.
If you could deport all non-contributers and imported gibsmedats and simultaneously trim the fat from a bloated and inherently corrupt government run system, then you could fix social healthcare

>>15048180
I know you think this is a good counter argument, but it common knowledge that road works are carried out needlessly to secure funding for future years.

>>15048766
Redpilled.

>>15048219
This.

Socialise your healthcare and aside from all the other factors it just becomes a political bargaining chip for the most left leaning or gibs giving factions.

Propose to cut funding for the healthcare system and do away with tax funded obesity surgery? You're literally killing sick women and children.

>>15048816
>>15048766
Mate you know you can walk into a private hospital with no insurance or money and demand to be treated? Theyll do it.

>>15048766
Accurate and based, got assaulted by a pack of scummy romanians, spent 8 hours in accident and emergency, scolded by the receptionist for making a fuss as dozens of foreigners were seen before me for sore chests (all the while I'm literally covered in blood like patrick fucking bateman), seen by some african doctor, told to go see someone else where they'll reset my nose and x-ray my jaw

Not a made up story, actually happened, I hate it

>>15048816
fucking kek

>>15048877
Thank you and I agree with >>15048239 I cannot give you an example to my knowledge. America is not an example America has huge amounts of lobbying and regulation hardly free. Please do explain if I am wrong.
Doctors are paid to be doctors. Not to save people and under a free market I do believe the quality would be higher the services faster.

>>15048916
How is a 2% income tax that can be entirely refunded "raping everyone else for eternity"?

>>15048973
The first that have to die are unironically medical personal. The less doctors and nurses survive the riots, the better the restart will be. Kill a doctor today, save future generations

>>15048988
>huur dotr kill the doctors and shit kek xD
Cringe.

>>15048877
problem with free market is, it brings out the crooks, we can see this example in cryptocurrency. That not say it is bad, it is only good for technical advancement via dawnism. Medical on the hand can kill a lot of people in the process.

>>15048924
Patents are unironically anti-market and their hindrance of healthcare procedures can (and ought) be viewed as a failure of left wing progressive-era reformist views which wanted to unite state and business for the good of everyone in society.

>>15048996
Boomerpilled
As said, I will target hospitals, old folks homes and when some humanitarian doctors try to save the life of some rioters the doctors. Death needs to become a common occurrence again if you live a degenerate life

>>15048983
Giving them less product for more cost, and degenerating society in the process by removing the costs to the individual inherent in unhealthy behaviour which necessarily and ultimately will result in fascistic health laws which aim to plaster over the societal degeneracy of unhealth

>>15048980
I do believe free market is the best we can get. Paradise does not exist and everyone cannot get what they want.

>>15049046
I am new to this idea. I started learning about the free market literally yesterday. Can you explain why you think it cannot exist?

>>15049055
Living requires time and time requires change and change is contrary to perfection.

>>15048292
Seething cucklett can't cope with counter-arguments. The amount of disinfo that /pol/tards spread is insane.

>>15049055
Different people have different agendas. Others want the rich to pay for their lifestyle, others want everyone to pay for their own lifestyle. Everyone cannot get what they want because their wants are in contradiction.

I like freedom and I like personal responsibility. I like free markets. They also work in reality, unlike communist fantasy. :)

>>15048161
Once you are mature enough to understand this picture things will be much clearer. Crony capitalism and insurance racketeering in the U.S is treasonous and wrong, but there's a reason why half the world tries to enter the U.S illegally at all costs while no one tries to enter Cuba illegally "because they have free healthcare".

>>15049028
Ignoring your fantasy scenario of perfectly timed worldwide riots that last a week and result in built overnight successful white ethnostates...
Shit stacked so high that any significant unrest would take everything back to zero. That means no semblance 'modern civilization' for a couple of generations at least. You want as much doctors and learned people as possible to pass knowledge on, otherwise its 2282 and people still living like mad max.

>>15049030
Average cost for private health insurance is like 2k. 2% of 60k is not 2k.
Nice math, retard. And nice spaghetti sentence.

>>15049055
because there is no such thing. Rich people will do everything in their power to lobby law in their favour. This is the power of free market.

>>15048161
I can only give you my experience, my country has "free" healthcare, three years ago i got testy cancer the "free" healthcare was actually expensive as fuck (on top of all the taxes that's supposed to fund this shit) and public hospitals are shitholes filled with dregs. My surgery I obviously opted to have in a private hospital but I couldn't afford to do my chemo there too so I went back to the public. Basically it's necessary if you're poorfag like me and can't afford private but it's also fairly shitty unless you live in a rich northern euro country

>>15049116
Show me a truly free market that works in reality.
>something that isnt crippled by regulation to enforce the success of select corporations and stifle the growth of small business

>>15049129
Where are you getting your intellectual facts and figures from? Who said anything about 2k, 60k or 2%? What system am I advocating for which utilises any of those figures? How can you predict these future numbers precisely? Why can't you understand the words I type - are you mentally deficient?

>>15048973

Yeah obviously you were told to wait you fucking pleb. Jesus people are so ignorant of how it works.

You were told to wait cos you weren't gonna fucking die you retard. Boo boo broken nose and broken jaw. Shit happens get over it. Nose cant be reset until a week later anyway. Your answer is literally "if he's not dying, let's review him when we have time and book him for surgery".

Those chest pains could be AAAs, aortic dissection, MIs, PE, a bunch of very serious conditions thay can kill you lightning quick.

Why would they prioritise you? The fact youre breathing, talking, alert, and have 2 physical I juries which are compromising body function, youd be in the ER for as long as it takes. Honestly before people become doctors they should be given a fill one day course on how stupid the general population is. This regard then posts on his Facebook about his shitty little injuries and how doctors were treating actually unwell people, rather than this guy who slipped on his way home and blamed it on Romanis.

Get a real life threatening condition then youll be seen no doubt fag

>>15049129
>Perfectly timed riots
>Doom for several generation
such a Boomer. Have a look at Syria, the Balkan wars... The reason to kill medical personal first, especially independent, is that it will strike fear in the hearts of those most dependent on them and acts as a demotivation for any degenerate behavior. It makes wars and riots unironically shorter. And about muah can't pass on muah knowledge, I didn't say I wanne burn the books, just create an artificial shortening on medical personal, raising the cost so high that the average Boomer can't afford it medical help, the "state" can't afford health and so a big chunk of dirt DNA will just die off

>>15049158
I am talking about socialized healthcare in my own country :^)

>>15049171
*not compromising

>>15048161
Instead of bioshit corps spending huge amounts of funding chasing a patent monopoly of a life saving treatment so they can make booku dollars they instead focus on cosmetic treatments and other things that aren't covered by socialized medicine so they can continue making profit for their investors. Private R&D for actual medical treatments gets slashed heavily and goes from being dependent on investors to being dependent on charities and government grants (see charities but slower).

On the plus side all currently known treatment and chemicals becomes MUCH cheaper as the government either bullies corp to sell at determined rate or nationalizes/revokes patient to create generic brands. Overall access to health becomes much higher and in general more country men live longer at the expense of shooting your rate of research in the foot. This can be mitigated if another country and their countrymen becomes the pay pig of R&D and you just steal all their research at WTO prices (see most of Europe post 1950s)

There is no win/win for healthcare you will always be making a compromise in some aspect. Socialization do certain things better Open Markets do other things better.

>>15048613
Tbqh this system is objectively better than the American one.

>>15049175
And what of it?
You've clearly never studied economics, and clearly lack any remotely developed analytic faculty, if you believe that "at this current moment in time, the amount that health insurance costs in my country is lower than two percent of 60,000; therefore socialized medicine is the best long-term plan for my country when taking all things into consideration"

brainlet tier epistemology
you're not proving anything any anyone can find hundreds of anecdotes which can be warped, snipped and moulded to fit their underlying theories

>>15049174
>Have a look at Syria
Shit hole that is plagued with war and is like a century behind western civilization
>balkan wars
Far from a "day of the rope" scenario

>>15049203
Youve yet to provide any example of social healthcare "raping everyone else for eternity" so whatever bro

>>15049206
You are such a Boomer
Hopefully you will be in such delusion to keep your failed system alive that you will go "protest" and become a fish in a barrel that can easily be killed with well thrown explosives and firebombs. Imagine Ukraine protest with independent groups with only the goal to kill as much people as possible

>>15049219
Metaphors are a manner of speech whereby one evokes imagery which is meant to relate in meaning (but not in physical actuality) to a certain thing. I don't actually believe that tax funded healthcare causes a permanent and literal hell in which everyone is raped.

Read a book and get a grasp on one theory or another so you're actually in a position to discuss this topic
You can't prove something to be better than something else in economics by finding one individual who hypothetically at this moment benefits from one thing other than another.

>>15049124
There is no such thing as free.

>>15049233
Mate I'm beyond I don't believe in this system. What you are saying is coming from a victim of all the social engineering on /pol/ and nothing else, it most certainly isnt conclusions you logically reached by yourself from critically analyzing everything in the political and social sphere without a shred of bias. Cleanse your soul and mind before you even think you could possible cleanse society lmao.

>>15049250
I see it as a gross exaggeration more than anything. Raping everyone for eternity is pretty fucking heavy. Ripping everyone off for eternity? Go ahead bro.

>>15049124
No one tries to enter North Korea, but lots of people try to enter Europe illegally. Having a for-profit healthcare industry in the US combined with big money's influence on politics leads to a system that is heavily sided with profit-makers and not citizens. Regulation isn't the enemy of capitalism and free markets. And a healthcare system that encompasses any tax payer (or citizen) is just a standard that a first world country should have.

>>15049329
The for profit healthcare industry in the US is the only place producing new medicines in good quantity. Fuck that, right?

>>15049307
>/pol/ social engineering
what a retard you are.
There is one generation that must go, the one born between 1945 and 1985 because of their ideological education, their believe system and their mass, and this includes all the individuals of the generation afterwards that are acting in their ideas - and those are the ones that go out and scream at the void during "protests".
Removing that generation through raising the costs of acting in their ideas, ultimately by the threat of dead, is what can save the western world from an economic and social catastrophe when the generation of treason and fever dreams of universal egalitarianism wants their gibs, at any costs.
>Muah rational arguments
>Cleanse your soul
Take your new liberal religion somewhere else, true believer

>>15049345
No it's not, businesses in the US are stifling innovation to keep their investments profitable. And lobbying for counter-productive drugs, e.g. opiates. It's scandalous. Also, the top pharma companies are not just US, that's just false. Roche and Novartis are Swiss, Sanofi is French, GSK is from the UK. Sure, there are also lots of incumbents that are US based, but a growing trend for startups and early stage innovative drugs are coming from emerging markets. And bio-tech from the triangle between Eindhoven, Leuven and Aachen in Europe.

>>15049419
Bro nobody cares about your retard monologue.

>>15049436
I see you have not invested in or researched biotech.

>>15049458
You have no clue if I have or not.

>>15049307
>Goes on twitter
>"Diversity is our strength"
>10K likes
>Goes on Facebook
>"White privilege"
>50K likes
>Turns on TV
>"This privileged white males don't understand that diversity is our strength!"
>Goes on pol
>Hey faggot, they're lying to you
>pol social engineering
Top kek

>>15049444
Are you afraid that mass propaganda has failed? That "education" has failed?
That the only way to keep the system alive and transition it into some communist fever dream to keep the ones currently in power at power is threatened by invisible wolfs that can damage it beyond repair at extremely low costs.

>>15049419
Btw if you did critically analyze everything from all perspectives with no bias the only conclusion that can be reached is that none of this matters. Its like the most insignificant thing in existence.
As for the need of an uprising or whatever.. What you see as degeneracy or whatever is just evil. If the end goal is to stop it why let it fill your soul? Or is the degeneracy seeping in and using one's values to pervert their own will? Focus on yourself nigger dont worry about others unless you wish to help them (without a bullet to the head). And read the Bible.

Im done shit posting now unless the rape guy replies later on cya

>>15049436
You. Are. Talking. Out. Of. You. Ass.
Almost all R&D is done and funded US side even by international branch giants cause that's where the money is.

>>15049171
>not acknowledging that those people are foreigners only here to leech off of the "free" healthcare system and other handouts and are not only the cause of said injuries but also impeding the treatment that only the injured party is actually paying for

Yeah people are so ignorant

>>15049174
Based tactical pyschopath

>>15049494
>nihilist detected
you don't. Do what your philosophical imperative predicts and kill yourself

>>15049494
there's no point discussing such nuanced issues in any form other than through long, thought-out and personal letters followed by in-person conversation on calm terms

Healthcare is a meme. Its already so watered down that real healthcare starts with the products you eat and exercise. Going to see a doc is like typing your symptoms into google. The guy will give you some pills, tell you take them each day before a meal and after a week you should be good to go!! Just learn about proper nutrition, itll get you farther in life.

>>15049476
Yes, yes. Newspapers to your precious safe haven on the internet. So many players in the game and the battlefield is everywhere. You just cant see half of it because youre being played.
People say take a few steps back but bro Im high on a mountain you gotta get up here.

Not to say that the entirety of the board is shills but seriously bro like for example what is with all the fake twitter screencaps and news headlines that result in 300+ replies of anons foaming at the mouth. For what reason would people do that? Seriously.

>>15049571
agree

>>15049494
>Focus on you
>Ignore the world
This is exactly why boomers are fucking pieces of shit and why the entire west is on a collision course with disaster. You should always put your own interests and you family first, but if you don't mark the health of your nation and the society in which you live as a 3rd priority, it will decay and rot until there is nothing left to pass on to your children but a cultureless, faggot worshiping, 3rd world garbage dump.

>>15049466
It shows from your writings.

>>15049590
>For what reason would people do that?
(You)s

>>15049498
>>15049345
The original claim was that only the US is producing new medicines. That claim is false. And yes, a big chunk of investment comes from US (as expected from the world's largest economy) but not exclusive to. Also you keep mixing decade old data in your info-graphics that don't really describe the complexity of the pharma sector. If you truly want to see where innovation stems from, see M&A activities and track corporate VCs from the leading pharma companies and see where the startups get founded and bought.

>>15049644
No it doesn't

>>15050119
Yes it does.

>>15050077
I never claimed US was the only place, I only claimed most of new treatments come from US. Most not all.

>>15050142
Fugg

>>15050077
>Also you keep mixing decade old data in your info-graphics that don't really describe the complexity of the pharma sector.
That decade old data is there to show you how countries like France which once rivaled the US in treatment patent production shredded 90% of its production as R&D was shipped off as a result of their social medicine programs. Now the whole of Europe accounts for half of the US' production despite single countries rivaling the US mere decades prior. Oh and by the way the US was still the world's biggest economy in the 1970s as well strange how well France's pharma sector was back then despite that huh?

>If you truly want to see where innovation stems from, see M&A activities and track corporate VCs from the leading pharma companies and see where the startups get founded and bought.
Ah so now that you've been called out for talking out of your ass with funding numbers now you want to talk about 'innovation as though buzzwords can be measured. Well nut up or shut up. I provided data showing how the US is bearing half the weight of medical research world wide and how in general world wide production of treatment rates has slowed by 50% ever since core Europe backed off for some strange reason. Can you provide any data that shows that "innovation" has increased as a result of socialized programs or are you not contesting the point that social health programs shred R&D and overall development?

>>15048161
There's no "free market healthcare". You may be referring to the "get royally fucked by insurance and pharmaceutical industries" system that America currently enjoys.

>>15048161
Germany just forces you to take a voluntary insurance. Nice newspeak right there.
I pay 94€ each month for having an home office job. If you ever have to go to the hospital you get to wait in line with all the hospital tourists and shitskins.
I don't see how medicare can be free or socialized, when all that means is you being forced into taking insurance.
What a fucking scam.

>>15050244
>>15050244
Swefag here, pay ALOT of taxes but very cheap when I eventually go to the hospital, about 30€ whatever the situation.

Every time I have been there I've had to wait a minimum of 7 hours so I would rather pay anyway. They are also understaffed and makes alot of mistakes, they even forgot me in a corridor when I broke my leg.

>>15050178
xxdddddd

>>15048215
free at point of sale. and yes, people do call roads free. "why take the toll road, the freeway is free".

>>15050190
Actually the EU had a greater GDP in 1980 than the US (2.9 vs 3.8 trillion USD). Now the US has a greater GDP (IMF). In your data, the chemical patents listed attribute 57% to the US in the 2001-2010s. 2018 comparing investments lowers it to 52% setting a downward trend (and keeping in mind that most data available is on US investments, so transparency isn't great). VC investments in later stage startups in healthcare are at an all time high. Innovation hasn't increased because of socialized programs, but it hasn't changed because of them either. The driver is emerging tech anyways.

You already have to wait months to see a specialist in this free market shithole.

t. waiting months to see a specialist

If you want no wait times I suggest being jewish

>>15050244
It shouldn't work for new immigrants. New immigrants should wait their turn/get charged premium as second class citizens until they prove themselves. Preferably by working a job.

All healthcare plans, public or private, are pyramid schemes that benefit the unhealthy. Any form of "healthcare" enables the individuals using them to shirk responsibility of their own health.
The morally justified system would be for everyone to be free to save or not save for their emergencies, and sink or swim based on their own decisions.

>>15048239
Switzerland faggot

Almost the USA in the majority of middle class areas

>>15048931
If road work happened more often than necessary the roads in my city wouldn't be so fucked up all the time

>>15048161
literrally everywhere has free healthcare except oligarchy shitholes like the US. wish i had the money to leave tbqh.