/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>11188878

sure some people will grow their own
but it's like vegetables you buy in the store, sure you can grow your own but it's way more convenient to buy it

>>11188878
also you have thousands of strains you can choose from when it's produced professionally by the companies out there, and service from specialists at dispensaries

>>11188878
>>11188890
>but it's like vegetables you buy in the store, sure you can grow your own but it's way more convenient to buy it

Its market model will be much closer to alcohol. There will be shitty weed you can buy in a gas station for <$10 a gram and there will also be overpriced yuppie weed you'll be able to buy just like overpriced wine

>>11188923
agreed

>>11188878
If weed is legalized nationally, I don't think more people really smoke weed. The private sector will probably still drug test for thc like normal, therefore most of the workforce doesn't start smoking weed just because it's legal. Really all legalization does is replace drug dealers and gives uncle sam tax.

>>11188981
More people will turn on, tune in and drop out.

>>11188890
not really, a well done harvest can last you years with not that much space required. Consumable vegetables on the other hand are consumed fast and take much more space to grow

>>11188911
I think one of the things that the mainstream consumer is going to be challenged with is just the sheer "variety" there is of weed. Gorilla glue, Girl Scout Cookies, White Widow, sure some of these have a cultural clout but I doubt anyone would have the chops to tell the difference between indica and sativa, and they don't carry as significant a visual distinction (post processing that is) like that of red vs white wine which people can grow to prefer. This lack of standardization is going to be a challenge. The opportunity I see here is if certain companies can patent their genetics in some way to make it distinct in the market, that's the kind of investment I'm trying to find.

>>11189011

What percent of people do you think are going to spend the money and time to do a good indoor grow? Not that many, is my wager. Maybe you'll have more backyard growers though.

>>11188878
also there are CBD extracts to put in drinks and what not

>>11189054
indoor grow? with legal weed? wtf you talking about. Point is, nobody is gonna go buy agrocorp weed when you can just grow pounds and pounds of the stuff in your backyward

>>11189077
Since I'm trying to aim for as high up the supply chain as possible yeah that would include CBD as well. I know it's been getting a lot of interest from other areas and to be honest I think it's the most interesting movement, it might not have the sex appeal that marijuana has but the boring standardization of CBD products and it's lack of intoxicating effects makes it much more approachable for mainstream audiences (I see it as those melatonin-drink that promote restful sleep, that kind of level pseudo-medical in a manner of speaking). So I'm trying what the best point of entry at the very top of the chain whether it's a patent or maybe a company acquiring another company for talent/materials, case in point Green Organic Dutchman acquiring HemPoland.

>>11189020
Acquiring the genetics of "undiscovered" landrace strains, that's where the real danger/money is.

>>11189135
I'm trying to keep my ear to the ground about landrace strains. So far the best I know if is Greenhose from Amsterdam, it might be their marketing/social media influencing me but they seem to have focus for those landraice strains. I doubt there's going to be "undiscovered" one at this point in time (although I'd love hear about that adventure in finding it) but for now it might be what the current market has/deals with. This could also be a problem with people trying to fake landrace strains as well now that the market has opened up.

>>11189168
There are definitely undiscovered landrace strains still out there. Africa’s a huge continent and we've only scratched the surface there. It’s just incredibly dangerous and difficult to find them. Take Franco Loja for example, he died from malaria during a landrace expedition in the Congo. All the other landrace strains are literally in war zones in Afghanistan, Pakistan, etc. I wouldn’t be surprised if big pharma companies are already doing these types of expeditions, unbeknownst to us. You basically need a well financed private army to undertake these expeditions.

>>11188878
You're right OP. The only reason that weed fetches higher market prices than other ag crops that require similar inputs is because of the artificial scarcity that illegality provides.

The real price of weed is the min wage labor it takes to process the weed plus the economic rent of the land it's grown on. It'll drop by a factor of 10 at least.

Once the initial rush and legal troubles are over I'd steer clear of it. Once it's more legit I doubt the major firms would be much different from the rest of agriculture, and much like the brewery rush flooding the market with shit IPA there's going to be a swarm of retards that always dreamed of making it on weed. There will be some that claw their way to prominence but the likelihood of getting in early is small, probably equivalent with shitcoin gambling.

>>11189251
>Franco Loja
I loved watching the Strain Hunters series, he has such a genuine passion for this industry, it was a rare and beautiful thing to see.

>>11189329
>brewery rush flooding the market with shit IPA there's going to be a swarm of retards that always dreamed of making it on weed.
Good point.

>>11189103
Many connoisseurs prefer the more potent indoor, controlled environment product.

>>11189374
I see automated farming becoming a big area for this industry, even if natural organic farming has a special place in the consumers hearts.

>>11189353
Agreed, he was totally genuine and incredibly knowledgable. I love how he could pick up subtle details and tricks locals used to grow their crops. Funny how Greenhouse doesn't actually sell any 'regular' landrace seeds. It's all feminized hybrids. They don't sell seeds that people died to get, much too valuable.

>>11189168
ACE seeds out of Spain is doing cool stuff with sativa landrace
I have a good idea I want to explore in the connoisseur marijuana industry (I'm ~75% sure no one is doing yet) but I'm on probation for possession lol
Since being arrested for marijuana possession I've learned a lot about the connoisseur tobacco and cigar markets.
One of my good friends works in the industry for rocky patel.
I've been sampling many different cigars from many different countries and manufacturers. This industry is 100s of years old and their methods are time tested and many are trade secrets.
They processing is one thing, and the presentation and establishments built around it are another.
Rocky invested 5 million into a cigar bar in my town that holds events and is really nice
the "dab bars" I've been to in colorado were pretty shit and I know I could make a venue work better than what I saw.

marijauna might get dominated like tobacco with cheap shit like cigarette quality smokes, but there will be a market for a social setting and higher quality products.

>>11189353
>>Franco Loja
>>11189445
my favorite episode was when he was smelling and balling up all those different bags of hash/kief while arjan was talking
he was so passionate about marijuana it was really upsetting to learn about his passing

>>11189501
>connoisseur tobacco and cigar markets.
My gut says that is going to struggle when it comes to marijuana. Billions have been spent on anti-tobacco campaigns and even new cigarette alternatives like Juul are getting criticized by the public at large for it's popularity among teens. I think that as marijuana comes into legalization one of the headaches it'll face is trying to divorce itself from tobacco even if it has a social proofing from things like blunts and hookahs.

>>11189610
I was thinking up something like a rec center for adults to get high and play board games, cards, xbox, arcade, talk, have espresso/coffee sales, watch sports, movies, or have live music, maybe a miniputt or some shit
the cigar bars I've been to have been really professional and business leaning because a good cigar gets your brain firing, but I was thinking about something nice but goofy/informal for marijuana

also there's an entire list of methods of processing marijuana I want to try, the industry standard is very amateur compared to tobacco

im paying $3 a gram
thats in canadian maple money
thats $2.32 american
per gram

i walk into a store downtown and i pick it up, no license required. they dont ask my name. if you look underage they will ask to see your id and thats it.

its not bad either. $5 grams are better, their best stuff will go for up to $12 but thats the absolute primo tier top canadian bud

its great, free market really drove down the price. was paying $10 a gram from a dealer back in the day, or $60 a quarter ounce.

>>11189782
and there are now almost as many dispenseries as there are convenience stores, theyre all over town.

>>11189020
canadian consumers have the chops to tell the difference. each dispensery will have at least a dozen or two dozen strains available. people talk about their fav strains easily

its pretty great guys, can you even imagine. weed stores everywhere selling $3 grams. you can have that too america.

>>11189835
sounds like a dream
how are the taxes?
my state only issued 27 medical marijuana dispensary permits and it cost 10k nonrefundable to apply and an additional 250k for the license and proof of 500k in the bank to operate the establishment
it's a joke and hope it's figured out soon

and the weed never sucks, even for $3 it gets you high, sometimes its even really good. the $5 strains are great. i havent even gotten into the $12 strains yet.

27 dispensaries for over 12 million people

>>11189845
basically the situation grew beyond anyones ability or desire to control and its a wild free market right now more or less, the way it should be. i hope it stays that way. at least with doug ford the free market has a chance. hes going to let the brick and mortar stores stay open, the liberals wanted to shut down the stores and make everyone buy government weed from the lcbo. good thing the liberals lost and hard.

i dont know how its taxed yet. they dont charge tax when you buy the weed. its becoming officially legal in october so we shall see how it all works itself out soon.

but the less involved the government is the better this is going to work for everyone

>>11189855
my city has about 50 of them for half a million

>>11189782
>i walk into a store downtown and i pick it up, no license required.
This is what I'm looking forward to, it'll be so much more fun when I don't have the anxiety about getting it. Plus I'd love to see how the money raised will help build out communities.

>>11189879
it gets foot traffic flowing to areas that have other business as well. the convenience store or restaurant or whatever next to a dispensery is going to get some of the dispenseries business from people now out of their cars and walking in that neighborhood.

and its dignified, walking into a store and just buying it like a normal thing. any other way feels completely retarded now. there is no way canadians can go back now having tasted the convenience and dignity of just buying it in a store. no more quiet deals in back alleys with shady dealers and feeling like a criminal and paying out the nose and supporting crime and not even knowing what strain youre smoking. people arent going to accept going back to the way things were. nor should they.

>>11189901
Do you find much distinction between the different brands there? Like if you were drinking a soda a Coke wouldn't taste anything like a Fanta, can you make out a distinct difference between labels? Or even strains?

>>11189922
Abso-fucking-lutely
The barebone minimum is sativa vs indica and then from within there are all of the different strains that give you all different types of euphoria and relaxation and you feel it differently in your body and head depending on the strain / CBD % / THC %
The plants are cross-bred for this purpose

My outlook on the publically traded cannabis upstarts is positive in the short term, negative in the long term. I have no doubt that if legalization happens, it would not be hard for the massive agro concerns out there to muscle in and just totally crush the startups on economies of scale.

>>11189922
basically most strains feel the same, but if its heavily satvia or heavily indica you can tell, and potency levels you can also tell.

but there are stand out strains. there are strains where you can tell that is what you are smoking. not just by taste and smell, but by the high. i imagine different strains work best for different people. and ido remember my favorite strains and re buy them. the ones that didnt stand out i generally only try once and move on.

its not really brands, its strain names. i dont think people are aware of the brands. but different brands will grow different strains.

>>11189959
i dunno dude, im already buying $3 grams (2.31usd) how much cheaper can big agri make it?

>>11189973
$95 quarters still in new york shitty

>>11189947
>>11189963
This is really interesting, maybe it's because we don't yet have a selection right now, so you can't yet build up a flavor/high profile but finding a certain blend between sativa and indica and building a customer base through it, much like a restaurant specializing in a certain style of cuisine would do.

>>11189984
I've been in your shoes brother, hang in there.

>>11190014
at first i couldnt really tell the difference, within 2 months i certainly can. ive got favorites at different price points. and now when i smoke weed i have a more distinguished ability to discern its quality then i had before. all the options have turned me into a connoisseur

lol its funny thing on this whole thread is its a bunch of people speculating.

in conclusion: if you dont know what will happen with the cannabis industry just dont.

literally built on the backbone of kids taking money from their parents to buy weed. you have no idea what will become the mainstream drug in the future, and that is what should scare you from investing into weed. there is no doubt there will be a new drug kids will want to take everyday and it wont be weed

>>11190047
>literally built on the backbone of kids taking money from their parents to buy weed
i dont see kids in the dispenseries, they dont sell to underagers or they would get in big shit, not worth the risk when they are full of adult customers at all hours. people of all ages, just as many gen x and even boomers as millenials.

on the business side its a lot of speculation yes. but if it was a sure thing with no risk then there would likely be low reward. so people will speculate and why not.

meanwhile you are the one speculating on the social aspects. and based on my experience actually living the situation you fear, your concerns are unrealistic and fanciful.

>>11188981
I disagree. If weed were legalized federally, I definitely will try it for the first time. I never did because i didn't want that shit in my urine or hair in case of random drug tests. Also, I don't think companies will be allowed to tell people they can't smoke, just like they can't tell people not to drink alcohol. People just can't get high at work or be intoxicated before coming in to start their shift. Again, it will be considered the same as alcohol (legal drug).

>>11190047
You're not wrong, but if there's some area I feel like the risk is worth it a little bit I'd dip my toe in it. For example Green Organic Dutchman has a former 25 year P&G consumer goods executive, along with their acquisition of the aforementioned HemPoland, so I think while it might not be a long term hold, it could be a company that's built up specifically to get acquired down the line. Doesn't feel like a fly by night operation when you have to put your name in like. Still I'm cautious

>>11190084
those are facts not speculation

>>11190098
you actually made a couple speculations:

>speculation: people will pick some new future drug over weed
thats dumb. most people dont want some weird lab chemical. they want to smoke a plant, and this is the plant that people like to smoke.
>speculation: the customers are kids
reality: nope, for reasons ive alreayd explained

check my other posts, i live in a city of half a million people with about 50 dispenseries selling 3 and 5 dollar grams. its working great

>>11190136
and if you think weed will fall out of fashion and maybe people will start smoking something else. then no... its just weed. you can smoke salvia or wild lettuce or blue lotus or whatever, but its not weed. there is no replacement for weed

>>11190136
the problem is you are so stuck on the statistics you dont even know the consumers side. at this point i am so confident i am right that we would just have to agree to disagree

>>11190136
well to be fair only a few places sell 3 dollar grams, but basically every dispensery will have at least a couple $5 grams if not a few.

you can pay whatever price you want basically.
check weedmaps online if you dont believe, just hover around southern ontario and check the prices on the menus.

>>11189922
Weed shop worker here. Some of the brands are definitely distinguished in their ability to deliver top notch bud. Northern Emeralds is an example of a top flight grower. Pic related is their flagship strain and I’ve never felt/tasted anything like it.

So I have a business idea I'm looking to start in the next few months.
PNW US.
I've worked in the beer industry for 8 years.
Brewing, marketing, sales etc.
I think I know where the cannabis market is headed, and my goal is to start a company and sell it to big beer in the next 2 years.
Luckily my partner worked for ABinbev for 10 years.
Should be interesting. Maybe I'll make a few hundred mil. We'll see.

>>11190153
right about what?
all you said is that its kids buying this shit with their parents money and that the kids will move on to a different drug in the future.

statistics? im just saying i live in a city full of stores selling weed. the situation you can only speculate on, im living that situation. and its going great

>>11190164
should put the brand name on the jar as well, not just the strain name. i dont even know what brands im smoking.

>>11190153
>you dont even know the consumers side.
i only know the consumers side
i dont know the business side and i havent said anything about if its a good business to get into, i dont know.

>>11189501
Actually genius. Imagine a hookah bar type of place but for weed instead. Wow, that place would never be empty.

On a different note, is anybody invested in "pot stocks" such as Tilray or Canopy Growth?

>>11190144
>if you think weed will fall out of fashion and maybe people will start smoking something else. then no... its just weed.
Exactly, weed has been with us throughout most of human history. The fact that it was artificially repressed is what made it bloom underground, now the prohibition is dissolving. Sure plenty of companies will go bust chasing the profits, but out of them there will be a few that will become the Marlboro of marijuana.

>>11190164
That's awesome, although I am waiting to see the branding industry flex a little muscle here and get creative with the packaging. For now it's functional but it lacks any distinct spirit.

insider here =]

I know all the answer but not gonnnna teeeeellllllllll =]

>>11190213
place would literally print money lol

>>11190213
yeah man
I've spent countless mornings smoking pot drinking coffee and playing backgammon
an establishment for that alone would be fantastic but it probably sounds autistic to 99% of consumers
copying the hooka bar type set up, maybe do corny trivia and movie nights would get some people in, sell redbull and shit to keep them smoking

people like to come in and look at the giant jars filled with bud inside the glass counter. the store clerk asks if there is anything you would like to smell. this is normal. people like to come in and smell the jars. you make your selection, you have about 2 dozen strains to choose from in large jars around the room. also on offer is hash, oils, shatter, baked goods and candies and cbd fluids, etc.

>>11190339
i mention this because people were talking about brainding and packaging. and weed here at the canadian dispenseries comes out of giant glass jars behind the counter. its a different situation as far as branding goes.

>>11190357
cause you gotta be able to see it and smell it obviously. so its not prepackaged. they do sell some prepackaged strains though but not many

>>11190339
I think there might be a long consumer education cycle before it's widly adopted beyond smoking. Hash, oils, vapes, these all require additional equipment, standards of strength and the consumer will also have to personally see their own tolerance levels to new forms of marijuana.

>>11188878
For US right now i look at broad reach across several markets in the form of state issued growth and sales licenses. This is one of the reasons Acreage Holdings has so much hype around it. They have licenses in several states already.

>>11190430

>>11190251
Check out Canndescent. They’re generating a lot of hype and their branding/packaging attempts to bring a more upscale lifestyle to weed. They explicitly inform buyers of their 1/8 box set to use the provided hemp wick and not a lighter to smoke their buds because butane taints the taste.

>>11190582
>Canndescent
It's really beautiful, I'm a sucker for beautiful pleasing packaging and branding.

>>11190582
>>11190627
cannadescent are mids. they sell year old dry mids. they will not succeed long term with their current business model.

Drinks, pills, topicals and vaping
Thats the future of weed
The upcoming generation are more health conscious than ever before. They go to juice bars and get their buzz off social media.
Smoking will be seen as something for special occasions.
Aurora cannabis + Coca cola

The real money will be made on the infrastructure, not the product. Testing and researching, selling grow equipment, contracting building services marketing etc.

>>11188981
you are forgetting the medical field, cannabis can be used to relieve anxiety and can be used as an alternative to antidepressants.

>>11191887
Theres an arguement that patients need a wholistic approach to cannabis. Isolates dont always work and if they do not as well, often. Cannabis chems combined create a medicene like no other. Thats why I dont think smoking will die out, itll just dwindle whilst the rest takes over. Dry herb vaping will be the preferred method - you will be able to give your avb back to dispensaries / manufacturers where theyll process it for cbd and thc isolates too.

>>11191887
>relieve anxiety
Oh boy, you are in for a surprise

>>11192209
CBD alone can, cannabis dependency combined with an unfulfilling lifestyle can really exacerbate it.