/biz/ - Business & Finance

Stop talking about retarded hypothetical scenarios and get a job idiot

>>12595887
You already get a universal basic income if you are born to one to a rich family, and the elites don't care about anyone else so universal basic income is already all done.

>>12595887
Vote for commies.

>>12595887
Everyone lives within their means and invests in blue chip stocks with dividends.

>>12595887
It is already fucking happening OP

>>12595751

>>12595887
Idk but I want it now

>>12595906
Why? Sounds like you have a slave mindset

>>12595887
sznxp.io

You do realize Ubi is going to be hotpocket tier living right?

>>12595939
hotpockets are better than Haitian dirt cookies Anon, that’s the point...

>>12595931

>>12595939
A dp porno scene with Hilary, Bill, and trump would be worth watching

>>12595887
In France we basically already have UBI, anyone over the age of 25 gets 600€/month + social aids for rent depending on where you live so you can get up to 850€ a month in neetbux.
It's really not a good way to live if you don't have any savings. Basically you can afford a shitty one-room appartment in a bad part of town, pay your electricity/internet bills and low-tier food for a month.

UBI never made sense to me. Too many people would just buy drugs and other bullshit. We're not responsible enough as a society for that.

What we really need is subsidized housing, food staples and electricity. Then if you want anything besides the basic necessities, you will have to work for it.

>>12596007
Air it's not your place to decide what is mroal. You give your money and however they use it that's how it is and you shouldn't complain

>>12596007
Or just guaranteed employment. I wish I could just walk to city hall and be like "lost it all in crypto, gonna clean park bathrooms for awhile bro"

>>12596000
yeah all your working citizens are reaaaal happy about supporting you too

>>12596007
yep. anyone getting UBI, and welfare for that matter, should be banned from luxuries, like iphones, alcohol, cigarettes, soda, candy, so on

>>12596015
I'm not judging the morality of it, I'm judging it's efficacy. People dont need money, they need food and shelter. If you want to spend money on drugs or anything else I have no problem with that. But if you essentially made them free, millions of people would delve into serious addiction. One of the many reasons UBI is an unrealistic solution

>>12595887
God I just wish you could be banned for a month.

>>12596020
These guys are mad about the loss of buying power, not welfare. Tons of them are actually getting social aids but it's just not enough to live like the previous generation used to.

>>12596089
I'm sure setting a standard of giving out free money, then more people flocking in to get free money has nothing to do with this at all

>>12595887
Get a job you lazy fuck!

>>12596125
Companies could pay slightly higher salaries to their employees to adjust to inflation and stop giving literally billions to CEO and shareholders. But they don't so there is violence in the street. This is a story as old as civilization itself.

>>12596158
Always the fault of the employer and never the employee for being fucking useless amirite?

>>12596166
If you don't think working a full time job deserves a living wage for basic stuff like rent/bills/food + spare money to spend or save up, then this conversation pretty much stops here.
France has objectively never been as rich in its entire history. Yet both standards of living for workers AND welfare have gone down.

>>12596158
>It's really not a good way to live if you don't have any savings.
is it a good way to live? to leach off the workers of the country?

i dont doubt the CEO's earn too much. but i bet they didnt at any point brag about how good it is to live off welfare.
maybe you could do better, and earn more money

>>12596188
maybe vote fiscally conservative instead of voting by your feels, dont vote in another globalist lefty in who is going to import more leaches to make your country worse

>>12596166
>Always the fault of the employer and never the employee for being fucking useless amirite?
No it's the fault of lawmakers and fiscal planners for creating an environment of high unemployment and low bargaining power for employees.

>>12596190
As I said, welfare here only gives you basic necessities you literally cannot afford anything else. If you're married with kids maybe it's better since you get more money but it's still a pretty shitty life with no enjoyment. You're basically sitting at home waiting for your next welfare check to pay rent and food and can't afford ANYTHING else.
If some people brag about this lifestyle they are 100% coping.

>>12596225
>creating an environment of high unemployment
France would be doing just fine if they stopped immigration. Merkels EU plan has fucked everyone.

Too many countries driven by the guilt of colonial times and whatever other shit the UN sells them, worrying about helping people from far off lands when they have people who they are meant to represent going without

>>12596249
Trust me many people agree with this but the situation is what it is. Even far right candidates like the Lepen familly are pretty much memes and are only proposing to slow down immigration, not reversing it.
I know one guy who has a solution to this problem but he'll never make it to mainstream politics.

>>12595887
>imagine the smell

>>12596275
fingers crossed something changes. i feel bad for the whole EU
it's sad. you guys started this shit we all enjoy in the "West". you deserve better

>>12596166
>>Always the fault of the employer and never the employee for being fucking useless amirite?
That wouldn't make sense in Aristotle's time since they were mostly either master and slave. We've come along way and the bad worker argument stops holding at some point. Many points in history in fact.

>>12595906
Commie fags btfo

>>12595887

Sauce?

>>12595939
dude who cares. you can't ever be independent on $10 an hour so why not take the $500 from the government and use it to play vidya and eat frozen pizza? At least it's not going to israel.

>>12596368
That might work for a while but what happens to you when you hit, 40, 50, 60 years old? Is that all you want to do with your life?
God damn this thread got depressing.

>>12596389
Don't worry, there'll be a civil war before then.

>>12595887
>University? Fuck no I watched some youtube videos the post.

it takes work to pick up hundreds on the ground. UBI is communism which will bankrupt the US

gtfo russian shill

>>12596019
Fucking this. This being possible would solve so much shit.

>>12596826
good luck
if voter ID is racist, work for welfare is racist

>>12596000
Who the fuck pays for that?

>>12596984
Make rich people and wagies pay for it or just print money. I don't give a fuck I just want my gibs.

>>12596984
Literally everyone. Mostly upper middle class since all the rich people fucked off a long time ago or placed all their money in offshore accounts.
My parents each earn about 60k a year and they pay 45% of their income in taxes. To give you an example.

>>12597143
Imagine wagecucking for decades only to have hoards of third worlders invade your country to take gibs while replacing you in the very nation your forefathers died for.

>>12597042
Spoken like a true streetshitter. Disgusting. Ablebodied NEETs who rely on gibs need to be euthanized.

>>12597143
Why does anyone even work in france instead of sitting at home collecting gibs? If you own a house or can live with your parents why would you ever work?

>>12597248
c'est la vie

>>12596704
>it takes work to pick up hundreds on the ground. UBI is communism which will bankrupt the US
>gtfo russian shill

This is the inevitable convergence point. Capitalism eats itself and eventually makes the living conditions on par with the real communisms wev'e seen, although through different means and principles.

>>12595887

"The purpose in life, is a life of purpose."

Never forget this.

Throwing money at people does not accomplish anything.

Teaching people that their role in life is to give something to society and the advancement of humans while throwing money at them is the future.

>>12597283
meh, its merit based. and if you think you are worth more than you are paid, move.

people have forever got up and moved to where there is more/better paid work. it only eats itself if the population thinks they should have it handed to them. which is the lie they've been sold with shit like UBI

i got taught no free lunches, life wasnt meant to be easy, etc when i was a kid. now its we "deserve" this, or that. free money. health care is a "right"

pffft, nothing is a right

>>12597303
>>Throwing money at people does not accomplish anything.
Apparently it stops people from rioting.

The big issue with ubi is that no one would work anymore since they can just sit around collecting free money right?

So just force people to work to be able to collect ubi then, make them work like 10 hours a week or 3 months a year or something like that, theres currently a huge labor surplus theres no reason someone should have to work 40 hours a week every week of the year

>>12595887
If UBI arrives the prices of everything will increase a shit ton resulting in the money being near worthless

>>12595887
>no brap post yet

BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAPPPPPPPPPPPPFPTPTIFPTIPIFPIFPITPTPTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP

>>12597303
I agree with your sentiment but if automation allows us to provide basic housing and sustenance to every person on Earth as a right, shouldnt our pursuit of this be the priority?
People should be able to find their purpose in life without having to worry about poverty

Get on welfare you idiot

>>12597315
>nepotism rampant everywhere
>preferential hiring based on your race and sex
>have to get into a bunch of debt to get a piece of paper to prove youre a good goy
>merit based

Sure bro

>>12597315
>>meh, its merit based. and if you think you are worth more than you are paid, move.

>people have forever got up and moved to where there is more/better paid work. it only eats itself if the population thinks they should have it handed to them. which is the lie they've been sold with shit like UBI

I at least ask you to look at our current economic, social, and political scene as dynamic and changing. The common maxims and truisms of yesterday are going away and new ones will set in and vanish as quickly as the previous one did. One common and easily understood example is Donald Trump and Brexit. These would have been unthinkable 15 years ago except by the very few, now we have those and many other previously unthinkables that are in play.


>meh, its merit based. and if you think you are worth more than you are paid, move.
>people have forever got up and moved to where there is more/better paid work. it only eats itself if the population thinks they should have it handed to them. which is the lie they've been sold with shit like UBI

This is a very good attitude to have except most of the time. Let's see how many people will absolutely commit to the truth of this advice when we face millions of middle-eastern refugees or central american migrants seeking better opportunities.

>pffft, nothing is a right
you are somewhat correct. labor needs to take matters into their own hands and stop asking for leniency for their masters. This entire relationship needs to be thrown out of the window.

I mean, if you really want to be Accelerationist about it....

>>12595999
no it would not. also checked

>>12595887
Sauce for pic?

>>12596000
Same in Finland, I think you can get 1150€ a month (part of that is the rent). It's real fun when students get 500€/month and can't afford shit

>>12596000
Based, what happens if you have property already?

Can't you just buy a house in the countryside with some friends and then you have 2400€ to spend per month?

>>12597483
BRAP

>>12597349
>So just force people to work to be able to collect ubi then, make them work like 10 hours a week or 3 months a year or something like that, theres currently a huge labor surplus theres no reason someone should have to work 40 hours a week every week of the year
Trying that in Ausfailia and it's a shitfight. It effectively makes them a slave workforce, then entire opposite outcome of what's hoped.
We can't have UBI in our current system because you don't make money by giving back. If we UBI without proper controls, all that does is make it unfair for workers because the price of everything adjusts upward.
>It's not a bug, it's a feature.
>t. Oligarch

>>12595887
>be wagie
>born poor but worked hard and invests wisely, on track towards an upper-middle class lifestyle
>unironically supports UBI
>gubment taxes him to death, cuts his earning potential by 50% and drags him to <= lower-middle class
>all while the truly rich just hires a lawyer to find some loopholes

good job

>>12595999
Trips dont lie. I’m gonna need extra strong eye bleach

>>12596089
They are mad at the tax rate. It is literally an insane system

>>12595887
i wanna take a dump on her butt
mmmmm yeah

>>12597315
Fuck off boomer. Nobody cares what you were taught by your "pappy" or some shit. If society was actually fair and egalitarian it'd have merit - but it isn't. There isn't magically an infinite number of jobs in the world, and as automation takes off it's going to be a real problem. The only question is what form post-Capitalism is going to take - a decentralised network of hi-tech NatSoc ethnostates? Or communism powered by a social poinys system hivemind? Something else? Nobody knows yet. But your shit is rapidly ending.

>>12597396
This.

>>12597271
Social shaming i think

>>12595887
Be in a country that has state-owned oil and already pretty much has a basic income. In that country, you can get paid just to live in the far north. You could buy a house on social security alone. That's right, I'm talking about Norway. You get nice blonde and Chinese women, white nights in summer, suicide-inducing darkness in winter, and aurora borealis for free.

>>12597508
>Based, what happens if you have property already?
You get less aid.

>>12595887
got moar?

>>12596020
Honestly, they are just as part of the problem.
They are on welfare too, most of them are from rural France, which is showered by cities' money.
Some of them are actually public workers litterally paid to do nothing. They also protest about pensions not going up.
If tomorrow, Macron announces that taxes are cut, welfare is gone and public services go to the ones who pay, all those guys starve.

>>12596007
They are adults. If they get controlled by these substances to such an extent that they cant keep themselves up anymore then it is natural selection to filter for frugality. Nothing wrong with not wanting to waste.

>>12596275
>Lepen familly are pretty much memes and are only proposing to slow down immigration, not reversing it.
don't forget, if you go against the jews as a politician they smear you as nazi in the media
many such cases
sad

>>12595887
Dont vote for boomers.
Vote for andrew yang, UBI will save this countries family unit and finally the boomers and bankers will pay for the working class after using us for so long.
It is time my brothers for us to invent, to raise families with wives being paid to raise kids at home.
It is soon!
Rise with us brothers and sisters and vote Andrew Yang a true independant conservative that cant get media coverage because he wants to tax disney bankers and amazon for automation.

>>12596984
Go check out andrew yang, he explains how in a conservative logical manner its why no cnn or fox or msnbc will putem on and promote him.
They hate the idea of the working class making it and american family unit coming back.,
Like Yang said, their is a war on the american workers through the rich and automation and the rich need to pay for destroying the infrastructure of the US because america is first.

>>12597441
I do, wither UBI works and we rise to the stars or the system collapses and we rebuild shit right and rise to the stars.
Mankinds destiny need not be stopped by boomer trash or the rich anymore.

>>12597519
Based. But sauce pls

>>12597353
Not if done properly like Andrew Yang has outlined.
Go checkem out, savior of america, the right way. Support the family unit and the american rural towns and communities. trickle up economy.

>>12597271
because when UBI is ontroduced employment goes up, jobs creation goes up, this is fact, it saves rural towns, and small towns, the rich hate this as they want everyone in cities.
It is time friend, UBI will rise America back to the way it should be.

>>12595939
It's cute that you think that you'll be able to afford corporate goods on UBI.

It's lightly seasoned compressed basedcakes for you, boyo.

>>12599073
>basedcakes
S O Y
fuck nuggers and jannies

>>12597353
This, and all the shit tier consumer garbage companies will rake in the cash.
In America, Soda is the number on item bought with food stamps.
If UBI hits America KFC, Addidas, Nike, Phillip Moris, Apple, and Sony stocks are going through the roof.

Just go watch the episode of the Chappell Show where Black folk get reparations.

Now I'm not arguing for rampant free markets, but if the goal is to give people a higher quality of life, giving them free money is not that.

>>12596166

Employers fault for hiring a useless worker.

>>12595887
Sauce

>>12595887
Please tell me you have more of her.

>>12595887
Its good yes UBI is the future

>>12596020
Fuck the ancap vests

>>12595887
I think OP meant to say "Universal BCASH income is the future"

>>12595887
Sauce on this ass

>>12595968
what a dumb tattoo, having two of these means NOTHING plugs into chainlink

>>12595887
The whole point of crypto is to make sure that goverment will not be able to tax anyone anymore. Coins will replace fiat money and start concentrating in the hands of the smartest and most autistic people in the world without any possibility of outside interference making UBI impossible. The result will be some kind of ancap utopia where survival of the fittest will really become about surviving.

>>12596389
>what happens to you when you hit, 40, 50, 60 years old?
What are you asking here? Do you think being a 50 year old wagecuck is more rewarding than being a 50 year old who has all day to fuck off?

>>12597987
>making people work 10 hours per week is a slave workforce
Okay, I guess we'll just all keep working for 40 hours per week instead, since 10 hours would slavery. What point are you trying to make, roo fucker?

We don't need ubi. We need to get the world population growth under control or else we will all go extinct. Countries like china, india, and the middle east need laws to discourage making more than 2-3 babies. We need sustainable food and water sources

>>12597499
LOL I get $2,500 USD a month gibs.

Plus free health care ($0 Cost to me with unlimited appointments), some free food and free petrol money.

And I don't live in America or Europe.

>>12596007

the idea is that it would be cheaper just to cut a check to everyone each month than run the massive gibs beauracracy

>>12601582
it would be even cheaper to just cut the gibs and let them invade another country

>>12596275
Menteur! Pharisien!

>>12601294
Monthly gibs in the UK is £255
Help.

>>12596007
>Too many people would just buy drugs and other bullshit.
Legalize it and tax it so it just feeds back into the economy. Doesn't matter what they spend it on.

I've said it before and I'll say it again:

>Basic Income is necessary to establish a basis for Universal Basic Income once technological automation reaches the 25% obsolescence point

No, there will not be "new jobs exclusively for humans" once strong Artificial Narrow Intelligence exists. That's 25% of all jobs gone. Once AGI or Artificial General Intelligence exists, that's more than 50% of jobs, mostly white collar professionals and professional degree work (including STEM and programming )

Everyone so far up their ass about screaming that basic income is a wash when it's the only solution other than culling 5.5billion people before the next 10-20 years (time frame for AGI emergence)

It's the only answer.

>>12596019
But gubermint jobs aint real jobs

>>12602090
>He believes there won't be jobs that humans and AIs won't need to work together on as frens

You're like a litteral Luddite destroying the cotten Mills.

>>12595933
t. gibs

>>12601022
t. low test
>tfw only a meme degree and some social skills landed me a nice job

>>12602121
Fool, I support complete 100 percent automation if possible, but that won't be possible until late stage AGI near ASI and we won't even be human at that point anymore (that's a good thing)

My point was, you can try to come up with solutions all day long about how to preserve your Stockholm syndrome need for work/employment, but at the end of the next decade you will likely be obsolete.

Yes, there will be many jobs that will be aided by a team of ANI and Humans. That's true, very true, and it shall produce productivity the likes of which we've never seen, but there will be an inflection point soon after where the humans are just in the way. That will come about not only on your life time but a mere handful of years after these specialized symbiotoc relationships take off.

Humans will be obsolete in industries that aren't personal service (care takers, zoomba instructors) and medicine in less than 25 years.

>>12602090
This is truth.
>>12601170
The people who say we dont need UBI are people who never worked a hard day and grew up out of a poor household I mean poor not your upper suburb shit.
Working men know UBI is a must.
>>12599199
Silverspoon wants mass blood in streets americans dying and people suffering because he worries about someone eating kfc.
Why dont ya just say you dont support because you hate minorities, are ya like Roger Stone one of those "im racist in public but let black man fuck my wife" type of shit? Yeah, that sounds about right.
Go fuck off silver spoon traitor to the people.
BTW in studies even the one in africa, people eat better, are healthier, less divorce, les broken homes, less homeless, less kids starving, volunteering goes up, stay at home moms raising kids go up, etc.
If you are against UBI you are trash, a pile of selfish boomer or boomer nut hugger trash.

>>12602173
go read the google futurist predictions, good invests in what he says.
He believes UBI is a must and will be in every first world country before 2030.
He believes by 2032 no disease and by 2035 humans will basically live hundreds of years off of nanobot technology in the medical field.
Dude also has an 80% corect rate on predictions since the 80s. let that sink in.
UBI is coming, the boomer just want to bleed us dry as long as they can, the rich are sick fucks who are selfish.

>>12595887
We already have universal brapper income.

>>12603032

I need proof of this

AI/robotics/iot research until companies simply don’t want to hire people because it won’t make sense for profit margins

>>12600553
lol no use case.

It always struck by as odd that UBI faggots are almost always open border faggots too. Don't they realize how fucking retarded these two positions are together?

>>12604716
I don't give a fuck about borders. I just want my gibs.

>>12604716
I support open borders but I also want the government to be tiny with no gibs for anyone, you can't have a truly free market without mobility of all factors. If I don't want to live close to niggers or spics I'll live in a gated community.

some months ago some anons shilled a concept of UI
Go check partialbasic.com its basically UI on crypto

>>12595887

Unironically Build Skynet and automate every job. That's the only way you could force UBI today, but since you are probably a brainlet, don't expect it to happen soon and get a job.

>>12604716
>UBI faggots are almost always open border faggots too.
So long as they only give UBI to citizens it should actually push out the illegals.

>>12595925
Unironically this.

>>12605045
No it'll just mean they push out anchor babies as fast as humanly possible

>>12605045
Exactly this, by lifting all citizens up you expose the illegals and force them to either wageslave to death or leave

>>12602575
What's interesting is crime statistics are on the rise. Crimes like armed robbery. The real revolution is already happening right now. It's starting in the poorest neighborhoods first. BLS report for JAN will be out in another few days. That should be an interesting read as well even if those numbers are inaccurate. they can only cover up so much.

>>12604716
No, they actually dont. Hitler said it best,
Sozial geht nur National.
'Social' in the broader sense of a welfare state is only possible if there is such a thing as a nation state

Dat ass

I think pol would be better at running an economy over biz.

>>12595887

>>12604733
You are a subhuman waste of oxygen.

buy ethereum.

>>12605989
He's got a point though. Trumps wall wont stop anyone. Might slow them down a bit but that's all it will do. This country is finished as far as i can tell. I'm 35 and i can say with complete honesty things have gotten increasingly worse since the 1990s.

>>12605951
imagine the smell

>>12606619
Worse how?
Shitty capitalists making safe bets and choosing comfort over innovation?
Shitty capitalists of course being the inevitable out come of inheritable wealth.
Americas principles have been eroded, we found this country on the idea of avoiding concentrated wealth.

>>12606568
chad ethereum

>>12595887
who is she? perfect body

>>12595887
I hate when you losers get kicked off /biz/ for this shit and move to /pol/ where you think you'd be more welcome as rejects but you end up being reject rejects.

Saw a documentary wherein they gave a homeless bum 100k cash and followed him around with a camera. Pre-interview he was all like, “I just want a couple grand to fix my teeth, man”.
He blew it in a month on lobster, beer, and hookers. Never fixed his teeth.

>>12602575
>>12602612
Good posts. Biz doesn't deserve you.

>>12596019
Universal Basic Employment? Not a bad idea, anon.

>>12596188
It is enough. Unless you live in a state with high cost of living / your bad with money.

>>12598993
CANT YIN THE YANG!

>>12595887
https://beta.forkdelta.app/#!/trade/0xa8bdc8882987a3ed83d8030f08d64479f1eff731-ETH

>not buying TRUE
>Shorting Okex
No wonder you're poor

>>12608953
Unironically picked up 10k

>>12608953
Kek literally free money

>>12608953

This would be good if OKeX didn't have kyc

>>12608975
The KYC on OKeX is a joke, anon. Just google "Korean" or "Chinese" ID and use the 6+ page...first ones are taken. Will 100% get you approved.

instead of UBI just give out coupons and stuff for basic stuff so that it's free. if you want something extra you gotta pay for it.

that way universal money doesn't go the wrong cause.

>>12608953
stop spreading this anon you're going to ruin a good opportunity by reposting this on /biz/, everyone should sage this thread

>>12607983
Cant yang the gooks

>>12608953
Nice find bro

>>12595887
Get a fucking job, you waste of anything you consume to exist at this moment.

>>12596015
Therefore it's ok to sell junk food to unhealthy fags with food stamps right?

Wrong Libtards make laws against that shit. My vending machine has to have vegetables in it or some bullshit

Where the fuck are the sniff posters?

>>12595887
Imagine the fucking sweet sweet stench