/biz/ - Business & Finance

at this point it's counterproductive for bitcoin.com to not admit they were wrong
roger has a an opportunity to set a great precedent, there's no need to endanger anyone's funds for a hopeless cause
proof of work is the fairest governance system to date

>>11724581
This post is way too on point for /biz/

Is ABC switching to PoS? If so they can get fucked.

>>11724764
I saw them talking about PoW algo change on twitter.

>>11724497
let's say Jihan does nothing and ABCSV wins and BCH becomes ABCSV

All Jihan is losing is just his pride, right? he's still got a 1M BCH, and if BCH goes up 1000% because of Craig Wright's ABCSV version then Jihan still going to make a shitload of money, right?

amaury also has a great opportunity to set a precedent, resign from abc to start developing on top of bch.
create value in script

>>11724800
Jihan will also lose the control of BCH source code

>>11724581
Absolutely. It's time to admit the whole bcash thing was a failure. BTC won, they have the most accumulated POW they are the better coin.

https://fork.lol/pow/hashrate

Don't forget to post this link every time someone even fucking mentions BCH > BTC

>>11724831
lol, btc is next after abc

>>11724497
BCHSV is currently "winning" but why is not reflected in the price? BCHABC is worth 3x more than BCHSV. Something is fishy here. I seriously doubt it's this obvious BCHSV is going to win and people buying BCHSV right now will be able to 3x their money so easily

>>11724831
>>11724862
We're coming for you next.

>>11724905
the reason bchsv is lower is because there is no situation where a bchsv coin is created

if sv win then we get bch and bchabc or just bch
if abc win we get bch

>>11724905
most bchers are still in deny

>>11724905
BCHABC is down 30% in 3 days, BCHSV is up 80% in 3 days

>>11724905
>BCHSV is currently "winning" but why is not reflected in the price?
The exchange it's listed on is literally funded by bitmain. Roger and Jihan are probably pumping it while unleashing hordes of shills across social media. Price manipulation and shills is typically how those two try to do things.

>>11724497
>One DogeCoin ripoff lost to another DogeCoin ripoff
Mark the calendar boys

>BCHSV
>Bitcoin Cash Herpes Simplex Virus

Bitcoin is king (BTC). All other version with the exception of 0xBitcoin (0xBTC) are trying to harm the king.

>>11724967
What's the point? If it really is all about hash, why havn't Roger and Jihan capitulated already? Seriously, it would make no sense to continue this charade. There must be something else.

Can someone explain what the fuck all of this means

Can Jihan not bring over as much hashpower over as he wants from BTC?

>>11725492
He can but CSW maintains this is highly illegal since it defrauds BTC investors.

What will happen on supporting exchanges at the time of fork? Will there all of a sudden be two new tickers and BCH disappears? For a net gain of one ticker. Will we be able to sell the forked coins immediately for BTC? Assuming someone wants to buy them of course.

I don't really care who wins, but ABC is uniroinically and unquestionably the technically correct path. Really what it comes down to though is in both instances, the blockchain space available will float at a free market price rather than centrally planned, ABC has a more efficient mechanism for the coordination of said space, so it stands to reason that the cost of provision should be lower, but so what if it's higher? BTC has a shitty centrally planned 1mb limit and utterly insane on chain space management and idiotically centralised characteristics, and yet it has done better than most assets in the past year. Clearly it is not *just* performance and technical sensibility that actually matters. Technically ignorant boomers opinion's do actually matter, for better or worse, and if you want to cooperate with them you must pay for the privilege.

Or I guess go off in your own sandpit and proceed forward in a technically optimal fashion and wait for the rest of the world to figure out you're right, but there's no guarantee they ever will. The world is full of fucking stupid people and the history of them becoming less so is abysmal.

What really matters is that both chains are able to scale upward permanently and the tx fees are set in a free market without central planning, and the decentralised nature of the chain remains intact. SV and ABC both meet those requirements.

>>11724830
> lose the control of BCH source code
> hurr durr bcash is decentralized

>>11725507
This is stupid, though. In the very IPO where Bitmain lists 1M+ BCH under assets, they're claiming it would be defrauding those assets to "protect" them. It makes no sense at all.

Everything aside from the hashrate coming from the SV camp is simple dickwaving. No more, no less. They can't force ABC not to fork away, they can't tamper with the ABC chain, and there's nothing they can do about it if ABC takes numerous measures to protect from them. IMHO the dickwaving actually makes their position less tenable, because it's obviously a bluff to anyone who knows what the fuck is going on. They should just shut the fuck up and let their hashpower and basic position of saying that their consensus rules are the right one speak for themselves. Threatening attacks that can't possibly work, and lawsuits that can't possibly win, reeks of desperation.

>>11724581

Roger is such a beta fag he should've stuck to CSW.

>>11725898
No it's not you dumb cunt CTO removes the Nash equilibrium from the game and makes the chain easier to attack (as block tx order can be easily predicted. Go allin SV

>>11724905
Remember that the exact same thing happened with s2x with the exact same splits and at the end of the day the futures prices trumped the hashpower signaling.

Hashpower means nothing until its employed to actually resolve a contentious split. Effectively right now what's happening is the ABC faction is saying they're prepared to go to and win the war too, and they're betting money on it in the form of those futures.

That's also why Craig is whining about said futures.

>>11726108
Hi Craig, you blathering shitcock.

The entire point of CTOR is that not only is the tx order easily predictable, there is only one valid possibility for it. This is to increase the efficiency of block propagation. I know you are so technically ignorant you don't even know what a fucking checksum is, but get a grip before you go broke and take all your cashed up useful idiot groupies with you.

>>11725984
I'm not so sure, based on what CSW has said and the last 12 months of bitmain rumors I think this is the basic situation.

Bitmain sold off the bulk of their S9 miners to CSW and Calvin as they were expecting to have 7nm miners early this year. 7nm production failed multiple times costing them over $500m and leaving them with no 7nm miners. This combined with trying to prop up BCH left them in a poor financial position, forcing them to raise funds and try to IPO. Antpool still has a ton of hashpower but they aren't Jihans machines, they're owned by other chinese.

Now Jihan probably can point Antpool at BCH but he would have to pay for the rewards the miners expect from mining BTC. With bitmains financial situation that is probably difficult and he can't just spend bitmain money on stupid shit right before the IPO. Despite all this I expect Jihan to still try it, I expect in this situation CSW will try to crash the BCH price so Jihan spends even more money mining with Antpool users hardware.

>>11726048
>Roger is such a beta fag he should've stuck to CSW.
He said this a while ago. I bet he ignores the result.
https://twitter.com/rogerkver/status/942457145043357696

>>11726115
>Hashpower means nothing
whew first time I've heard this from a cashie

>>11726142
> spend bitmain's money on stupid shit.
It hinges on that. You need to argue that an investor that bought into Bitmain understanding that they have heavily biased their investments towards BCH to the tune of 1m+ BCH would view protection of the BCH chain as stupid shit.

>>11725984 is right, that doesn't make any sense at all.

>>11724497
>>11724581
>>11724705
>>11724800
brainlets itt

jihan aka bitmain will switch hashing power over at any time

>>11726167
> quoting out of context
not at all the first time I've heard this from a coretard.

>>11724800
Jihan was trying to create a PoS system on top of ABC. He loses that if SV wins. Otherwise, he'll still have his 1 mil BCH in either chain.

>>11724831
BTC isn't even a cryptocurrency. It's a cryptoponzi "investment" right now with its 1MB blocks.

>>11726175
you know his assumption is wrong
if big blocks were already happening this dispute would destroy the chain
try maintaining something where you can't even sync a node while the miners signal something else, think hard about this buddy and realize you've been wrong for over a year now

>>11726212
It's not wrong, he's factually correct. That's exactly what happened on hashpower signalling vs futures last time this exact same situation occurred. If you don't know that, you're stupid. But you're a coretard, so that's not really new data.

> if big blocks were already happening this dispute would destroy the chain
This is a lie, if big blocks were already happening nigh on 100% of the SHA256d hashing power available would be on a single chain, which is approximately 46-50EH. If a tiny faction then acquired between 2 and 3 EH and dickwaved it around like they were going to shank a bitch in order to get their way, everyone else would fucking laugh at them.

>>11726172
>jihan aka bitmain will switch hashing power over at any time
sure ABCcuck...

>>11726233
talk about quoting out of context
you don't get it there's nothing anyone can say to you
have fun losing all your money retard

>>11726233
BLEURRU JUST LIKE S2X
meanwhile all the services bitpay exchanges etc. are pumping ABC
these cashie kids are so dumb

>>11726168
>It hinges on that. You need to argue that an investor that bought into Bitmain understanding that they have heavily biased their investments towards BCH to the tune of 1m+ BCH would view protection of the BCH chain as stupid shit.
It probably depends how much pain CSW can inflict as they do it. If as the hashpower leaves BTC he dumps the price below 6k, the miners will be furious demanding to know why Jihan is using it to crash the price. If he crashes the entire crypto market enough it can easily destroy bitmain entirely.

The safest response is to just deal with the wormhole cash thing not going ahead. Jihan has proven to be greedy, shortsighted and somewhat stupid in the past however.

>>11726256
Maybe the reason the state chose the BTC chain to subvert is because coretards can't into critical thinking, it's really interesting that even after the shittiest imaginable possible year, where they've been begging the state to assfuck them harder, and the state has been assfucking them hard indeed, they can still act like they know better than anyone else what's going on. Blows my fucking mind.

>>11726288
Yeah nah, problem with that is that miners don't give a fuck about core, have loudly announced at multiple intervals that they hate it and want it to die.
BCH being ascendant and BTC dying horribly is *exactly* what the miners want. If Craig does that, he's doing them a favour. And also, that would assume he's actually Satoshi. He's not, that's simply a lie. Satoshi knows what a fucking checksum is and can code hello world without ripping it off from a tutorial.

>>11726297
CME futures probably caused the pump and dump last year but what can ya do
bitcoin hasn't changed in anyway
this past week lightning network has had more contributions then in the past 4-5 months it's growing exponentially

Who gives a shit you fags about bch

>>11726315
> CME futures probably caused the pump and dump last year but what can ya do
Yeah definitely wasn't the 50USD+ fees that everyone in the BCH camp had been warning about for years prior as the inevitable outcome, definitely wasn't the fact that it's simply the historical record that BTC was sabotaged and hijacked from the original scaling plan to more than visa level. You were totally sabotaged by those CME futures, from the same institutions that are now propping your retarded ass up with shit like bakkt and liquid.

> bitcoin hasn't changed in anyway
The absolute state of retarded fucking corecucks. I don't know which is more hilarious, that you might not even be aware that you're lying, or that you can simply lie so directly and expect to be believed in any way.

> this past week lightning network has had more contributions then in the past 4-5 months it's growing exponentially
And it's still a necessarily centralised piece of shit that flatly doesn't work and never will.

>Just heard about the fork on wednesday.
>Don't care about politics.
>have BCH on Ledger.
Wat do?

>>11726353
If you honestly just don't give a fuck, hold.
If you think ABC is going to win, sell, buy ABC futures on polo, you'll have more BCH at fork time.
If you think SV is going to win, sell, buy SV futures on polo, you'll have more BCH at fork time.

>>11726345
the absolute state of cashie
he is still fixated on blocksize not realizing segwit, tx batching, and other methods have achieved the same results without changing the protocol

>>11726360
Christ you're a fucking stupid cunt. 32mb blocks is not "same results" as a shit tier 1mb block with 40% segwit adoption, sabotaged chain moving volume off to two centralised master layers, and turning the BTC layer into a dysfunctional slave layer. That you think this isn't "changing the protocol" is just the icing on the fucking cake.

>>11726392
you unironcally think 32mb+ blocks is better than efficiently writing data with tx batching and other methods...

>>11726409
You unironically think batching makes a difference, you unironically think you can't fucking batch with a higher blocksize, and you unironically think a transaction format that unironically uses more space is unironically efficient than the original.
You should unironically set up an exit bag and put yourself out of your fucking misery you cock chugging thundercunt.

>>11726433
he doesn't even know about incentive
good luck trying to enforce efficiency on mainchain when you whore it out for under a penny
good luck trying to scale a system like that worldwide
jesus christ you people are so dumb

>>11726433
This is the kind of guy that will suddenly hate bigger blocks when core nonchalantly upgrades to a 4MiB block size

>>11726456
> doesn't understand orphan risk
Yeah, fuck off dumb cunt.

>>11726487
In 2020 nobody will care. BTC will be dead and everyone will have moved over to something that actually works and isn't run by rank incompetents.

>>11726309
>Yeah nah, problem with that is that miners don't give a fuck about core, have loudly announced at multiple intervals that they hate it and want it to die.
>BCH being ascendant and BTC dying horribly is *exactly* what the miners want.
Chinese miners are just greedy business people, they don't care about crypto, only short term profits. Any BTC crash right now will drag down BCH, costing miners money. BCH ABCs side chain focus will limit any miner support to begin with.

SV may have enough hashpower for an attack, but ABC is working as we speak on ways to protect against it.

>>11726526
Yeah like changing the POW algorithm lololololol
What a greasy french cunt

>>11726309
craig is a troll, he did the bad code on purpose.

he wants people to hate them so he can have the ever bigger smug/"i told you so" moment when he finally reveals that he is satoshi legit.

>>11726763
That is literally the excuse trotted out for the many dozens of abject failures that guy has spewed out. At a certain point you realise, no, he's actually an idiot.

>>11726763
based and satoshipilled

>>11726172
If he could he would have it done already.

>>11726172
ok but they'll have to mine at a loss
as soon as they stop mining at a loss, Craig takes over

>>11726727
ABC won't change the POW algo. They have another surprise.

>>11727018
You hope. Kek

>>11724865
>>11724920
>>11726185
haha look at the butthurt cashlets.

>>11724922
Dafuq u high on

>>11727018
can't wait for a decentralized currency to reveal their secret surprise with 1 day notice lol

guys what if abc gives up and there's no fork?

>>11724865
>BCash killing themselves on a civil war and if anyone is left standing the remainders will be crushed by Bitcoin

imagine

>>11728141
that's the plan
all this drama and volatility is a smoke screen for bitmain to cash out what they can

>>11724497
****QUESTION****
If I am holding BCH on Binance what happens after the fork?
****QUESTION****