/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>14245499
Europe.
Works.

If I was rich and you tried to take like 2/3 of my income or shit I WOULD FUCKING LEAVE. doesn’t work faggot

>>14245616
>I WOULD FUCKING LEAVE
Pretty much this. Unlike non-rich plebs who are tied to their country, rich people already have residences in multiple countries, and can easily renounce citizenship and go somewhere else anytime if it seems like a confiscatory tax law is about to be passed

>>14245565
It worked for a while but now that they're shitting up the country with migrants, people will probably start to question why they're paying 2/3 of their income to support the shitting up of their country. This won't end well.

>>14245499
>taking money from whites and giving it to niggers has never been tried

>>14245616
>He fell for the run away meme
It works, because there is nowhere to run and if there is then these places are only for the ultra rich who will never allow you to join them (very high fees, for example look up Cayman islands and how to live there.)
Europe is a good example, the richest fled, but those who are rich because of a small or medium business can't.
The EU also works with the IRS and they give all financial information about EU citizens that reside in USA to EU.
Only corporations can do what they want.

USA used to have high tax rate for the rich back when it has its biggest growth. Retards say "bb-but the rich will just leave!!". Where will they go morons? USA is their market. Without the US market to buy their products they wouldn't make money in the first place. The point is to tax individuals instead of corporations, this way they will have to reinvest their money back to corporation instead of buying yachts

>>14245638
You wont if you make income in these countries were you fled.
If these people are just rich because of inheritance then there is nothing to fear.

>>14245666
>Europe is a good example, the richest fled, but those who are rich because of a small or medium business can't.
Way to completely undermine your own point, satan trips. Pretty much every country has progressive taxation, so they already tax the rich so it "works" in that sense. But when people talk about "taxing the rich", they generally mean taxing them enough so that they at least can't get any richer, if not making them outright poorer over time. So all you end up doing is driving the ultra-rich out, and taxing the upper end of the middle class, as usual. Of course I guess for yuropoors the upper end of the middle class is what you call "the rich"

>>14245703
You imply like I am a fan of this system.

>>14245703
the median european is richer than the median american. USA has few ultrarich that are pushing their average up and make it look like its the average american that is richer

>>14245673
Pleb tier logic. The ultra-high tax rates were a direct result of the war, as was the resulting economic boom afterward. Perfect illustration of correlation not being causation, but instead both things being caused by an unrelated third factor. As for the USA being their market, I suppose you've never heard of a multinational corporation with owners/shareholders that aren't US citizens

>>14245565
>Europe.
>works

>>14245732
>the median european is richer than the median american
KEK

>>14245732
Why are you talking about medians when we're specifically talking about the rich, and about how Europe has high levels of taxation that prevent anyone there from becoming ultra-rich? Can you read or not?

>VAT

Because for one thing VAT is a sales tax and it's a cost-like all other business costs-is one that gets passed onto the consumer directly you fucking stupid faggot ingrate retard lmfao

Taxes like VAT are the "mysterious force" that makes gasoline 8 USD per gallon equivalent in Europe or nearly as much in places like Commiefornia despite being part of the same geopolitical entity where it can be found for half as much elsewhere.

http://www.uhy.com/european-companies-struggling-with-the-worlds-highest-fuel-costs/

>>14245732
Americans, no. "americans", yes.

>>14245735
look the dates dumbass. the high tax rates were the result of the crash which was the result of the lowering of tax rates and deregulation of wall street
>>14245748
thats the point. you have fewer ultra rich but have bigger middle class. In USA people still go bankrupt after a visit to the hospital

Taxing the rich is based. Once you get past 5 million dollars you're only really spending your money on frivolous things that are generally overvalued. All this frivolous spending could be used to improve society like rehab clinics or homeless shelters, but instead it's wasted on shredded Banksy art. The only reason people who are poor support it is because they believe they will some day be rich and their experience of being poor has made them guarded of their possessions as well as imagined possessions.

>>14245766
>low taxes on the rich caused the depression
>still talking about medians as if that's "the point" when that's not what I or anyone else in this thread was talking about before you showed up
Alright, I see I've been arguing with an idiot, which makes me an idiot as well. Gonna correct that now

>>14245785
>medians are irrelevant
go learn some basic economics before embarrassing yourself buddy

>>14245499
>What were the results?
The rich pull a Gerard Depardieu exodus leaving the plebs in their own shit.

>>14245565
based and euro pilled

>>14245639
the migrant shit is a separate issue that doesn't invalidate the fact that taxing the rich works

>>14245793
I didn't say medians were irrelevant, I said they aren't what we're talking about and you should fuck off with your tangential bullshit. This will be my last reply to you, so please really do fuck off

>>14245782
this is the 105iq take
the truth of it is, as other anons point out, taxing "the rich" as a loose defined over 1M+ networth captures the upper middle class while leaving the ultra-rich and their shell corporation games less competition
which leads to monopolies, accumulation of wealth into fewer hands, undermined democracies, and essentially the collapse of society as a cooperative effort lifting everyone involved

>>14245820
>I said they aren't what we're talking about
median wealth is the metric you use to see if taxing the rich works dumbass. thats the whole point. You really are completely ignorant about the subject, try to educate yourself before posting next time

>>14245825
so the 1m is the problem? why not create more brackets? create 1m bracket and 5m bracket and 50m bracket and 200m bracket

>>14245825
This anon is 100% correct

>>14245565
Holy shit thanks to this faggot for reminding us how many retards without any understanding of basic economics frequent this board

Read a book. Seriously.

>>14245782
When you tax the rich, they leave. The "rich" can usually live and/or operate literally anywhere they want.

>>14245867
"read a book" is not an argument, mr. based conservative

Btw this isn't even a hypothetical for me, if the US raises its highest tax bracket to an unreasonable level, I personally will literally leave. Haven't planned where I'll move yet because there doesn't seem much prospect of that actually happening on the horizon, but I am rich (though not "ultra-rich", yet) and absolutely can and will do it.

>>14245867
>muh basic economics
Keep the cope.

>>14245894
leave and go where? Europe that has high taxes too? Or India and Africa and other shitholes? The thing is, the rich can leave, but their business can't. USA citizens are one of the biggest buyers of their product so if their profit is made by American buyers it will be lost by leaving. There are countries that have 0% tax rate right now, so by your logic why isn't every single rich person gone there yet since? Do they hate money? 0% is lower than any tax rate in USA

>>14245955
Basically this.

>>14245673
>we are their biggest market! AMERICA FUCK YEAH
Funny to see how in America, even a progressive leftist cannot get rid of the stereotypical American mindset.

How can you be so sure your country will still be #1 if/when AOC passes a 150% income tax on anyone making over 10k/yr?

>>14245978
Anon, I hate to break it to you, but you DO NOT HAVE TO BE A CITIZEN OF A COUNTRY IN ORDER TO DO BUSINESS THERE. I can't believe there are still people in this day and age who don't understand something so simple.

>>14245937
sounds like we have yet another great reason to raise taxes on the rich then

>>14246002
Are you stupid, that's even worse, if that country has no treaty with your nation, you pay double tax KEK.

>>14246002
yes but if you do business there you get taxed by the taxes of that country. Ofcourse there are loopholes to this that should be fixed
>>14245988
when did I say its the biggest market dumbass?

>>14246015
Literal cope. No, I don't want that rich man's money to pay for my government's services, he's mean and makes me feel bad, so he should just go away

>>14246027
yeah, we definitely want you to leave, thanks

>>14246019
You literally have no idea how taxes work. At all. Just stop.

>>14246020
You haven't addressed the point yet. What makes you think a businessman will do business with a country that openly wants his head because of ideology?

>>14245565
Europe doesn't tax the rich dumbass. Europe taxes the Middle Class.
Greece taxed the rich and see what happened.

>>14246043
keep coping

>>14246038
The funny thing about being rich is, I don't have to give a fuck what some salty loser on an imageboard wants. I love this country and want to stay, but if the wrong politicians get elected, I'll do what I have to do. Funny how that works

>>14246038
That does not sound very democratic.

>>14246055
What happened in Greece?
Very simple the so called taxed rich trashed the economy from faking economic data and taking out loans from the ECB that they could not afford.

>>14246058
Pointing out that what you said is factually wrong isn't "cope". You simply don't understand the difference between corporate and individual taxation

>>14246044
>openly wants his head because of ideology?
>taxation means they want to take his head
strawmanning hard. I said before that only personal taxes should go up and corporate taxes should go low. An actual businessman would love this as he would be able to reinvest all his profits without any tax, he would only be taxed if he cashes out to buy frivolous things

>>14245673
Biggest growth in US history was not post-FDR tax raises. Biggest growth in USA was the gilded age of the late 1800s.

>>14246113
because they started from literal 0. any growth from 0 would look the biggest

>>14246062
you sure sound like you care
anyway when taxes do go up you'll almost certainly stay because of inertia, which will prove our point: taxing the rich works.

>>14245499
>What were the results?
The rich people all left and it turns out poor people are lazy, unskilled and unmotivated, so it leads to mass starvation.

What happens is all the factories close down, the economy tanks, the money is offshore and you cant touch it. No one wants to invest in anything, no one wants to put any money anywhere because your next step is to take their assets like Venezuela did to oil companies. Simply kicked them out, said its ours now. What a great idea huh?

>>14246079

A couple examples

https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/work/taxes/income-taxes-abroad/france/index_en.htm

https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/work/taxes/income-taxes-abroad/netherlands/index_en.htm

https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/work/taxes/income-taxes-abroad/germany/index_en.htm

Good luck there with your difference in corporate and individual taxation.

>>14246182
>you'll almost certainly stay because of inertia
Spoken by somebody who has never had any significant amount of money. Really? "Inertia"? This kind of thinking is literally why you are poor.

>>14245660
>he thinks white people are rich

>>14246191
you'll look into a few countries with lower tax rates and then say fuck it, guaranteed.

>>14246130
This is a goal post move and the USA had always had a large industrial capacity since the beginning of that same century. US "growth" during the post-WW2 years was largely circumstantial and dependent on other factors like the fact that most transactions were still made with untraceable cash, nobody was filling out a W2 to report their income, and the fact that most wealthy American corporations were engaging in sketchy practices like offshore banking to hide wealth from the IRS.

>>14246101
So progressive and liberated.
You know what will happen in real life? They will just buy a luxury yatch under the name of their company.
>"my company needs a yacht because of reasons!"
I'm citizen of what would be considered a "democratic socialist" country and that's what happens in our reality. Oh, and because income tax is so high, this hurts employees as they can ever only hope to be as rich as their boss. Thus you have just increased inequality, so congrats to you and Bernie.

>>14246205
This guy is clearly living high on the hog, he needs to give Oprah reparations.

>>14246187
Yes that's all very nice anon, but what "income" am I going to have to be taxed by Europeans when all my profits from US businesses are simply reinvested in the business? No dividends. No realized capital gains because I don't sell anything. Then eventually US taxes go back down and I cash it all out. Ezpz

>>14246130
Gonna need a citation on that.

>>14245499
Taxing the rich doesn't work, what works is taxing people who can't avoid taxes, like the middle and lower class. The rich can move somewhere else as exiles all of the time. Tax the rich go ahead, but don't cry foul when they actually leave and less money is taxed.

>>14246213
lmao. USA before the 1800 was literal african tier. your only industry was slaves picking cotton

>>14246215
>rich people will just do fraudulent purchases to avoid tax
wow, thanks faggot. how about they get penalized for doing that dumbass

>>14246207
I've already lived for extended periods in 3 different countries, each of which has had its charms, although the US is still my favorite. You have absolutely no idea how trivial it would be for me to go somewhere else.

>>14246213
And of course the rest of the planet was a bombed out wasteland and left the USA with an essential monopoly on production.

>>14246248
>he keeps acting like anyone in america would give a fuck if he left

>>14246241
there are no examples in history of a country increasing taxes on the rich and then the rich doing a mass exodus. because it doesn't happen.

>>14246253
Yea, Trump should tell the CEOs of the big motor companies to fuck off instead of building 10 factories in Michigan. We dont need them, we can eat dirt cake like Haitians.

>>14246244
How will they be punished if they own politicians, courts and the best lawyers?
No sign of your democratic socialism working yet. Keep trying.

>>14246253
You're literally the only one in this thread who's persistently getting on my case about saying I'll leave, and trying to find bizarre reasons why I wouldn't, alternating with telling me that I should because you don't like me. Given that this thread is specifically about whether or not rich people can leave a country to avoid taxes, I think it's fair to say you're getting a little butthurt here buddy

>>14246244
> USA before the 1800 was literal african tier.

USA before 1800 was barely a country. And also please cite your source on USA being "literal African tier" because I'm going to call bullshit. If by Africa tier you mean USA was largely agrarian pre-1800 you are correct but so was the rest of the Western world so this is irrelevent. And like I said, I wasn't really referring to the late 18th century, I was referring to the early 19th century where the industrial revolution was flouring in the USA and what would go on to be traditionally referred to as the gilded age had yet to even begin. The USA objectively did not start from 0 economic capacity. This is just a bullshit cope you pulled out of your ass to move the goal post.

Europe's system only seems "fair" to them because first of all they're fucking effeminate retards and also because America's has been (((mismanaged))) directly on their faggoty dunning-kruger behalves for so long. In Europe you pay income and sales taxes like WW2 never ended to pay for the kids no one's having (the EU territory population only increased by 25% or so over the last 60 years-America's has very nearly doubled, but that's also in large part to a "refugee crisis" that's lasted more or less just as long), the illnesses the gratifyingly health conscious triple digit IQ population isn't contracting and the military it isn't funding (despite a certain important international agreement meant to intimidate possible challengers to western hegemony entering the world stage like China).

Europe's system relies on material economic protectionism where they dump products into the U.S. in particular duty-free and face zero foreign competition in domestic markets because no one's going to turn around and buy an American compact car for 35% more than a European one by fiat default as one example. This truly vulgar arrangement is particularly evident in the healthcare sector where companies like Sanofi and Novo-Nordisk (two European companies who control 72 percent or so of insulin production world wide) charge EU and third world countries unsustainably low prices their company wouldn't even break even on and charge unsustainably high prices to their "allies" in the U.S. to the point where people are literally dying in the street-and through all that we have to hear their little gay command economy surface level success story used as an anecdote for why the completely unrelated system of ccommunism works (it doesn't lmao) by literal dick sucking faggot trannies. FUCK (YOU)

>>14246262
>http://expatandoffshore.com/blog/top-ten-tax-exiles
These are a few example of top UK musicians avoiding taxes by going offshore. Trust me when taxes become too high and you can make better profits somewhere, they will leave. And you would too, if you were making a lot of money and you had the power to move wherever you wanted.

>>14246265
>we shouldn't tax the rich because the rich wouldn't pay the tax anyway
so by your logic increasing the tax to the rich wouldn't matter since they won't pay it anyway right?
>>14246285
thats the point dummy. the industrial revolution was obviously the biggest growth for all countries because they all started from 0 aka agrarian society, my argument was obviously for the industrial period not before that

Im going to take the lack of replies to my posts as commies being BTFO and not having any arguments. Im not even a capitalist but youre fucking dumb.
Im also leaving the thread so you cant just go back and reply them because I made this post, this post is you admitting defeat.

>>14246341
communism doesn't have taxes. taxes are part of the capitalist system

>>14246276
it would be great if pricks like you left, but sadly i don't think you will, if heaven forbid your taxes increase by 10%. you will rationalize staying because the costs of moving and redoing your whole life in another place most likely is higher than just paying the extra tax. this is ignoring the fact that you are almost certainly larping as a rich person anyway.

>>14246322
>>14246322
>thats the point dummy. the industrial revolution was obviously the biggest growth for all countries because they all started from 0 aka agrarian society

Except the gilded age did not occur during the industrial revolution, which was my point. The industrial revolution had already laid the foundation for America's economic output, so they did not objectively start from 0, moron. The industrial period is often cited by historians as ending around the mid 19th century. Gilded age occurs post civil war and only built on a large scale economic capacity that the United States was already capable of.

>>14246360
You fucking faggot, who's talking about leaving if taxes go up by 10%? Your jealousy and resentment are sickening and pathetic. If you weren't so distracted by your butthurt you'd notice that in my very first post here I said "confiscatory" tax rates, like the 90% top marginal rates the US used to have.

>>14246370
>Except the gilded age did not occur during the industrial revolution
only that it did

>>14246406
90% taxes is a strawman. and back when the US had it, it was during war time, and patriotic rich people were happy to pay it.

>>14246433
It's not a "strawman" you jealous idiot, it's the literal subject we were discussing until you decided to chime in with your snide comments. Jesus, the fucking self-righteousness on some of you leftist losers is just unbelievable.

>>14246410
So you're just lying now. But even if you claim that the industrial revolution was simultaneously existing with the gilded age, it would be (It wasn't), it is objectively apparent that industrial revolution had already been in full swing since the early portion of that century. We are talking almost a half century of industry already existing before what would become the greatest growth in wages in US history. Most of Europe was not experiencing such a degree of wealth in that period despite their previous industrialization. If anything millions of Europeans were literally migrating to North America for economic opportunities.

>>14246478
you sure sound angry

>>14246480
industrial revolution ended in mid 19th century only for UK not for USA. Your gilded era was basically the late industrial period

Corporations in the EU aren't taxed extraordinarily high either in most countries by the way, just their pathetic, state-worshiping dumb fuck people LMAO

>>14246478
he's saying that the ~90% tax rate was during war time; patriotic rich were willing to pay during a world war.

they wouldn't be willing to pay however to absolve stupid faggot liberals of their student loan debts or give you free access to hospitals so you can go to the emergency room every time you stub your toe.

just get a better job if you aren't happy with your quality of life, quit looking at the rich for handouts, it makes you look pathetic.

>>14246509
You sure sound like you've tried every possible argument and got btfo on every single point and "haha ur angry" is all you have left. Talking to self-righteous losers pisses me off sometimes, so sue me.

America doesn't even make sense, how the hell is somewhere like Mississippi on paper richer than most European countries but on the ground is a complete shitole?

>>14246522
>was basically the late industrial period

No, it wasn't. But even if I were to take that into consideration the gilded age was not occurring at a time where we were starting from 0, because the industrial revolution had already been in full swing for basically the entire century. Just admit it, moron, FDR's America was not peak economic growth.

>>14246535
>he's saying that the ~90% tax rate was during war time; patriotic rich were willing to pay during a world war.
The US is perpetually at war. If I were alive during WWII, I may well have been happy to pay 90%. However, I'd be less enthusiastic about funding things like the Korean War or the Vietnam War, and since the top rate remained at 90% until the 1960s and was 70% until the 1980s, this is a terrible argument.

>>14246587
now you're sounding more and more like a LARPing /pol/ faggot

>>14245736
You are about 0.10-0.15 more optimistic
My euro shithole has lower fertility rate than japan
Because salaries are just enough for the rent...without the food for the entire month

>>14246522
>USA started from 0
>Umm actually your largest wealth explosion in fact occurred later on in a period of economic growth

Do you have any smooth brained wojaks in your image folder to share? I need one that looks like you

>>14246570
even if it wasn't literal 0 it was still during the industrial period, most of that growth was purely technological and had nothing to do the system. Its funny how your entire argument is completely irrelevant with my original point since I was obviously talking about the modern era. I might as well say that prehistoric humans going from hunter gatherer to agricultural society was even bigger growth. Your premise is irrelevant and has nothing to do with the modern era growth

>>14245673
This is false when you begin to take into account the EFFECTIVE tax rate.

>>14246601
What the fuck are you talking about? Every single thing I said is factually true. Did you just not know these things or what? What are you even doing in this thread then?

>>14246609
learn some history brainlet

>>14246535
For the record, pointing to the 90% tax rate (that no one paid, look it up-the effective rate was closer to 46%, still extraordinarily high) actually proves the argument that "the rich" cannot simply whisk away the economic or social problems facing hundreds of millions of people, because the debt to gdp ratio at that time had reached its ATH regardless of this rapacious and unsustainable arrangement. Communists don't understand basic ass division though because they're fucking failures in every aspect; they don't care about being truly right, or doing what's best for others, they want to drag everyone they can down to their pathetic level. That's why they make drive-by threads on boards like this and then run the fuck away back to where they can outright ban any discussion that doesn't involve the minute differences between their gay horoscope-tier splinter ideologies.

>>14246680
all we want is rich people to pay for a universal healthcare system like europe enjoys, and maybe fix a few roads and shit? it's really not that big a deal.

>>14245673

>>14246610
>Biggest growth in history occurred under a 90 percent tax rate! It was effectively socialism!
Umm actually sweetie the largest economic growth in US history occurred in the late 1800s.
>O-okay, yeah there was bigger growth there, B-but you s-started from z-zero!
Actually sweetie industrialization had already been in swing for a half century by that time. ;)
>U-ummm o-okay, it wasn't actually zero, I admit it, but the growth wasn't actually economic, it was actually all technological!!!!!

Jesus christ, how many times are you going to move the goal post?

>>14246714
>had already been in swing
but it didn't end brainlet. late 1800 was still during the industrial era for USA. How dense you must be to not get this simple thing?

The real red pill is that the rich aren’t even really actively defending this stupid system, it’s the everyday reactionary/angry Trump voting boomer-uncle/temporarily embarrassed millionaire.

The truly wealthy today are only so through investment, and the role of being invested financially is highly replaceable. Bill Gates’s financial portfolio could literally be broken up and handed out to a million people, and it would make no difference whatsoever OTHER than allowing people now who would otherwise be forced to ‘grind’ to now have more liberty to put their minds to functional, creative pursuits that would enrich the world even further.

I know several people personally who inherited vast amounts of money and will never have to work a day in their lives. If you spread out the money they have among say ten people, all ten would still have enough to avoid working for others, and you’d be far more likely to end up with some of them investing their time in pursuits that generate wealth (whether financial, cultural, social, etc)

>>14246680
At least part of that, during WWII, was an intentional social policy though. Remember Roosevelt's "no war millionaires" thing? I think there is a legitimate argument to be made for this when your country is facing an actual existential threat, and although I have no way of knowing I think I'd probably have supported it. If the country is not about to be literally destroyed if we don't all band together, the situation is entirely different.

>>14246624
>>14246702
This desu senpai

Who's going to tax the rich anyway? Liberals who are bought by the rich? Republicans like Trump who are rich themselves?

O I'm laffin at the very thought

>>14246702
I think besides whatever accounting trickery the rich might have used for outright tax evasion, part of this may simply be due to foregone income. If after a certain amount of income any subsequent income gets taxed at 90% aft, why bother to make income in the first place that you'd only see 10% of?

>>14245616
>I WOULD FUCKING LEAVE

Where to, China? Don't make me laugh buddy. You think tax havens like Dubai will last forever? They're microstates without an army, eventually they'll cave in if the rest of the world wants their taxes back.

>>14246799
Stop trying to steal other people's money.

>>14246816
>t-taxation is theft
nice meme, gramps. i see you have no actual refutation to his excellent post.

>>14246799
If that logic worked, we'd already see massive marginal tax rates in every country. Why hasn't it happened? The Jews or something? In reality, countries are in a global competition for productive citizens who produce tax revenue, and there's a level of top bracket taxation well below 90% or whatever (probably below 50% too) at which any given country will maximize its revenue. If we end up with a world government what you're suggesting could happen, but God willing it never will.

>>14246816
Amazon paid 0 taxes in 2018 and even got federal money. Same with Netflix. I'm not the one who's stealing.

>>14246832
tell us where you would move to, please. how about a list of 3 countries.

>>14245499
>Why do people keep saying this? Has it ever actually been tried? What were the results?

The implementation is usually bad and targets the upper middle/middle class primarily, rather than the "rich", who have the means to evade/minimize taxes and assets in many kinds of investment vehicles that aren't taxed like income.

See California for a good example of this. The middle class there is getting squeezed hard right now, while Democrats have unchecked power to enact any tax policy they please.

>>14246341
you are based

>t. lurker anon

>>14246832
>Where to, China? Don't make me laugh buddy.

That's exactly what happened though.

>>14246862

Some of the worst income inequality in the union too, Cali and New York both. Nightmares for middle class working people.

>>14246832
>Where to, China? Don't make me laugh buddy.

That's exactly what happened tho

>>14246853
I don't need 3 countries, I'd probably just go to Russia where I'm already a citizen of, the tax rate is a flat 13%, and the whole country is run by ultra-rich rapacious oligarchs. Not exactly my first choice of where to live, but I'd rather live there and be able to make money than live in the US and not be able to. Of course it's a moot point because we're not going to see massive tax rates in the US for the foreseeable future as far as I can tell. The federal government is too weak and polarized right now.
I bet you really thought I wouldn't have an easy answer for this, retard. Why don't you just stop making a fool of yourself and go shitpost in another thread?

>>14246825
Violate the NAP and I will kill you, vermin.
>>14246851
I agree that is wrong.

>>14246694
>all we want is rich people to pay for a universal healthcare system

this is unfeasible for so many reasons, the way you trivialize something like that confirms your status as an eternal brainlet.

>>14246897
>Russia
top fucking kek

>>14245499
>yfw there's incels who come to hyper capitalist cigar afficanido SharePoint to shill for a meme candidates and think taxing the "rich" isn't just increasing taxes in the middle class and working class peoples.

It's almost spooky that there's people are still left of spectrum fiscally

>>14246892
meant for >>14246799

>>14246908
lmao
You're so fucking stupid you don't even realize how utterly btfo you are at every turn in this thread. Sad

>>14245616
But rich people dont leave.
They just find a loophole and hide their money

>>14245499
>What were the results?
Off-shore accounts, some rich people move, use of loopholes, etc etc. I have a well-off friend from Belgium and he moved because of the high taxes, but kept his citizenship and can just go there whenever either way. We're in a globalist system and I find it funny how leftists preach to tax the rich when they are so keen on promoting the same shit that allows the rich to freely move around as they will.
Not to mention that the modern liberal movement is backed by literally 95% of the huge corporations around the globe and the "revolutionaries" has never stopped for a second and thought to themselves: "Hmm, I wonder why the elites of society are actively backing us and promoting our ideas.. and I wonder why the super rich elites of society that does everything for money are backing our call for a ridiculous tax increase on the them (the rich)".

This world is so fucked right now it's barely not fun, barely. Clown world.

>>14246972
There's usually no really legal way to just hide income these days. It's really better not to get involved in financial crime, the governments take that shit really seriously. Better to just leave.

>>14246973
its amazing how brainwashed someone must be to think the rich are pushing for more taxes to the rich

>>14247038
...are you legitimately retarded?

You know rich people like Pelosi, de Blasio, et al favor tax increases right? And they're some of the wealthiest people in politics.

>>14247107
indeed. pelosi and de blasio are some of our finest americans. selfless, loving, and patriotic.

>>14245499
>Has it ever actually been tried?
Russia, 1919
>What were the results?
Weren't so good, chief.

>>14247107
>pelosi is rich
imagine being this dumb. she is 100 years old and barely has 10 millions net worth, almost as much as her government salary added up over the years. Also, anecdotal listing of people is irrelevant. Imagine being this dumb to think rich people as a whole want to be taxed more, your small brain is running backwards

>>14247155
You are obviously retarded. Nacy Pelosi is worth way more than 10 million as her networth.

This is almost embarrassing

>>14247198
nobody said every single rich person is against taxes moron, but obviously the majority of them are. Imagine being this retarded

>>14246973

This is why I think Democrats are the biggest cancer in this country. They push high taxes and high globalism, a recipe for national suicide, and they know that their brainlet ass electorate wouldn't realize it until it was too late, and then still not realize it because as long as you control the schools and the media YOU control the narrative.

>>14245499
capital flight and brain drain

>>14247155
I cant tell if you're trolling. Nancy's husband is worth 400m and there is no prenup

>>14247218
Imagine being so stupid and wrong you have to move the goal post further with each post.

You're 20 posts in and you've been BTFO repeatedly.

You know what he said, you're just asshurt you can't defend it and have to twist >>1424697 words. He's making the point that the political elite, like the ones I named are in favor of taxes on the "rich" and you just can't seem to grasp these concepts.

Warren, Pelosi, de Blasio etc. who are all wealthy want higher taxes, which fit the bill as elites of society.

Are you a street shitter? Do you not,have reading comprehension?

>>14247259
so nancy wants her husband to get poorer from taxes? is that part of their evil grand plan to destroy america? moron

>>14247319
The lack of critical thinking is quite disturbing

>>14247313
so let me get this straight moron. Rich people will leave the country if they get taxed more, but at the same time rich people want more taxes for rich people? Yeah, you are a literal retard. Go back on your wheelchair

>>14247225
The problem is that people who understand economics tend to lean much further right than people who don't, even if not all of them are die hard conservatives, BUT there just aren't that many people who understand economics in the first place, since it's generally not taught in high school. It's just politically way easier to present the Democratic platform to an uninformed electorate, which seems to be the only kind of electorate that has ever existed anywhere. Unfortunately this means that the Republicans can't really make their actual good economic argument, and instead have to insanely pander to their own uninformed electorate. Really the only thing democracy is even good for is to prevent things like Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union. In every other respect it's a shit system.

>>14247334
your low level of intelligence is disturbing, but not shocking, the majority of people are low IQ brainlets like you

>>14245867
>basic economics
I read advanced economics.

>>14247313
Stuff like this >>14247336 is exactly why I just stopped responding to this anon early in the thread, it's a waste of time to talk to him

>>14247376
>I am too dumb to make any arguments so I stopped replying
thats a weird way to say you got BTFO brainlet

>>14247347

It is shit, the cards are stacked against pragmatism from the start, but yes it's pretty much the only way to prevent a total despot from seizing power. Another problem with it is that humans are biologically programmed to favor that which is popular, so all you have to do to make a political platform palatable is to... make it popular. Give it the impression of popularity, even. Both abortion and gay marriage were wholly unpopular in polling, before the courts forcibly legalized them, the media endlessly championed them, and Americans slowly came around to accepting the new paradigm. Even now people who literally saw a tax cut this past year, think they didn't due to the media blitz against TCJA.

JAPAN POST BANK is Bottom price NOW!!

Blue-chip stock and laggards stock
It's code is 7182

Japanese state-owned bank.
Its Banks will never go bankrupt.
Stable and continuing dividend.

>>14245499
Obviously the rich will all emigrate to Somalia to avoid paying taxes!

>>14247336
The point again is very simple you're too stupid to grasp it.

>modern liberal movement is backed by literally 95% of the huge corporations around the globe and the "revolutionaries" has never stopped for a second and thought to themselves: "Hmm, I wonder why the elites of society are actively backing us and promoting our ideas.. and I wonder why the super rich elites of society that does everything for money are backing our call for a ridiculous tax increase

i.e. you're literally proving his point by not asking yourself why these people like Nacy and Paul Pelosi back these far leftist radical movements and their associated policies

It's amazing how stupid you actually are

>>14247376
Yeah dude, spooky. At this point the guy is legit retarded or correct the record

>>14247399
yes retard we get it. The rich are anti-rich. The evil plan of rich people is to make themselves poor in order to destroy you. Yep, you make a lot of sense pal, we believe you, you are not retarded at all

>>14245673
Despite having higher tax rates, the tax receipts were similar to todays levels. In other words, there were also more loop holes to prevent people from paying taxes.

>>14247417

"The rich" aren't subject to income tax like you think they are. They support higher tax brackets that primarily hurt the upper middle class, to be fed into the government redistribution system, and doled out to their loyal consumer slaves (who save literally nothing and spend everything put into their pocket). They understand the demand side economy well. Their investments are in equities, bonds, and property, they aren't wagie slaves that have to think about income tax.

>>14247459
thats why I said we should increase the bracket values, if you actually read any of my posts. there should be 10m bracket and 50m bracket and 100m bracket. You aren't gonna tell me now that people that make 50-100 million a year are middle class too now are you?

>>14247459
Truth. If they were really serious about "economic justice" or whatever, they would try to push through a wealth tax like Elizabeth Warren. But of course even something like a 3% annual wealth tax, which would definitely be considered insanely confiscatory by just about anyone, is really a bit of a joke for the super-rich because if you can't find a way to earn well over 3% with your capital as an ultra-wealthy person you're a bit of an idiot. But of course, we probably won't ever have a wealth tax here, because the left looks after its own too.

>>14247470

You aren't listening. Capital gains aren't taxed like that. These people sit on a mountain of wealth, they don't actively earn income that's taxed through W2, they passively earn it in the stock market or in property and effectively only pay 0-15% in taxes on their gains.

Why the fuck do you think New York and California both feature the richest people in the United States, are the most Democratic states in the union, and have the worst income inequality at the same time? How are those tax rules and regulations working? It's a farce, my man, there are rich people who unabashedly favor no taxes and globalization so they can do whatever they please, and then there's another class of rich people who favor ENTRENCHED wealth and realize high taxes are a way for them to enjoy the fruits of consumers while paying a minimal amount themselves.

>>14247502
the fact that loopholes exist for rich people isn't a relevant argument against taxes for rich people, the only thing you are proving is that loopholes should be fixed not that taxes to the rich are bad

>Make less than $40k per year
>Still pay 21% in taxes every year
Fuck taxes. You don't have to be rich to NOT WANT TO PAY TAXES. How are you people so fucking brainwashed that you willingly want to give more money to the government?

>>14247542

What I'm saying is that governments will always be corrupt and servile to the elite class, so your priority should be to limit their influence, not cheerlead their expansion of power.

>>14245749
>>14246315
>>14246523
>>14246680
>>14246892
>>14246910
Just a reminder that /biz/ will never succumb to shit rhetoric from disingenuous proselytes-and a reminder to /biz/ that these people aren't interested in a debate, they're interested in "winning" people over even if proven time and time again beyond a reasonable doubt that they are completely dead fucking wrong in every way shape and form. They don't actually care if what they propose would be better for working people or not because by now they know it wouldn't.

>>14247656
corporations are made of the same people in government and they are both corrupt. the point is to have a balance of power between them. Maybe if you have too powerful government they will run over you and oppress you, but in the same way if you have too weak government the corporations will own the government and they will again run over you and oppress you

Read Mandeville fable of the bees you dirty communists

>>14245499
Back when the financial system wasn't as complicated it worked. Back in 1950s America the rich were taxed 90% I believe? Fuckers built most of the antiquated infrastructure we have in the US during that time. Public education was top tier. You could actually buy a house on an income straight out of high school.

>>14247735
the marginal rate was 90% for the very top, not the effective rate. effective income tax rate has been steady at about 18-22% through that period until now.

>>14247756
Fuck it, all I'm saying is that life would've been comfy had we been born boomer.

>>14247698

We are well beyond the point of outsized corporate power in the US. Corporations can't demand 30% of everything you own at the point of a gun, legally.

A pragmatic government that only attends to what is necessary: public works, infrastructure, national defense, and general administration, including regulation of corporations, could be done for half the total revenue currently funneled in.

>>14247693
That's one retarded pic you got there. Capital isn't a one time use thing like money, capital generates additional wealth over time.

>>14247775
boomer prosperity was due to conditions unique to that time and not because of economic policy. large parts of the developed world had been devastated by the recent war, but America was untouched.

>>14247828
>conditions unique to that time
What conditions?
How does large parts of the developed war being devasted lead to boomer prosperity? Doesn't that mean that most of the developed world (i.e. where the should money be) can't purchase any US goods? How exactly does that help?

>>14247775
i was going to reply but this guy said it fine >>14247828

hard times (war) created those comfy times. it didn't come for free.

>>14247788
a weak government and filthy rich people will result in the same way. the rich will own the weak government that will demand everything you got at a gun point legally. Filthy rich people managed to brainwashed the middle class in thinking that tax to the rich = tax to the middle class, they made them their useful idiots in defending them

>>14245673
No one paid those high rates you turbo retard. There were all kinds of deductions that people had available that aren't available today. Once we got those ultra high rates, was the zenith of our productive capacity. It's been all downhill ever since. The power to tax is the power to destroy.

>>14247878

You have it backwards. A large state is a weapon of the rich and those who can curry influence with their resources, not a weapon of the poor or average. The only reason the poor are considered in the US is for their votes, and after they've been tricked into their latest round of foolish voting it's business as usual. Again, see Cali and NY, exemplars of this concept.

>>14247892
yes moron, and look how the maximum tax rate continuously went down while the lowest remained the same. you are making argument against loopholes not taxes

>>14247914
high taxes doesn't automatically mean large state. Thats how the UBI solves this problem, instead of the government spending taxes on your behalf, you get to spend the money yourself. UBI is unconditional, it requires almost no bureaucracy to be distributed, even a computer algorithm could do it

theres a shit tonne of bootlickers ITT

>>14245616
>I WOULD FUCKING LEAVE

This argument always makes me laugh because it's the dumbest shit ever. Rich people (white and non-white) all prefer to live in places that still have white people. Imagine being a billionaire and having to live in some African shithole where everyone was black. Even if your fortress was impenetrable, you wouldn't want to go anywhere. My point is, every year, there's fewer places to run to. White flight, or in this case - rich flight, is a fucking meme and a TEMPORARY measure.

What will actually happen if you tax the rich too hard is they'll just learn to evade even better. You'll probably see crypto shoot up.

>>14248037
this. there is nothing more pathetic than wagecucks sucking the corporate boots of their wagemasters

>>14247806
>thinking the organization that brought us the legendary Department of Motor Vehicles could simply confiscate a billionaire's business ventures and they'd perform as good or better as they did
>unironically suggesting nationalizing retail

LOL

>CEO makes a hundred dollars per year per employee through a voluntary employment contract that pays this generic employee tens of thousands of dollars a year

Theft! Abuse! Outrage! Inequity!

>Government takes tens of thousands of dollars per year from those same generic employees at gunpoint through an unspoken contract they signed the moment they squeezed past their mom's fat pussy lips

Based! Gotta pay our fair share! Muh roads!

>>14247950
You're wrong and fucking retarded, Yang already admitted that UBI (i.e. allotting the government 2.7 trillion in additional spending each year up from roughly 3.1 at current-all while imposing an additional federal sales tax) would not take the place of conventional benefits except in cases where it'd be lower. So Jamal the SNAP recipient will go from $300 a month to $1000 in benefits, but Janice the social security senior will still get her $1,2000 a month in SS; the bureaucracy goes nowhere and simply adds 100 million hands into the pot. It is almost identical to the idea of giving "free money" and guaranteed loans to college students like they started in the 60s, and will lead in the very short term to the complete destruction of the US dollar, OBVIOUSLY, you fucking menthol smoking dark skinned bonobo

>>14248106
when did I say anything about Yang dumbass? the best scenario would obviously be for UBI to replace all other welfare, not add up to it

>>14248064
Riiight, cause of course only an African nation would have the bright idea to lower the tax rate just a little to attract rich people, because they want the fucking revenue. Tax rates are a competitive bidding process between nations, like it or not. The only way to get tax rates globally high in all white nations is a massive international tax treaty, and that hasn't happened before. Maybe it'll happen in the future, but I doubt it. Until then, if even a single reasonable to live in country "defects", over time you end up back in the equilibrium of moderate tax rates we have today.

>try to tax rich
>rich are smart and powerful enough to avoid taxes
>end up taxing the middle class and giving it to niggers
every time

>>14248106
>social security is a benefit
Fuck off retard commie.

>>14248498
>put tax for people that make over 100 million
>you are middle class
>you don't make 100 million
>so you dont pay tax
that wasn't so hard was it

>>14248498
The IRS will continue to go after you for taxes even if you emigrate and renounce your citizenship. At the end of the day it has nothing to do with "can't" and everything to do with "won't." If ZOG wanted to, Jeff Bezos would be in prison and his family in a concentration camp, until he paid back the entirety of his back taxes he owed.

Screw the rules they have money and makework for lawyers.

>>14248550
>The IRS will continue to go after you for taxes even if you emigrate and renounce your citizenship.
Not true at all. There is an "exit tax", which basically means you need to realize all your capital gains and pay the capital gains tax before you renounce your citizenship. That's why you do it BEFORE some crazy ass tax law gets passed. Just apply a bit of foresight, and there's nothing more the IRS can do. Unless you think the US is going to try to arrest or confiscate assets of a citizen of another country who is not a US citizen and has already paid his US tax obligation in full.

>>14248550
I don’t think he owes any taxes. He has equity in amazon and will only get hit with capital gains when he sells. Amazon doesn’t even get taxed either since they reinvest all their profit into more facilities and general infrastructure.

>>14248512
It's what they're fucking formally referred to as you fucking stupid decrepit brainless lump of shit

>>14248117
UBI is garbage for the same reason Pell Grants, Stafford and Perkins loans are shit. It will have the same effect on the larger economy + we get an ever-expanding new federal sales tax to go with it, sounds fucking great having everything quintuple in price within three weeks and doubling the national budget on behalf of one program.

Now are you going to try and promote UBI by parroting the results of those discredited "experiments" wherein they give 100 geographically segregated people a small amount of time-sensitive pocket change a month amidst a normally functioning economy and pretend that this somehow represents a better example of how nation-wide UBI would work than our existing benefits systems do or what? It's about that time I'd say. Go on nigga, tell me how Finland giving like 40 people $400 a month proves UBI works lmao

>>14248594
you are too dumb to get it but UBI would benefit white people more than minorities. Right now minorities get way more welfare,w ith UBI everyone would get the same. Keep defending minorities uncle cuck

>>14248641
Who do you think pays taxes and makes net contributions? You fucking retarded NEET.

>>14248700
so... are you saying only minorities should get welfare? got it, cuck

>>14248641
I'll take that complete non-sequitur/red herring as an admission that you are completely out of your element in having to think even two weeks into the future you frickin' dummy holy shit just give up and go back to your tranny board before you embarrass yourself further

>>14248723
I'll take your non-argument reply as admission you are nothing but a brainlet parroting talk points from Fox and posting retarded collages made for 30 iq moron schizos

>>14248708
Taxation is theft, dumb nigger.

>>14248763
go live in Somalia then tard kid

>>14248498
Why not have the system fail?

>>14248739
>destroying the US dollar would benefit white people
>"defending minorities" by arguing against benefits entirely throughout the thread

Nice projection schizotard; I'm just adding some fucking flavor to my well-sourced and truly compelling arguments for fun while you sit bored out of your mind shilling ineffectually on auto-pilot for your tranny overlords back on 8gag. See you tomorrow when you come back here to get BTFO for free again lmao

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Somali_Democratic_Republic

>The Somali Democratic Republic (Somali: Jamhuuriyadda Dimuqraadiya Soomaaliya, Arabic: الجمهورية الديمقراطية الصومالية al-Jumhūrīyah ad-Dīmuqrāṭīyah aṣ-Ṣūmālīyah, Italian: Repubblica Democratica Somala) was the name that the Marxist–Leninist military dictatorship government of former President of Somalia Major General Mohamed Siad Barre gave to Somalia during its rule, after having seized power in a bloodless 1969 coup d'état.[4][5][6] The putsch came a few days after the assassination of Abdirashid Ali Sharmarke, the nation's second President, by one of his own bodyguards.[6] Barre's administration ruled Somalia for the following 21 years, until Somalia collapsed into anarchy in 1991.

>>14248783
My beliefs align with the principles of the founders of this country. Taxation is theft is a rather extreme position, but I would say that MOST of it is. Income tax was not even constitutional back then. So no, I'll stay here. Go live in Sweden faggot.

>>14246055
What happened in Greece was due to the fact they taxed fucking nobody because basically everyone there was engaging in tax avoidance. They are literally the last country in Europe not to have a land registry, they only ramped up having one because the troika pressured them into actually making the collection of property tax possible to pay off their denbs (and it won't be finished until 2021). Despite this dire fiscal situation Goldman Sachs & co cooked the books so that Greece could join the eurozone as if its finances were just fine, turned out it wasn't so.

>>14248811
founders are dead retard kid. maybe rethink the somalia thing, I think a 30 iq brainlet would fit just right there

>>14248806
>durrr muh inflammation
another dumb boomer talkpoint. you are like a parrot with downs syndrome

>>14248037
Fuck off back to your gulag, commie, and WORK HARD for your comrades.

>>14248852
>founding fathers don't matter because they're dead
>a privately created fiat currency with no backing such as the USD which can be inflated on a whim, destroying your savings in the process, is not a valid concern
>taxes are good! give me your money!

You are a disgusting rat. I hope to cross paths with you one day.

>>14248934
UBI is not printing money moron.
There is nothing more pathetic and cucked than retarded wagecuck morons like you defending your wagemasters. go lick some more boot cucktard

>>14248958
I made my point about the USD, not UBI, you dumb fuck. I don't work for anyone, but myself and my family, so go fuck yourself. Not waging either, but there is nothing inherently wrong with that if it is a voluntary agreement between individuals. Nothing is free in this world, even if you lived in the forest, you still have to work to survive.

>>14248985
and here comes the larp. Let me guess, you are a 200 iq millionaire industrialist that contributes alot to society but those evil taxes bring you down right? you can't hide your cuck boomer mentality tard

>>14249020
The funny thing is that you are utterly dependent upon others, primarily through their good will. You siphon the fruits of their hard work, to yourself. They do it for you because they are family and they probably love you. You want to force this on everyone, through taxation, so that worthless people like yourself can feel secure. You're an entitled parasite, things will not end well for you. I'm 22 so no, I'm not a boomer. And I'm not a millionaire either. But every tax hurts because I know it's going to worthless people like you. I'd voluntarily pay taxes to military and police and courts, but that is all.

>>14249072
the irony is that you are just as dependent on others, but you are delusional enough to think you are not. You are so dumb and brainwashed by boomers, you are a little cuck slave. Go lick more boots cucktard

>>14249083
I am dependent upon others through voluntary transactions. I pay for my bread, unlike you. It would be cuckoldry for me to give you free money. I don't think you're brainwashed, in fact you are very clearly working within your own self interest, as am I. Do your mother a favor and make her breakfast in the morning when she is getting up for work, she will really appreciate it. She deserves it, it must be stressful to think that her son might be a worthless lowlife. The noble NEET is a monk or a survivalist, not a leech who pushes for theft.

>>14246248
>You have absolutely no idea how trivial it would be for me to go somewhere else.
Larp

>>14249110
you sound like a moron using those dumb ancap terms. The fact that you willingly work against your own self-interest is the ultimate cuckdom. I bet you were watching those cool cowboy shows when you were a kid and got brainwashed into thinking being a cuck slave = cool rugged individualist

>>14249110
Bro, seriously just stop talking to this guy. More anons on /biz/ need to learn this trick for deflecting trolls, it works really well. Nobody thinks he's "winning" any of the idiotic arguments he picks, so it's not like you have to worry about that. It's self-evident that you're right and he's obviously subhuman trash. So you should follow that to the logical conclusion and realize that you're wasting time and effort talking to subhuman trash, which has no benefit to you or anyone else.

>>14249142
I am a minarchist. I do think it is wrong to push for something immoral such as theft, even if it benefits my self interest. Your intentions are clear: push for theft so that you don't have to work. If society evolved to the point where every single thing was automated, and we where post scarcity, then I would probably accept a similar system as to what you want.

>>14249141
>I can move to another country if I want
>No you can't you larping faggot
ok then

>>14249163
Yeah you're right, but I do enjoy debating. I should stop engaging though, you are right.

>>14249176
there is no theft. you are using that word to evoke feelings of injustice when there are none, this is part of your brainwashing, praise your masters and present them as the victims, the same masters that would steal from you without a second thought and throw you in the dirt

>>14249187
Seriously, doing this has improved my /biz/ experience immensely. You just have to pick your battles, there are a lot of anons here who are actually interested in real debate. Then all you have to do is avoid the ones that aren't, and there is no better way to do that than tell them that you aren't going to respond and why, and then just not respond. It works like a miracle.

>>14249163
you got BTFO kid, you couldn't find any arguments so you shut up like a little cuck. stay dumb

>>14249212
yeah, choosing to debate morons and avoid debating people with actual arguments must work fine for you. keep riding the kiddy train little brainlet

>>14249212
I like how these people say that moving to another country is hard. Someone with no money could do it with a credit card and a passport. The only problems are family. And well an existential problem for me is, the lack of good laws. Castle law, stand your ground law, and conceal carry do make me not want to leave the USA.

>>14249254
individualists have no nation, they are cosmopolitan parasites that move from place to place, they seek the places that profits them the most and when it no longer benefits them they move on

>>14249254
I would never leave the US unless I both became ultra-rich, and the US also went back to really aggressive taxation of rich people. For a middle class person or even someone who's moderately wealthy I think it's hard to find a better place to live. But if you strike it rich, the situation changes because ultimately money is power and you can live in a lot of places very comfortably if you have money and power in the local system.

>>14249277
I agree with you on that. But don't even try to larp as a national socialist now LOL. You have no honor, integrity or loyalty.

>>14249360
your individualist ideology is a paradox, it eats itself. If you aren't rich that means taxing rich people would be in your best individualist interest, this is the endgame of individualism, what you are doing is the opposite of that, you are cucking yourself to benefit others for some abstract notion of fairness. A true individualist doesn't care about fairness, if you have the opportunity to take something from someone for yourself, you just do it

>>14248958
>UBI isn't printing money, a 10% VAT sales tax will cover $1,000 a month to 250 million people

learn math you fucking cuck permavirgin retard workbootlicking gay twink homo lmfao

>>14249384
I am not your cookie cutter straw man individualist. I never claimed to be a pure egoist or whatever you're trying to label me as. I see hierarchy as legitimate, and I still adhere to my moral beliefs. If someone violates them, it doesn't matter if they are rich or poor, it is wrong. This is only a problem if you believe that inequality inherently arises from exploitation.

>>14249403
why are you repeating Yang's policy moron? when did I say anything about Yang? you think Yang invented the concept of UBI? go educate yourself before embarrasing yourself you cucktard bootlicker brainlet

>>14249429
you are a moderate individualist being ruled by egoist individualist masters, the rich people that you defend don't care about you because they are true individualists that would steal from you without a second thought, thats how they went to the top in the first place

>>14249471
Pretty much the only way someone could steal from me right now with enough backing for me to not resist greatly is taxes, so I do not really understand how this fits into your paradigm.

>>14249471
I invited you to show your work r.e. UBI earlier you niggery diggery doo, you just obviously had the epiphany that yes, the "UBI" experiments have all been worthless given they don't create any conditions distinct from conventional benefits services, but like a true red rumped workbootlicker commie retard you're choosing to press the issue anyway while having no intention of owning up to your odious faggotry.

>>14249513
>durr muh commie
communism doesn't have taxes or welfare moron. taxation is part of the capitalism system. go learn some basic economics before throwing buzzwords like a retarded boomer parroting memes you braindead cockguzzler

>>14249523
>communism doesn't have taxes

Tell that to communist scholar Paul Cockshott(cockbutt) who made this text-accurate model of Marx' labor credit system I'd posted earlier you detestable nigcumpoop

>>14249523
How would a communist society provide public services if there are no taxes?

>>14249555
you are just embarassing yourself now. its almost as if you are a parody of a retarded boomer that calls "communism" everything he doesn't like. go educate yourself

>>14249556
I don't know, try asking a communist

>>14249142
And yet you keep repeating the bootlicking meme phrase over and over.

>>14249589
you suck corporate boots. does corporate boot taste different from government boot?

>>14245499
the rich already pay the most taxes, you are probably talking about communism

>>14249593
I'm not the same guy and I am unemployed. I do some freelance work but that's it.

I just found it ironic that you'd call him out on something you were doing yourself (repeating overused terminology that has been fed to you)

>>14249618
because I myself found it ironic he was using the same terminology he was fed on me, so I used it on him

>>14249573
>I don't know, try asking a communist

I thought you would know since it sounds like you were defending communism.

>>14245499
the result is rich people move to an other country and gdp drops

>>14249651
yeah that happens a lot to uneducated people that think everything they don't like = communism

>>14245499
The more money you have the easier it is to pay some tax attorney to avoid paying any taxes or just move money to other countries
Amazon didn't even pay taxes. I'm convinced the best solution is Yang's VAT. Can be adjusted to be higher on luxury items and lower on consumer staples.

>>14248106
It actually stacks on top of Social Security fren.
Janice would get $2200.

>>14246055
>greece
>taxing anybody
>especially the rich

>>14246262
Uhh hello? Panama? The Bahamas? Are you retarded? This shit happens all the time because the Government can literally do nothing about people leaving. If they do they are violating agreed upon rules held by 99% of all nations.

>>14245499
It works very well in Northern Europe. Look at the GDP per capita of Norway, Iceland, Denmark and Sweden. It might not work in the US because of your “culture”.

>>14249985
Also, look at crime rates, levels of education, overall happiness etc.
but as I said, we have a very different culture and demographic than the US.

>>14245499
taxing the rich in theory means capital flight in practice. you can try taxing them all you want but you won't be able to if they're not around.

>>14249660
> neocon talking point
> no source
Why don’t you have a look at the statistics instead of of repeating what Ben Shapiro told you? Have a look at the numbers from a country like Denmark (where the wealthy are taxed at a very high rate). The vast majority of wealthy people there don’t move.

>>14245499
If you were a billionaire, would you stay in the US when they start taxing you 70%?
No. you would legally renounce your citizenship and live like a king elsewhere

>>14250009
>>14250026
Again, no sources.

>>14250009
>>14250026
You can perfect prevent capital flight by closing tax loopholes and taxing unrealized gains when people want to move out of their country. But of course American lobbyists and “special interests” wouldn’t allow that happen.

>>14250009
>>14250026
You can prevent capital flight by closing tax loopholes and taxing unrealized gains when people want to move out of their country. But of course American lobbyists and “special interests” wouldn’t allow that happen.

>>14245499
Didn't Bill Clinton quite succesfully balance economy by taxing the rich?

What’s ends up happening when people say tax the rich is that middle class people earning 50k+ end up paying more tax while actual millionaire and billionaires move their cash offshore

>>14245499
Andrew Yang doesn't want to "tax the rich" in the same "eat the rich" manor as sanders etc. He wants a carbon tax and dividend, 0.1% wall street financial transaction tax, and a 10% VAT (european countries are around 20%). He is for a progressive tax rate but doesn't sound like he would change it much. It would be wasted political capital to do so anyway considering how ambitious his policies are. The rest of his funding for policies comes from cost savings in other areas like welfare and homelessness/drug services and increased tax revenue from growth.

It’s more of a matter of how much you tax the rich. High corporate tax is not good for the economy

>>14245565
It does work, but not because we're taxing billionaires 90% on income. We aren't. We just have the highest brackets come in sooner. In the UK for example we start paying 40% on income over £46k, and the highest bracket is still "only" 45% and comes in at £150k. And we have a 20% VAT. That's how we can afford a strong welfare state. Most of western Europe is great for business and usually several countries are ranked about the US is the relevant metrics, things like less red tape and low corporation taxes etc.

>>14245499
In the United States, as well as most western countries people are being taxed already to a rate that is 99%. Income is taxed at 50%. But that's not the limit, you have to pay taxes on this money that you've already paid taxes on as well.

In addition to income tax, there's real estate tax, VAT or sales tax, death tax, gasoline tax ... it just goes on forever. You're only done paying taxes when the government has taken all of your money and your left with debt.

How's taxing the rich going to work? Everyone who could be taxed has already been taxed into poverty.

You can't real tax the Rothschilds, Openheimers, Rockefellers of this world, because they're the ones who you are paying taxes to. About half that tax money goes to pay for the "national debt" which is owed to those guys. They OWN your fucking government.

The endgame of Yang is to get rid of payroll tax for individuals and we would just have the VAT, business income tax, and corporation income tax.
Eventually rich people would only be taxed more than everyone else because they spend more and would be paying more VAT.

>>14247542
you can't fix loopholes for capital evasion because capital makes the laws in the first place. offshore structures are not a part of nature. they're deliberate constructions built by top men in banking and politics
world business works on global scale, meaning the ultra-rich gets to incorporate wherever convenient choose which juridiction applies to them. don't like EU regulations but want access to the EU market? incorporate in malta
ergo, any law about "taxing the rich" you get will be carefully designed to only ever hurt the upper end of middle class, those who present a potential danger to the current rulers
let's take a moment to realise we're having this conversation on a shitcoin trading board where half of the users gave their hard-earned wagebucks to a fat fuck in plaid who hangs out in san francisco... while his startup is incorporated in the cayman islands

>>14245565
implying Europe's system would work with all the nigger's and retarded minorities here. Economic growth in Europe is not that strong, and Europeans can't afford to buy a house. Several Countries have major debt issues.

>>14245616
This. The government is too inept to try and grapple with the ultra wealthy. "like a high school physics teacher trying to hang out at CERN"

Furthermore, the government already spends way more money then it fucking has. You are going to crush people who worked hard to gain wealth in Taxes? THe first years of running a LLC I got fucking crushed by employment taxes.- So I could pay for anchor babies, niggers, and boomer fucks. No I am dabbing on the IRS with the S-corp life. Social Security is gonna be toast.

>>14245565
>Europe
>Works
On an average 10,000% annual GDP in real public debt across EU nations, the more socialist the worst. All the public pensions of Boomers, the social security system, the welfare system and the mis investments of all those funds will break Europeans nations neck in the next 5 to 10 years, and there is no solution; no amount of importation of debt slaves, no amount of wage stagnation or reduction, no kind of "debt cuts" can save the Boomer bubble. Children will kill their parents, politicians and public worker will be hung and beheaded, people will starve in the streets and cannibalism will rise.

Thanks everybody for making the 1930's hunger times and the 1970's stagflation look like a walk in the park.

>>14250099
China tried this, they failed m miserably. The estimation is that they had around 25 trillion capital flight in the last 10 years alone.

>>14245782
People should be able to do with their own money whatever the fuck they want, rich or poor.

>>14250099
The US already does do exactly that, Doesn't stop shit. Why don't you bother to check even the most basic claims before posting?

>>14250508
Yep, as has been said many times in this thread, "taxing the rich" in practice means "taxing the middle class", like in this example.

>>14246816
Based and redpilled.

>>14250431
vat punishes the poor most

>>14245616
This

>>14245616
the problem though is that the system is, by nature, inherently uncompetitive and unfair. so if you don't tax them, you have to prevent them from becoming unfairly rich (unfair given their contribution) in the first place. which sure as hell hasn't happened in places such as the states.

>>14252408
>it is not fair
>the goy should all be equally po..rich

>>14251820
Not when they're receiving $1000 a month at the same time, which is what Yang is proposing.

>>14252408
>"unfair"
Every single one of your ancestors past one or two generations back would bitch slap you right across the face for this kind of thinking. Real life isn't fucking kindergarten. If everything's so unfair, why don't YOU become unfairly rich and stop complaining? Worked just fine for me, my parents moved with me to the US right around when the Soviet Union collapsed with absolutely nothing and thanks to the "unfair" conditions of the US I'm the first person in my family line to be wealthy. The attitude that things need to be fair is why my family spent half my childhood on the verge of homelessness.

>>14251820
1. You can tailor it towards luxury goods and impose a lower rate/exempt certain consumer staples.

2. Not when you are receiving an extra $1000 a month under Yang's plan. You would have to spend something like over $170k yearly to negate the basic income you are receiving... those people aren't poor.

>>14245499
#yangang baby

>>14245499
>Has it ever actually been tried? What were the results?
It is regularly tried all over the world.
The result is that people of means and wealth move away from the over-taxation and incorporate elsewhere, thus denying an enormous amount of economic power to the abominably retarded socialist retards who attempted to enact such policies.

If you tax the wealth, the wealth leaves. It is a careful balancing act of enticing wealth with business opportunity of dumb materialistic middle class, but not taking too much from them. Tax loopholes exist to maintain the presence of the wealth, and allow them to escape taxation to a great degree.

Any nation that closes its tax loopholes and begins to oppress the upper class enjoys mass exodus of the highly educated professionals and wealth which they can never replace.