/biz/ - Business & Finance

http://www.amazon.com/The-Party-Secret-Chinas-Communist/dp/0061708763

It's a bubble.

>>133878
state capitalism

>>133886
What kind of bubble?

Whats growing it?

>>133896
housing bubble

>>133896
china builds citys non stop and no one even lives in them. china also manipulates its currency and nearly all data.

>>133878
>the world's 2nd biggest economy
Fixed that for ya.

>>133878

But it isn't the world's biggest economy. It's GDP is a little bit higher than Japan's (with 5 times the pop of Japan). And a decent amount of China's supposed growth is really them just cooking the books. A potemkin economy, if you will.

This began in the late 1970s, I don't know why people call it a "miracle".

Deng's Four Modernizations were announced in 1978. That's like 36 years of economic policy heading in a single direction.

>>133878
> become the world's biggest economy

It didn't.

>>133906
>>133910
>>133936

But its exports, its products, its what constitutes the majority of its GDP.

I mean they have a big influence on the planet, Africa being the hotbed for chinese investments atm, this cant be caused by a mere housing bubble

As numerous people here have already told you: the economic miracle is mostly a spoof. Consider for instance the insane local government debts.

>>133943
You said it became the biggest economy in the world. It's didn't. China's GDP is 56% the size of the US GDP as of the end of 2013.

>>133943

The Chinese central bank has printed several times more money that the Fed and BoJ COMBINED in the past few years. This flood of cash has led to malinvestment of the highest order, primarily into massive real estate projects.

ghost cities and the WTO

No minorities
No white guilt
No bullshit things like feminism

>>133953

sorry, i'm retarded, how's it malinvestment? shit looks like its getting done in africa/specifically nigeria

>>133988

gee what a coincidence it is that everything you disapprove of also happens to be the bane of western civilization

get the fuck outta here

>>134006
If by getting done you mean christian and muslim militias slaughtering villagers, then yes.

>>133951
I was just generalising, my mistake if i was wrong

I am just seeking the source to all the influence it has across the geo-political scene

>>134030
> all the influence it has across the geo-political scene

It doesn't have that either.

>>134037
What are you talking about?

China has a big influence in the geo-political scene.

>>134006

Google "ghost cities of China"

It's malivestment when you spend trillions building cities that no one moves into.

>>134050
You know nothing about international relations if you believe that. China doesn't have a single real ally in the world and only a couple of loose ones. Meanwhile it has numerous enemies, provides no alternative whatsoever to the current international order, has internal problems out the ass (e.g. they spend significantly more on domestic security than they do on their military), etc.

>>134062
oh my god have you ever fucking done anything business related in your life this is /pol/ tier


just wow

>>134073
> i'm ignorant as fuck about international relations so you must be from /pol/

That's what you sound like you willfully ignorant sack of dog shit.

>>134078
>i know absolutely nothing about china and international business

it's like you've never taken a business class in your life you mongoloid

>>134062
Enlighten me.

China is in good economical relations with everyone because it benefits them, subsequently Africa is pretty much owned by china since they heavily invest in their economy, making good friends with the continent

>>134090
He doesn't have anything to enlighten you with because his opinions aren't based in facts or reality, he's the village fool of this board, just ignore him and move on

>>134087
The conversation we are having isn't about Chinese business you fucking illiterate nigger.

>>134090
You are buying into the overstated myth. China has seen notable resistance from local populations and some backlash because their investment does very very little to benefit the country in question. The Chinese might go in an build some road and a refinery, but the vast majority of what the build is for their own purposes and not the betterment of the country at large. And many African countries still have very real relations with European powers and the US. The idea that China has a monopoly on Africa is a total myth.

>>134056
>"ghost cities of China"
Just did. I'd fucking love to live in a giant city with only 70k people.
If only the internet wasn't shit, I'd retire there.

>>134099
Fuck yourself you fucking nigger troll. You are contributing literally nothing and are completely and totally ignorant as to what the conversation is even talking about.

>>134099
You haven't even stated an opinion of viewpoint bro. You're in no position to call anyone out.

>>134110
>The conversation we are having isn't about Chinese business you fucking illiterate nigger.

Is this anon for real? Did you pass 3rd grade reading? toppest of the lels,

Confirmed for not being able to read. Calling me a nigger, you must be good in the business field with that attitude m8 :^)

Did I soil your bottom when I confronted you on your retarded delusional beliefs?


>Still hasn't posted any evidence to back him up
>only argument is UR RONG NIGR XD

A third grader could literally learn more knowledge than you have amassed in your entire pathetic life by reading a Dr. Seuss book

>>134123
>>134118
nice samefag bro, tell me more about how china isn't relevant some more

u gonna call me a nigr again :^) im waiting 4 ur epek comeback :D

>>134129
How the fuck is a discussion about China's place in the international economic system a discussion of specific Chinese business practices?

You know what don't answer. I know you're a troll.

>>134141
>implying business doesn't go hand in hand with china's place in the international economic system

it's like you've never taken an economic class either m8


>hey guys, my delusions are being challenged, better call him a troll! ;)

>>133878

Debt.

The government purposely (and illegally) kept the exchange rate low.

This meant that the US and EU could buy cheap shit which they did by the tonne.

China was awash with cash that it used to invest in more infrastructure than any nation in history.

This gave economic incentive for the rural farmers which make up most of its population to move into cities (it's own industrial revolution).

The bubble allowed it to buy as much military hardware as possible.

The size of it's army allowed it to invade nearby territories and start a war with Japan in 2017 because China is still 100% madd about Japanese occupation.

The China-Japan war popped its bubble and collapsed the global economy because it stopped selling cheap shit to the US.

The happening happened.

/pol/ was right all along.

>>133943
Like others have said, China artificially devalues its currency by printing massive amounts of money, keeping it low compared to other currencies. This is a massive benefit to the exportation business, but it's generally frowned on diplomatically. There's also the issue of the massive income disparity, which makes the US look good on that matter. The country side of China is basically third world still. They've tons of other internal problems, too, like the housing bubble others have mentioned.

It might not matter, China could stabilize and everything will be fine. On the other hand, if they DO collapse, the fall will be absolutely brutal and could possibly cause a cascade effect on the rest of the world.

>>134136
>>>/b/

>>134136
Go ahead and explicitly tell the class how China is a dominant world power.

We'll wait.

>>134150
Either make a specific argument or shut the fuck up. You are speaking in the vaguest possible way to avoid acknowledging that you don't even know what your own argument is.

>>134153
But that's what it is, anon

You're just being a contrarian because you're one of those fedoras with second opinion bias who thinks the opposite of the commonly held and proven beliefs must be true

pls prove it to me or else get the fuck out

>>134153
>Go ahead and explicitly tell the class how China is a dominant world power.

....is this guy for real? fucking moot shouldn't have ever caved and made this shitty board

>>134159
Name some major international financial institutions that China controls. Name some global trade regimes that China created and controls. Name some international political systems that China dominates. Explain why ~20% of their population lives on < $2 per day.

>>134162
We're still waiting.

1 billion slaves.

>>134166
>>134166
I like how you still can't prove shit

your unfounded contrarianism is showing, fedoro

just like those who claim the moon landing was faked, show me some hard evidence or gtfo. it's okay, I wouldn't expect you to know that. But now you know.

i'm fucking waiting.

>>134176
It is not contrarian at all to claim that the Chinese are not a dominant world power and that they face serious internal problems. That is a widely held view in academia and the public at large.

Meanwhile you're just being a shitty unsubtle troll who is actively avoiding making an argument.

So before you say another fucking word, EXPLICITLY state what your position is.

Anon's guide to being just like China

Step 1. Acquire a gorillion people

Step 2. Put them all to work and whore them out for very low prices

Step 3. ????

Step 4. Profit

>>134185
>It is not contrarian at all to claim that the Chinese are not a dominant world power and that they face serious internal problems. That is a widely held view in academia and the public at large

confirmed for never having taken a business, international relations, or economics class or for that matter anything in general

>Meanwhile you're just being a shitty unsubtle troll who is actively avoiding making an argument.

You have literally not backed up any of your arguments with solid fact to prove that china is not a dominant world power

>So before you say another fucking word, EXPLICITLY state what your position is.

i can tell reading is hard for you :^(

>>134194
10/10

You outright refused to even state your argument. Committed troll.

>>134200
if you cannot deduce my argument based off what I posted you are a fucking idiot and a shill


>argues like a contrarian tinfoil neckbeard that china is not a dominate world power posting no sources or backing up his claim against the commonly held and proven belief

>anon please back yourself up before making ridiculous claims

>U FUCKING NIGGER WHAT ARE YOU EVEN ARGUING FOR???? ADUHDDUDURRR...I know let's call him a troll because I can't back any of the shit I say up
fucking shitposters like you are gonna run this board into the ground

>>134221
China is a regional power. Fact. They don't project military or political influence beyond their immediate neighborhood in any meaningful way. In fact their foreign policy strategy explicitly states that they don't want to.

> shitposts harder than anyone in this thread
> complains about shitposting

Also
> shill
>>>/pol/

>>134221
> proven

Wait what the fuck? You ask for someone to prove their point and then make a totally unsubstantiated claim with no supporting evidence. Wow.

>>134233
>They don't project military or political influence beyond their immediate neighborhood in any meaningful way

wrong

also

>implying those two facets are the only things that can qualify you as a world power

>telling someone to go back to another board


nice maymay bruh, all that shitposting must have left you a sour dough bitch.

>>>/lgbt/

>>133878

okay. >world's biggest economy
is obviously a troll.

But strictly speaking, what country in the world has _not_ had an 'economic miracle' after WWII.
Japan had one (Showa era expansion)
Korea had one
China has had one
the US has had several, but the legendary one would be the 1950's
Germans have had one (Wirtschaftswunder)
Even the FUCKING FRENCH have had one (look up les trente glorieuses)

All this talk about 'economic miracles.' Such bullshit. It just means the gov't not fucking things up for a certain amount of time. Things soon return to the norm, however.

>>134244
Show where they send sizable military forces outside of their neighborhood. Show where they have formal allies. Show where they have pushed their political system on other countries.

>>134241
>china bring a world power a "totally unsubstantiated claim"


here i might as well get ahead in this even though I don't fucking have to

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/07/10/china.mullen/

my lordy

>>134254
You don't even understand basic political terminology. Read about the comments more. China has been referred to as a great power, not a superpower. There's a difference.

>>134262
>moving the goalposts

another nonsensical argument from you. keep it up bruh. you're totally convincing everyone

I've been waiting for this topic

>>134147
>currency devaluation
Yeah, where do you think they learned that trick? Oh, the other two most successful non-western nations, japan and korea. It WILL work.

>>134145
this is mostly correct

Except china won't invade japan. Most likely they'll become the new germany-france buddy partners to enforce asian hegemony in politics.

>>134110
>china has a monopoly on africa is a myth
Right. The west COULD build things and extract resources, but we don't. So it is, effectively a monopoly, even if it isn't by the dictionary definition

>>134056
You realize that half of the housing built in the US since 08 remains vacant, right?

>>134266
> Right. The west COULD build things and extract resources, but we don't. So it is, effectively a monopoly, even if it isn't by the dictionary definition

But that's wrong. The West extracts fucktons of resources from Africa.

>>134265
You haven't even stated a position yet. You're just a hypocritical cunt at this point.

And if your general argument is "China is a dominant power", you haven't provided shit for evidence to back that up.

>>134265
You're the only person here convinced that China is a superpower.

>>134282
>You haven't even stated a position yet

confirmed for illiterate
>>134221

>And if your general argument is "China is a dominant power", you haven't provided shit for evidence to back that up.
>>134176
>>134254
>>134262
>great power, not a superpower. There's a difference.

this is straw grasping if i've ever seen it

keep movin dem goalposts to support your unsubstantiated conjecture you haven't done shit yet


i l l i t e r a t e

Well this thread turned into a troll fest... awesome...

>>134295
still haven't even attempted to address >>134251 or >>134166

>>134297
>there's no way I could be wrong...must be those trolls again

>>134302
I don't have to

China has been described as a prominent world power by many military and political figures across the globe and you expect me to back up my argument which i've proven multiple times because you're a contrarian

no anon

you're the one being a fedoro

that's your job


you aren't even fucking hiding your ignorance anymore

>>134303
I'm not even part of your little shitfest conversation douchebag.

>>134269
>the west extracts tons of resources from africa
but that's wrong, faggot

Africa has all of zero infrastructure, making it expensive as hell and next to impossible to extract anything besides oil and gold for a profit

One example: it is cheaper to pay australians 30$+ an hour to extract rare earths than it is to pay africans .50 cents a day to do the same work, because in africa there are no roads, the materials get confiscated, etc. etc.

Africa has tons of resources, and the chinese are sending their own in to get the job done.

>>134295
still waiting for a real response that isn't "no ur rong xd"

>>134309
But you haven't proven it even once. You posted a single link referring to a single comment made by a single person. The only global reach China has is economic, not military, social, or political.

>>134313
Are you fucking joking me? Western oil companies are and have been active in Africa for decades as have mining companies.

>>134315
That's simply one piece of proof in an entire fucking ocean, anon

you argue like moon landing deniers

and you

wont

convince

anybody

>>134314
Still waiting for you to make a single point that isn't a massively vague generalization a la "What I say is right because I say it's right"

>>134322
> proof

I don't think that word means what you think it means.

And I'll say it again, China's global reach is purely economic. It is not military, political, or social.

>>134324
you're not fooling anyone anymore, ruseman

the literal can go back in this thread and read the response, you're full blown broken record mode now

>>134328
> you're full blown broken record mode now

The hypocrisy fucking burns.

>>134328
>literal

literate* excuse me

>>134327
>your face when

>>134331
Cite the post where you showed the Chinese military doing significant globetrotting. Cite the posts where you showed the Chinese doing large scale social outreach around the world. Cite the post where you showed all of the allies China has.

>>134320
I already mentioned oil. And guess what they're mining? Gold.

Why is it that africans working for 50 cents a day cannot compete against australians who work for 30 dollars an hour?

We are not effectively tapping into african resources. They are basically untouched as of right now.

>>134343
But the point is that the Chinese aren't, never have been, and never will be the only foreigners extracting resources from Africa.

>>134345
Your point is that the chinese aren't the ONLY ones

My point is that they are the MAIN ones, and that they are doing more work there than the rest of the world COMBINED.

Would you like to understand the ramifications of the difference between the two facts?

>>134333
no you seen anon you have to prove to us all that they aren't a significant world power


asking questions isn't a substitute for evidence


keep denying that moon landing, bro

>>134349
Can you back up your assertion that the Chinese are extracting more than the rest of the world combined from Africa?

>>134350
The moon landing absolutely happened you fucking faggot.

> you have to prove

Says you. You have made only a single extremely vague point this entire thread.

>>134360
>Says you.
says how fucking rational arguments work

you challenge a commonly held and proven belief like china being a prominent world power, you better post some fucking sources or no one but you is going to give a shit about your opinions

yes, your opinions

It's partly a big hoax; book-cooking and money-printing in Beijing to make themselves seem like bigger players than they really are.

However, some of it's real, and it shouldn't be a surprise to anyone. When a nation industrializes, worker productivity is multiplied across the board. And China had - and still has - a fuck of a load of people whose productivity is now being multiplied.

It'll level off, mind you. As infant mortality rates drop as a result of moving into the 21st Century, so will birth rates and standards of living, until China's big economic advantage is functionally gone. It's happened before and it'll happen again.

>>134368
Why are you intentionally ignoring

> China's global reach is purely economic. It is not military, political, or social.

And now you are saying that your OPINIONS (yes, your opinions) are fact.

>>134354
http://resourceinvestingnews.com/41702-china-africa-mining-sector-investing-barrick-gold.html

I get most of my news from france-inter, so unless you are fluent you might have problems with my sources.

But the chinese have built 90% of the cellphone towers in africa. They've paved more roads in the last few years than had been paved in the preceding 50. They are creating the majority of the new jobs for africans, and make up the largest group of immigrants inwards to africa. Oh, they've also taken up the main role, supplying more than 50% of the electricity to many areas.

>>134376
>China's global reach is purely economic. It is not military, political, or social.

because that's also fucking wrong and that's your shitty opinion that you have not provided any evidence for

>And now you are saying that your OPINIONS (yes, your opinions) are fact.

no, it's not opinion, it's the commonly held belief in the world right now by anyone who actually matters. you are making a challenge against the notion that china is a prominent world power please cite sources or keep your opinions to yourself

>>134382
I didn't deny that they have invested the most recently. I'm asking you to prove that they are taking more resources out of the continent than the rest of the world combined. Oil most notably.

>>134385
> because that's also fucking wrong

Why is that wrong? You haven't answered that simple question yet.

>>134391
>Why is that wrong?

>why is my shitty contrarian opinion not founded in any sort fact or reality wrong?

gee i dont know anon

>>134388
Here is the answer to all of your questions

"The 53 countries in Africa possess only 9 percent of the world’s proven petroleum reserves compared to almost 62 percent for the Middle East. But Africa remains largely unexplored and may well be the location of significant future oil and gas discoveries. IHS Energy, an oil and gas consulting firm, believes that Africa will supply 30 percent of the world’s growth in hydrocarbon production by 2010. A U.S. Department of Energy study projected that African oil production would rise 91 percent between 2002 and 2025. African oil also tends to be high quality and low in sulfur, making it particularly desirable to refiners. Although much less significant than the Middle East as a source of oil, Africa is no longer a marginal player, and has become especially important to the United States and China. Libya’s 39 billion barrels of oil reserves and Nigeria’s 36 billion barrels are both twice the size of China’s proven reserves and just under twice the size of American reserves.
China now obtains almost one-third of its imported oil from Africa; this compares with one-quarter as recently as 2004. About two-thirds of all African exports to China consist of oil. Twenty-two percent of U.S. crude imports came from Africa in 2006; this compares with only 15 percent in 2004 and slightly exceeded U.S. imports from the Middle East. U.S. oil imports from Africa have nearly doubled since 2002. Both China and the United States are projected to increase their percentages of imports from Africa. While Chinese imports from the Middle East have fluctuated around 50 percent in recent years, they are projected to increase. At the same time, China is reluctant to become excessively tied to the Middle East as a source of oil. China also lacks refinery capacity for the heavier crude that comes from the Middle East. "

https://csis.org/story/africa-china-united-states-and-oil

>>134398
You have been asked before and you're getting asked again:

1) cite some major Chinese military deployments outside of their immediate neighborhood, either for humanitarian or combat purposes. Show where they have permanent bases outside of the mainland.

2) Show where China has provided large amounts of humanitarian aid in the form of food, education, disaster relief, etc.

3) Point out the formal political alliances that China has. Point out what countries have adopted political systems based on the Chinese model. Explain why they have poor relations with many of their neighbors.

>>134413
It's one thing for it to be shipped to China and another for it to be extracted by Chinese companies. It doesn't really talk about that aspect outside of a couple of local examples.

>>134421
Not him but the chinese are seemingly too smart to get dragged into excessive militarism. They do not have a history of this in over 2000 years of existence. Many doubt it will happen now

China has many formal political alliances. Nobody has adopted the chinese system because the current chinese system is, itself, inherited from the japanese and koreans.

Their structural similarities will probably lead to long term alliances after the expiration of the immediate term because of shared interests and methods regarding their polity and modes of economy

>>134421
your questions aren't evidence to the contrary that china isn't a world power

just because you're uninformed automatically change reality

only going to humor your uninformed ass because i literally just saw this

>cite some major Chinese military deployments outside of their immediate neighborhood, either for humanitarian or combat purposes.

fucking kek http://www.ecns.cn/business/2014/02-24/102090.shtml

again

just because you're uninformed doesn't make you correct

>>134438
Look man, western companies can't ship it out to china, FOR the chinese, FOR free, fast enough, so the chinese are literally paying to do it themselves, faster.

Further, look at the types of investments they're making. They're clearly in this for the long term, winning contracts, preferential trade deals, embedding networks.

They're winning the trade war by a landslide.

It's obvious. Of course any single source will be incomplete. I'm not sure what you hope to prove by pointing that out.

>>134440
Well they invaded Vietnam in the late 1970s, India in the 1960s and Korea in the 1950s. They also took over a previously independent Tibet. They have openly threatened to attack Taiwan if it ever formally declares independence.

The Chinese system is not like any South Korean or Japanese system that has ever existed. They have no formal allies either and only a couple of tacit ones. And virtually nobody has adopted the Chinese economic system over a long period either.

This pro-China troll is god-tier, 10/10 would rage again

>>134446
Address the points. It has already been stated multiple times that the Chinese have a wide global economic reach. You haven't addressed any of the other aspects of global power.

>>134456
> They're winning the trade war by a landslide.
Because they have to. They have massive domestic resource problems on many fronts.

>>134460
lol http://www.ecns.cn/business/2014/02-25/102323.shtml

lol

http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=33409:china-launches-first-nigerian-offshore-patrol-vessel&catid=51:Sea&Itemid=106

lol

http://allafrica.com/stories/201402240106.html

LOL http://www.ecns.cn/business/2014/02-25/102330.shtml

>The three Asian nations have seen increasingly close ties in economy and trade, and have become important partners and markets to each other.

>>134465
>You haven't addressed any of the other aspects of global power.


you haven't proven to me that they DON'T have global power

BACK UP YOUR SHITTY OPINIONS ANON


FUCKING BACK THEM UP. ASKING QUESTIONS DOES NOT MEAN EVIDENCE

>>134470
>http://www.ecns.cn/business/2014/02-25/102323.shtml

How is that at all relevant to the conversation?

> http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=33409:china-launches-first-nigerian-offshore-patrol-vessel&catid=51:Sea&Itemid=106

How is that China's military deploying?

> http://allafrica.com/stories/201402240106.html

How is that not economic?

> http://www.ecns.cn/business/2014/02-25/102330.shtml

How is that not REGIONAL?

You failed to address a single point you were asked to.

>>134460
China has changed much since the 70's, let alone the 50s. The communist party is no longer communist in the commonly understood sense. They are a board of mostly engineers and long-time civil servants elected by merit and service history. America wages more wars in the span of a single president, twice in a row, than china has in nearly its entire history.

The taiwan issue they are batshit insane about, which is a shame, but it doesn't change the overall competence which has overcome their governance since deng.

The chinese system is EXACTLY like the japanese and korean system. They use the same system of keiritsu/chaebol heirarchical cross-investing, forced savings, high tariffs, and bureaucrat policing in order to keep their corporations in line. They also share methods of electing civil servants to high councils, methods of national qualification, and methods of allocating research and CAPEX.

They have no formal allies, but run larger trade surpluses with american "allies" than america does, such as the EU and japan.

I think you need to gb2school

Anyone who claims China is a major world player and has influence comparable to a country like the US is talking out of their ass. Economically, socially, and politically the country is still behind most of Western Europe. Their economy is strong because of the manpower, but in terms of actual business and industry they are remarkably one-sided. Small business is stifled and the most powerful businesses are heavily reliant upon government support and guanxi (this is changing steadily). They have no real allies and are regarded by most countries unfavorably. They rarely play into world events. China has absolutely NO soft power, and will remain that way in the foreseeable future.

As we move forward, it'll probably change, but as of right now China is still far from a major world power.

>>134474
The questions were asked to illustrate that there is nearly no evidence.

China doesn't use it's military in any notable way globally. China has no formal allies and has tons of enemies and doesn't control any major international global institutions (in fact it participates in many created and controlled by the West). China does very little social work internationally.

You couldn't answer the questions because there is virtually no evidence to counter the points they are making... which was the point all along.

>>134484
>You failed to address a single point you were asked to.

And you failed to back up your assertion

please prove to me that china is not a global power in a manner that is not asking me questions

can you do it? or will you deflect me again because you know that deep down you're full of shit?

>>134490
> elected by merit and service history

Holy fuck. You don't actually believe that do you?

And trade surpluses have exactly NOTHING to do with alliances.

>>134499
> or will you deflect me again

That's exactly what you've done this entire thread you faggot cunt nigger deer.

>>134498
>The questions were asked to illustrate that there is nearly no evidence.

No, you're asking questions because you're too lazy to back up your own opinions with are unfounded in reality

>China doesn't use it's military in any notable way globally. China has no formal allies and has tons of enemies and doesn't control any major international global institutions (in fact it participates in many created and controlled by the West). China does very little social work internationally.


Prove it. Show me that they don't instead of giving me your shitty opinion.

>>134465
They're winning the trade war
They have more access to global resources
They're gaining the edge in medical research
They won the education war
If they're not winning finance, we are most certainly LOSING finance faster than they are losing it
We are losing the reserve currency
We have already lost the petrodollar
We have already lost manufacture

The status quo will not hold indefinitely. When it no longer does, there isn't a single thing america or the west can fall back on

Sure is >>>/pol/ in here.

No real surprise there I guess.

>>134509
Nice ad hominem, your true side comes out


You're incapable of backing up your shitty assertions, you keep deflecting me, and now that your ruse is called out you get angry. You're like a spoiled child. Still waiting on that proof.

>inb4 you ask me another question

That's not proof you petulant child

>>134505
>service history
Yeah, it's true. A few influential capitalists have no doubt bought their way into party membership. But the old vanguard of the party is mostly dead and/or in prison.

It is no longer the same people who rule. It was a stealth coup.

so, realistically, given that china mirrors almost exactly japan and korea, having seen the error of their ways, I don't see you or anyone else making a cogent point about how they will not realistically become first world soon. Address their capex, the chaebols. Anything. Any single one. Please.

>>134514
> They're winning the trade war
In certain ways, yes.

> They have more access to global resources
No, not really.

> They're gaining the edge in medical research
That's completely wrong.

> They won the education war
Also completely wrong.

> If they're not winning finance, we are most certainly LOSING finance faster than they are losing it
Their financial system is a disaster far more complex and damaged than anything in the West.

> We are losing the reserve currency
Totally incorrect.

> We have already lost the petrodollar
Wrong.

> We have already lost manufacture
We still manufacture a fuckton of stuff.

> The status quo will not hold indefinitely. When it no longer does, there isn't a single thing america or the west can fall back on
All around retarded as fuck statement. China has been actively trying for several years to shift to a domestic market, service based economy because they can see their own weaknesses and have utterly failed to make progress in that conversion so far.

>>134517
pol and biz will always be inextricably linked.

It's kind of like /a/ and virgin autists

>>134525
>No, not really.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rare_earth_industry_in_China

>China's rare earth industry makes up 97 percent of rare mineral trade worldwide

>It is estimated the world has 99 million tonnes of rare earth reserve deposits.[6] China's reserves are estimated to be 36 million tonnes or roughly 30 percent of the world's total reserves

gb2school kiddo

>>134518
You are demanding that only one side of the argument be backed up. That is completely and totally senseless.

>>134524
China isn't even remotely close to first world. About 20% of their population lives on under $2 per day. They have a massive housing crisis. A demographic crisis. Huge environmental issues. They are losing arable land at an alarming rate. They already can't feed themselves. They are become more and more dependent on foreign resources. Etc, etc, etc.

They aren't "first world" and won't be for the foreseeable future.

>>134537

>rare earths are the only global resource

this chinaboo in here reeks of some college kid who read 2 books and thinks china will rule the world in 10 years

>>134537
Read the fucking news. Rare earth mining is picking up quickly outside of China and plans are in place to refine outside of China as well.

> gb2school kiddo
So you should take some of your own fucking advice.

>>134525
>That's completely wrong.
>Also completely wrong.
>Totally incorrect
>RONG
>RONG
>RONG

Why even bothering to argue if you lack the intellectual capacity to?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3yX_1gJ_51M

>>134145
I like how you mentioned the practice is illegal.

We'd be fucking kidding ourselves if we didnt think thta most if not all g20 countries tried to rig the currency game in their favor.

People get butthurt over China but god dammit if they the western world didnt write the book on unscrupulous growth.

Every g20 nation has done at least one of the following if not all:

Currency manipulation? Yup
Unfair tarrif, tarrif extortionism? Yup
Polluting the land for growth? Yup
Committing countless human rights violation along the way? Yup

>>134553
Neither provided any evidence asswipe. That is only reinforcing the FACT that you are only demanding evidence from one side and not the other.

>>134545
>You are demanding that only one side of the argument be backed up. That is completely and totally senseless.

You don't have to back up common knowledge

Now, prove it to me in a form that isn't a question?

Can you?

No?

Oh. :)

>>134525
>medical
Phenotypic diagnosis is the future of medecine. American pharma has us locked into a destructive cycle of useless and ineffective drugs that barely pass trials by bribing FDA officials

>education
They outscored us on the PISA results. Their middle schoolers outperform our high school students. This is a problem, anon.

>finance
I guess you really believe in the bernankster, huh?
We'll never know for sure until china becomes transparent. But in all other things their gov is relatively more competent than ours

>reserve currency
Don't tell me you think we are solvent?

>petrodollar
Remains to be seen

>>134553

1) make baseless statements
2) get told you are wrong
3) PROVE IT!

age old trolling tactic dressed up more nicely

>>134563
> You don't have to back up common knowledge

Yes you do faggot. Especially when you haven't even proven that your position is the majority opinion held by academia at large.

>>134565
>Neither provided any evidence asswipe.

>implying I have to provide evidence for common knowldge

Or you could keep being, well, an ass. Surely someone with the intellectual rigor to call someone a cunt nigger deer has the intellectual capacity to provide evidence that isn't in the form of a deflected question?

You make me laff m8.

>>134569
Literally nothing you said counters anything when you even scratch the surface.

Here's an example of how wrong you are, specifically on the reserve currency point:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reserve_currency

See the graph on the link.

>>134573
>Yes you do faggot.

No, I don't.

However ask yourself this, If I should have to back up common knowledge, why shouldn't you have to back up your contrarian beliefs?


>you can't
>you never will be able to
>don't even think about asking me another question to deflect
>you are intellectually bankrupt
>i am still waiting on those sources

What are you gonna insult me again and call that your argument kiddo?

>>134574
Why won't you admit that you lack any form of logical consistency. There can literally not be a debate about anything if only one side has to support its point.

>>134569

hahahahah all this trolling and stalling and this is all your pseudo-intellectual ass comes up with? pretty sad m8

>>134585
> common knowledge

Citation now.

Because I say it's common knowledge that China's "power" has been overstated. Prove me wrong. What I'm saying is common knowledge so you have to provide proof.

>>134585

not the guy you are arguing with, but your beliefs aren't the common beliefs and his aren't contrarian at all. Deflecting is the right choice though when one has no real understanding of the subject matter

>>134591
>There can literally not be a debate about anything if only one side has to support its point.

The person making the challenge to the belief has to provide the sources

>Why won't you admit that you lack any form of logical consistency.

>you
>lecturing me about logical inconsistencies

o i am laffin m8

>>134585
It's common knowledge that China isn't a superpower or even a regional hegemon.

Prove me wrong. It is after all, common knowledge.

>>133878

>world's biggest economy

>>134607
> implying you're not making a claim

Jamal, you're fucking retarded.

>>134545
All of these things were said about japan in the 60s and korea in the 80s. Koreans thatched their roofs with straw fucking 35 years ago.

Go ahead and stay ignorant and arrogant. Learn fucking finance or business you idiot. The chinese aren't perfect, no one is. but they are a threat.

>>134611
You can't twist your way out of being intellectually bankrupt

So now that you can't deflect me with questions, you're going to find another way to indirectly avoid backing up or lending your shitty beliefs any credibility at all.

>>134619

>they are a threat.

>>134619
> Learn fucking finance or business you idiot.

That's not even directly relevant to the conversation you fucking autist. China has over 1.3 BILLION people to deal with over a huge geographical territory. Japan and Korea never had to deal with either of those and received MASSIVE outside help.

All i wanted is some answears and i got a troll thread instead.


Fuck this board.

>>134619

the fact that you even compare japan and korea to china shows just how little understanding you have.

>>134627
Your beliefs are shitty. It is common knowledge that China's is not a superpower. Prove me wrong. You're just going against common knowledge.

>>134633


>world's biggest economy

dont start the thread like a retard next time

>>134633
If you're OP, I would politely suggest you delete this thread. It itself is shit and it's just shitting up the board.

>>134582
Their middle schoolers outscore our high schoolers. Their middle schoolers are literally rice farmers, dude.

Further, the graph ends in 2012. If you keep up on the news, china just dumped 7% of ALL their debt in the course of a single day. It had to be bought last second by belgium. I don't think you're aware how precarious of a balance we're running on our budget in order to try and force growth.

>>134595
maybe if you were capable of reading more than one language and had studied finance you'd understand what we were talking about m8

>>134648
You samefagged half of it you fucking moron.

>>134640
Deep down inside you know what you're doing and that you're simply fooling yourself, not once in this thread have you done anything but call people niggers and tell them that they're wrong. You're a child with no understanding of the world outside your basement with shitty unfounded opinions and honestly I feel bad for you

>>134655
I'm not OP you dumb fuck. Nor am I responsible for more than about total 5 posts in this thread.

>>134656
Deep down inside I know that none of US will ever live to see a day where the average quality of life in China is anywhere near what it is in the West.

>>134629
>>134639

The fact that the population size is the first thing that pops into your mind rather than say, horizontal organizational patterns, state allocation of capex, transparency issues, legitimacy concerns in their governing boards, etc, which jp, kr, and cn ALL share in common shows me how absolutely little you understand about the east.

Fucking dumbass white kids.

>>134659
>you dumb fuck
>Nor am I responsible for more than about total 5 posts in this thread.

>clicks user ID
>whole thread highlights

This literally explains everything, you are a goddamn lying child. You do know 4chan is 18+ right? If you can't expect to be honest about something as simple as your post count, how are we ever going to believe your shitty opinions?

>>134656
> posts from basement
> tells others to get out of the basement

Welcome to 4chan everyone.

>>134667
> Chink detected

It would have been easier if you had just said that you were one from the beginning.

>>134674
Says the douche with 40 shitposts.

>>134667

did I say anything about population size you insecure little chink?

>>134684
>40 shitposts
you mean
>40 posts arguing with a retard who can't do anything but deflect questions and call other people niggers
>yet acts like he's a fucking encyclopedia of world knowledge and parades around calling everyone wrong

YOU ARE SO RETARDED IT HURTS

are you fucking mad because you realize how retarded you are? did you open your eyes and see the truth?

>of course you didn't

what else have you lied about, kiddo? your sexuality perhaps?

This board is shit enough without this thread. Just delete it. It quite literally belongs on /pol/

>>134679
so smart

>>134697
the first poster did. I'm directing the same general criticism to both of you.

I mentioned at least a dozen different reasons why china is on the path korea and japan took, but you didn't respond to any of it.

I'm done. I'm arguing with 12 year olds

>>134704
You refused throughout the entire thread to even support your own argument. You claimed it was common knowledge but didn't even provide evidence to support the assertion that the majority of academia agrees with you.

So your claim of common knowledge in this case is meaningless. As has been done, the other side can just as easily claim that their argument is common knowledge.

>>134720
> linear projections

Because those always work out so well...

>>134712
>WHY DOES EVERYONE SUCK BUT ME

The only one who belongs on /pol/ is you. This thread was just you me and a couple others, and you shit it up by calling everyone niggers and being too beta to defend any of your points

>tfw you realize you're the problem

>>134738
This thread started with the OBJECTIVELY FALSE claim that China is the world's biggest economy. All you're doing is complaining about the conversation that evolved from the overwhelming response that said claim is completely incorrect.

Maybe if this thread hadn't started with such an egregiously incorrect statement it wouldn't have gone anywhere.

why is it that /pol/tards always leak onto other boards? it happened to /int/ and it went to shit. now it's happening here, to the detriment of board with potential.

if you're an keybaord nationalist who despairs and foams at the mouth at the thought of getting shown up by certain uppity ethnics, get a day job spewing propaganda for radio free asia and leave this place out of it.

>Maybe if this thread hadn't started with such an egregiously incorrect statement it wouldn't have gone anywhere.

And maybe if you weren't such an insufferable intellectually bankrupt lying faggot it wouldn't have gone to shit

i bet you'd kill your mom if she accidentally moved your dildo collection

>>134753
>having so much autism that you cant get passed a flawed point


kill yourself

>>134761
The mistake was ever getting rid of /new/ without an immediate replacement. It contained nearly all of the current /pol/ bullshit pretty well. Then it got removed and /pol/ didn't come along until quite a while later which allowed all of them to pollute other boards. Then when /pol/ was created it somewhat centralized it but many of them already frequented other boards at that pint more than they did pre-/new/ deletion.

>>134775
You should talk to a fuckton of people in this thread. Because that fact was called out a lot and a bunch of people argued against the idea it was insinuating.

>>134783
>complains about /pol/
>can't actually back his opinions up
>gets angry and spews autistic flames of rage when challenged on beliefs
>calls people nigger deers
>lies about post count to make himself look like less of a faggot

YOU. ARE. THE. PROBLEM.

>>134783
i'm talking about you cretin. how can you lack so much self-awareness to not realize that you're the spitting reincarnation of /pol/?

>>134783
he was talking about you bro

you are the spitting image of /pol/

see: >>134800
fuck, you're unaware. you keep revealing more and more to me about yourself and everything just makes more sense because of it

>>134800
>>134801
Why would you complain about /pol/-like behavior and then willingly enable it? That makes no sense. Fora board that 'prides' itself on business and economic knowledge to get such a basic fact as total economic size so blatantly and uncaringly wrong is pretty fucking pathetic.

> faggot cunt nigger deer
Also, pic fucking related

>>134807
> you keep revealing more and more to me about yourself

Except you know literally nothing about me, nor I you.

>>134812
the fact that you called me a troll at first is just sweet irony

I don't like to use /pol/ memes but shit, you're an actual degenerate

>>134824
You don't like /pol/ memes but you'll use one anyway even though you've been complaining about /pol/ spillover. Who's part of the problem now? Spoiler: it's you.

>>134831
>Who's part of the problem now? Spoiler: it's you.

see:
>>134801
>>134800

How can you be so unaware?

>>134831
Also, It's not even a meme, I legitimately mean it, you're a goddamned degenerate. That's the only word to describe you. Your posts betray you. I really wish more people could read the shit you post on this board as an example of the cancer we need to get rid of

>>134839
And yet you've just intentionally used a /pol/ meme even though you are preaching about the ills of /pol/. Does your hypocrisy know no bounds?

/pol/ fucking sucks. I don't see anyone disagreeing with that. But you're not helping your case by admitting that you're bringing elements of it directly here.

>>134847
This board is new as fuck douchebag. Don't pretend like it's some long established thing whose identity is changing. It was straight up created as a /pol/ offshoot because of all the cryptocurrency bullshit that went on over there.

>>134850
>And yet you've just intentionally used a /pol/ meme even though you are preaching about the ills of /pol/. Does your hypocrisy know no bounds?

The word degenerate is the only word to describe the shitstain that is you anon. I quite literally mean it. Do you want me to call you a faggot? Change the words you and all your posts evidence that you have an IQ of 50 and are fucking cancer

>>134862
So you spending an entire thread complaining about cancer (in one way or another) on a new board isn't cancer? That's cute.

>>134858
Do you know how cancer starts anon? One faggot shitting up a board with their intellectually bankrupt bullshit. Age of the board be damned, you're a fucking faggot regardless

>>134873
Intellectually bankrupt is starting a thread based on objectively incorrect claims.

> you're a fucking faggot regardless
Okay. I like that you complained about the name calling before but now you're doing it yourself. Just proving that you have literally no standing to complain at this point.

>>134870
>So you spending an entire thread complaining about cancer
NO
THAT IS NOT THE FUCKING POINT
HOW DOES THIS EXCUSE YOU ANON
YOU ARE LITERALLY THE THING YOU DESPISE

>>134885
I don't despise "cancer" because this entire website and every board on it is predicated on just that.

>>134884
>Okay. I like that you complained about the name calling before but now you're doing it yourself. Just proving that you have literally no standing to complain at this point.


YOU NEVER HAD ANYWHERE TO STAND IN THE FIRST PLACE ANON

you failed in what you set out to with your shitty opinions

>never provided one shred of evidence for his claims(i provided several, by the way)
>calls everyone wrong who disagrees with him
>calls people niggers when disagreed with
>cannot actually argue any of his points
>then goes on to COMPLAIN ABOUT THE PEOPLE ON /POL
>doesn't realize he is literally doing everything in the spitting image of your typical /pol/ user

HOW CAN YOU NOT REALIZE YOU ARE THE PROBLEM?

Name calling is wrong when it's unfounded. Every insult hurled at you is deserved.


fucking check yourself before you wreck yourself

>>134896
Jesus fucking christ. You are LITERALLY the biggest hypocrite I've ever seen on 4chan in 7 years of coming on here. I genuinely congratulate you. That's any accomplishment in my book.

>>134905
That's a big*

>>133910
this
it's a fucking house of cards

>>133878

The same way any economy does catch up growth and high rates of capital accumulation. Although China's economic model is unsustainable. State capitalism is just as shitty as regular old fashioned socialism. China has some productive private owned businesses but the role of the state is huge and that will inevitably lead to a major crisis.

Could someone recommend me some good books about China's involvement in Africa?

>>134601
>being so delusional

>>133878
After decades of chaos, things started to calm down in the mid 70s. Apart from some industry near the coast, mines and some railroads, China was undeveloped and needed an industrial revolution However unlike other industrial revolutions, China could get help from the rest of the world, adopting modern technology and importing machinery and expertise (capital goods), though this was expensive and limited during the cold war.

By the 90s, China had developed some core industries and infrastructure and with the cold war ended trade rushed into China, foreign investment flooded into the country, the economy grew, soon China had its own domestic capital markets and conducted its own research.

>>133878
every time a shitty socialist country implement a free market capitalist regime they always just so happen to experience an "economic miracle". It's no miracle, capitalism just works.

>>133878
>economic miracle
Cheap exports and a willingness to fudge the numbers. The local growth numbers always add up to be higher than what the national average is because everyone is fudging the numbers along the way.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/12/06/us-china-economy-wikileaks-idUSTRE6B527D20101206

>(Reuters) - China's GDP figures are "man-made" and therefore unreliable, the man who is expected to be the country's next head of government said in 2007, according to U.S. diplomatic cables released by WikiLeaks.

>The U.S. cable reported that Li, who is now a vice premier, focused on just three data points to evaluate Liaoning's economy: electricity consumption, rail cargo volume and bank lending.
...
>"By looking at these three figures, Li said he can measure with relative accuracy the speed of economic growth. All other figures, especially GDP statistics, are 'for reference only,' he said smiling," the cable added.

>China has alliances
>IDontThinkSoTim.jpg

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/china-business/10560302/Majority-of-Chinese-business-leaders-unwilling-to-trade-with-Japan-amid-tensions.html

> Soaring regional tensions around the East China Sea are taking their toll on trade, with as many as 60pc of China’s corporate leaders unwilling to do business with Japanese firms, according to a new poll.

>Only 13pc of Chinese businessmen said that they were able to separate their work from the current political tensions, while 60pc of corporate leaders in South Korea also voiced concern at conducting business with Japanese companies

>>134233
>>134241
>>134200
Hey anon, dunno if you're still reading this thread, but I feel sorry for you for having to argue with
>>134221
>>134194
>>134176
, who is a fucking retard who thinks spouting shitty credentials somehow constitutes and argument. He's the one who belongs on /pol/, not you. And I hope that you don't leave /biz/, because even though I disagree with you on some points, you are the good poster and he is the shit poster.

>>134461
yeah, this made me mad just reading through. the sad thing is, he's posting just as much as the guy he's trolling, which is a net loss for both.

>>134440
>>134413
has some good points though.

>>134529
It's a bit less worse than /a/. For instance, /a/ is about a topic strictly for virgin autists, whereas /biz/ is about a topic for reasonable, educated people-- of which there are very few on /pol/. The only overlap is that idiots on /pol/ like to think that they're reasonable and educated, so they go to /biz/ to try to inflate their ego. I think we might educate some of them in the long term, but there'll always be some retard libertarians and trolls here. Libertarianism is, after all, in the self-interest of the rich, and in the delusional self-interest of the aspirational rich. Short-term, at least.

>>133878
>worlds biggest economy
Not by a long shot.

>>133943
When investors start moving abroad its a good indication of the country's economy going to shit (like Japan when it started investing internationally), otherwise they would invest domestically.

Lots and lots of slave labor.

The chinese discoverd debt 5 years ago and have been putting us to shame ever since

This thread should have been allowed to die.

>>137775
I'm with you bud. Here's a tip, and I know it's very difficult to adhere to, but. Next time someone spouts endless ad-hom at you and refuses to even MAKE an argument... don't waste your typing. 80% of this thread is just you and that troll.

>>134221
I don't think you know what a shill is.

>>133988
>No minorities
>China

ur a moran

econ b.s. here.

comparative advantage in labor capital. western investment arbitrage on environmental concerns. exports aided by being the worlds largest market, which no one wants to lose. economic planning for the 10-20 year cycle as opposed to 1-2 years in the usa.

also historically world's most advanced economy, with brief hiatus between 1700 to the present.

posted on mobile so no caps.

>>134266
>Except china won't invade japan. Most likely they'll become the new germany-france buddy partners to enforce asian hegemony in politics.
You are dreaming.

>>134569
>They outscored us on the PISA results.
Wasn't there a big scandal recently because it turned out they were cheating?

They're a bubble economy, the same thing will happen to them that happened to the Japanese in the early 90's.

>>134569
>They outscored us on the PISA results.
They tested individual cities.

The rest of the world tested their entire country, including everything ranging from compton to top magnet schools.

China wouldn't stand a chance if it tested its entire country, seeing that the countryside is third world tier.

>>137817
I wouldn't have kept posting if I wasn't horrifically bored.

>>137845
top smirk.

>>138104
yes, there was. The PISA scores are shit. They've always been restricted to Shanghai anyway.

>>137933
>also historically world's most advanced economy, with brief hiatus between 1700 to the present.
This is a good point. Their geography is golden, they've always been destined to emerge as major competitors. The only reason they fucked up so hard in the past couple centuries was because they were so comfy with their success that they didn't even notice industrialization sneaking up on them.

>>137845
top smirk.

>>138104
yes, there was. The PISA scores are shit. They've always been restricted to Shanghai anyway.

>>137933
>also historically world's most advanced economy, with brief hiatus between 1700 to the present.
This is a good point. Their geography is golden, they've always been destined to emerge as major competitors. The only reason they fucked up so hard in the past couple centuries was because they were so comfy with their success that they didn't even notice industrialization sneaking up on them.

>>138277
Weird, you got a new id. Well you must have been pretty bored. Shame cuz China is such an interesting topic, this could have been a great thread in spite of full retard OP.

>>133878
kek

>>133894
/thread

>>133924
You mean 10 times the population.

>>134360
>The moon landing absolutely happened you fucking faggot.
>have people there with 1960s technology
>no other country can return since

Buy USA ONLY stimulate the economy. Send them all the junk. Sell them services lets make none asian/africa/middle country weak. Personally i sell online services to third world people TOP kek. Like $200 a month :P

>>133878

Basically the tl;dr version is China has over 1 billion ambitious and hard-working peasants who want a taste of the first world, so they flock to the city factories in the millions and will work for literally nothing.

Because of this vacuum, Western companies were unleashed and allowed to do their manufacturing in this heavily subsidized exploitative environment and reap all of the benefits.

Meanwhile the Chinese worked hard, built large cash reserves and re-invested into infrastructure etc. to try and preserve the wealth.

The Chinese and US economies are basically the same entity.

>>133878


chinesemasterrace

your culture is ass backwards haha feel the growth of our gdp for about a millennia

>>133878
A better question is why China managed it but India didn't

Read about the meji restoration and substitute japan with china and the emperor and the oligarchs with the communist party

A society that needs a lot of lawyers is like a person that needs a lot of doctors.

>>145378
So...you don't want a lawyer (a person who dedicated several years of their life to study the law of the land), to be a politician?

...But you would rather prefer an engineer who spent years learning about materials, physics, and all things not related to law to run the governing body of the land which operates under the established laws of the land (which he had not studied)?

That's like me wanting a plumber to preform a root canal.

Protip: China's economy is being manipulated that the value of the yuan is fuckknowswhat it's worth. Your revered engineers are fucking with it so hard, I would not be surprised to see the entire Chinese economy collapse in a decade or less.

Go back to reddit. Le.

>>145449

33% of fortune 500 CEOs are engineers and only 11% studied buisness administration. The plumber/root canal analogy doesnt seem to hold up at all. I think the way that engineers approach problems is more conducive to a functioning society, but they are inferior to lawyers when it comes to all the PR that is required to actually get elected.

>>145378
It would feel kind of wrong if the chief justice wasn'T a lawyer though

>>145449
Angela Merkel studied physics. Your turn

>>134110

I must say, I have talked with a lot of Africans (like, literally from Africa) and they all say they love the Chinese people who have moved in over the past year. I know it's hearsay, but it's a lot better than your anti-chinese nonsense

>>134266

>the west COULD build things and extract resources

We would if the people here didn't bitch and moan about how cruel sweatshops are, their dictators actually allowed foreign companies in and we didn't call every instance of the West buying things on the cheap "slavery". Sweatshops and cheap products are Africa's only hope.

>>145511
I mean, I know the government is a business entity, but they're technically not a Fortune 500 company.

I see nothing wrong with the CEO of GE holding a maths degree.

Also,
>not realizing that the world of politics is so twisted and fucked up from what goes on planet earth, that we need people to study these fucked up relationships/interactions

>>145528
Not sure what point your trying to make.
The point I'm trying to make is that there is absolutely nothing wrong with lawyers and political science holding seats in government, seeing as their degrees are directly correlated to their profession

>>133948
Government debts owned by Chinese creditors. Debts in themselves tell us little.

>>145378

But you do need a lot of doctors, physicians, dentists, nutritionists, surgeons, neurosurgeons.

Same reason a government needs to have people who understand law, diplomacy, economics and warfare, not engineers.

>>133988
>No bullshit things like feminism

Like half of Mao's shit was written to appeal to women. They don't have bullshit like feminism because they were supposed to adopt a classless society without a need for differentiating such nonsense as gender, you imperiarist pig.

>>145449
Scientists and Engineers are trained to collaborate. Lawyers are trained to argue.

Should politics be totally devoid of lawyers? No, that would be absurd, but I think that we certainly don't need more of them.

> LEL CHINA TOP IN DA WORLD? TOPKEK SO WRROOONG USSAA IS DA FIRST 'MURICA YEAHHH

>Still not realizing the American debt
>Still not realizing the Chinese economic boom won't die in a few decades

Sooner or later the US will have to pay all that fucking debt to China and become it's bitch as China becomes the recognized true #1 of this world.

>>145703
China only owns about 7% of the US's debt. The US owns most of its own debt.

>>134050

it's outdated

chinese put several millions into construction of 10 up to date hospitals and several housing districts in Angola

>>145684
Yeah we need more engineers in positions like chief justice, president, and and VP because they r so smart :) and collaborate, not argue! :^) imagine what a wonderful and happy world it would be!

seriously, fuck off back to reddit

Just as I would not wish for a lawyer to build a bridge, I would not wish for an engineer to make militaristic and diplomatic decisions when all he studied was how to connect steel tubes so they don't fall down

>>133878

For the answer I found the best was in The Chinese Economy Transitions and Growth by Barry Naughton, highly suggest everyone read it

>>145838

>I would not wish for an engineer to make militaristic and diplomatic decisions

They dont teach this in law school either faggot

>>146247
I study political science
I study war, pretty extensively

I imagine that I were to further my education in political science, and I was to concentrate in diplomacy, I would learn more.

And if that was the path I would want to go to, I imagine I would find a career in this direction. Probably in the military.

Don't be so fucking stupid m8

>>135205
This. Same goes for their test scores. Students cheat, teachers allow it, administrators encourage it, and everyone up the chain engages in it to the point where the numbers are just absurdly inflated/

>>146838
Not to mention lazy students just drop out and do field work, unskilled labor, or just be bums.
In the Us it's illegal to drop out

>>145449

>engineer
>engineering society
>engineering the economy

>lawyer
>lawyering society
>lawyering the economy

Gee i wonder which is going to work better? Lawyering is the road to regulation / inefficiency.

>>133988

>>>/pol/

Seriously, this board already has to deal with poor whiny NEETs from /b/ and /jp/ and cryptofags from /g/.

>>146937
Go fuck yourself.

>>147011
>>>/pol/

>>147279
Have you made one intelligent comment in this thread?

>>147294
well click up on my ID and then scroll up. I only came in during the aftermath. im pretty cool though

It is the current pool for cheap labor for the Western world. Chinese companies are only able to compete in markets because of either 1.) stupidly low prices or 2.) forced monopolies (or exclusion of foreign products/services). Nobody gives two shits about the RMB because the Chinese artificially fuck with it. Very few native Chinese companies matter at all, with the exception of Lenovo and cheap Android phone makers.

The problem right now is China still has a billion people in shit-poor poverty but wages are rising at an unsustainable. Over the next few decades China will loose manufacturing jobs to cheap sources of labor (India, Brazil being the top contenders) or wages will stagnate and civil unrest will result (the former is already happening to an extent). Social stability in China is based on job availability and the yearly increase in wages that has happened for over twenty years in large percentages. China will also get hit with a baby boomer-like social services crisis soon that will take up large percentages of the budget. Chinese investors have very little they can actually invest in other than banks and property. The real estate bubble will soon burst and a lot of regular folks will loose their shirt or find that their non-speculative property is practically worthless.

China is also constrained by foreign policy concerns. The reason they are investing so heavily in Africa is because the U.S., South Korea, Japan, the Philippines, Vietnam, and Australia have restricted their ability to project power in East Asia and the Pacific. They simply had nowhere else to go.

TL;DR: China is fucked. Not going to collapse fucked, but certainly post-Soviet era Russia fucked.

>>133878
Western foreign investment due to Deng Xiaoping liberalizing the economy. We lost our domestic industry, they gained it.

Huge population and a large amount of resources.
>>134629
>That's not even directly relevant to the conversation you fucking autist
>business board
>not about business
Get the fuck out.

>>146937
This, the death of this board will be brought upon by /pol/tards wanting this to be /pol/ 2.0
Every single time I see some shitty infographic or some "independent" news source on here I cringe.

>>133878
>Can someone please explain to me China's economical miracle?

On top of my head...

70s-80s
>Chairman Mao Zedong dead... by all accounts he was a disaster for China
>Deng Xiaoping as next successor
>Deng's reforms (see wiki)
>Opening up with USA (there was tension between USSR and China at that time)

90s-00s
>More pragmatic leaders came to power in CCP (mostly engineers, scientists, mathematicians etc)
>western investment because HUGE potential market
>manufacture outsource grew because HUGE intensives from CCP
>export BOOM!

00-10s
>pretty much continuation of tried & true formulas that worked in the 90s-00s

>China exploiting Africa for resources
If the world thought europeans treated africans like shit, just wait and see how chingchong treats them.

>>151958
By not bothering with them. They have enclosed campuses that house Chinese workers. No Yellow Man's burden bullshit.

>>137933
hundreds of shitposts in and here is the first person to mention the fact that china has historically been an economic powerhouse longer than any other human civilization ever...

>>151923
>>More pragmatic leaders came to power in CCP (mostly engineers, scientists, mathematicians etc)

That had nothing to do with China's 'economic miracle', OP. The guy who told you they were whoring their population out was much more right. There are thousands of books explaining what happened in the last 40 years in China, read them.

Steps to prosperity

1) Get rid of "politicians" and religious nuts from office

2) Put people with STEM experience (preferably some sorts of engineer) on the job

3) profit

>>151923
>More pragmatic leaders came to power in CCP (mostly engineers, scientists, mathematicians etc)
Leaders are rarely different from each other or make much difference. If Chairman Mao didn't act like a ruthless psychopath at all times he would have been replaced by someone who did.

>>152290

>Regards, a STEM person

>suddenly
ha

>>152290
>wanting people who have no experience with law in power
>wanting to put people with no experience in diplomacy in power?
>wanting to put autistic people to run a country

>>152290
>babby's first technocracy idea

What the fuck do scientists and engineers know about running a country? Fuck you.

>>152819
Guess what faggot, Trashman is a libertarian.

>statist coercion
>into the trash

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solow%E2%80%93Swan_model

It happens to every country that "has its shit together." China just has a lot of people.