/biz/ - Business & Finance

Ask soros. He's losing a ton of money waiting for that to happen.

>RECORD HIGH STOCK MARKETS

stay mad
Im tired of winning :)

>>10359592
this is why there wont be a crash, too many people waiting to buy the dip

>>10359645
tariffs disproportionally affect Trump's voter base

too bad they're too dumb to realize that

republicans will wait until the end and make democrats clean up the mess like in 08

>>10359652
is that what CNN told you

>>10359652
don't worry, they'll find a way to blame the liberals.

>>10359661
tariffs on cheap shit imported from china affects people who buy cheap shit imported from china
>>10359669
betcha

>>10359592
Not any time soon. The tariffs won't have that major of an effect because China isn't the only place companies can manufacture their goods, there are plenty of places in SE asia to relocate too. We'll have a lot of volatility but crashes mostly happen because of too much debt circulating in relation to assets backing it, basically over leveraged. People and companies are a lot more reluctant to go into the debt that they went into 10 - 15 years ago.

>>10359732
>People and companies are a lot more reluctant to go into the debt that they went into 10 - 15 years ago.
Then please explain this

>>10359592
>im tired of winning
Fix that 4 u

>>10359592
>>10359863
Trump saw the future

>>10359877
He is a time traveler

>>10359652
You're never going to make it being that stupid.

>>10359855
Retarded college kids racking debt

>>10359677
> REEEEEEEEEE. BERNIE CAN STILL WIN!!!11 The economy is doing so well IT MUST BE A MISTAKE! I JUST WANT TO CRASH SO THAT WE CAN GET ORANGE CHEETO MAN, EVEN IF THAT MEANS I SUFFER. REEEEEEE

That's all I heard.

It has to happen, he himself said it was a bubble right before he got elected. I almost feel it's inevitable so they go "I told you so!' and blame the free market, when in reality we are in a complete socialism. Free market would never bail out companies and banks, nor use a controlled central fiat currency it's fucking absurd.

>>10360049
It definitely isn't free capitalism. He also definitely didn't say we were in a bubble. The economy was in the shitter up until around the beginning of his presidency.

>>10360049
Honestly this is the only reason I have so much faith in crypto eventually recovering. I mean if you really think on crypto, it's almost laughable, but the U.S. economy and financial system is so broken and has been so mismanaged I trust ponzis more than the U.S. dollar.

>>10359661
>>10359669
Your political beliefs are getting in the way if your business. Stop or lose money.

>>10359652
Same goes for you but you are absolutely right, tarrifs hurt business in the long run but it almost immediately makes poor people poorer.

>>10359855
This scares me, as it should everyone. If a Cambodian wood wittling forum knows it's about to crash, it's definitely about to crash

>>10359592

Fall of 2019 is when the crash will begin. WIll take 2 - 3 years to reach the bottom. A nuclear weapon will go off in a major country during that time period.

>>10360077
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xn9jLy_TB4

>>10359592
I seriously hope a recession hits soon. I have enough money stored to buy the shit out of large companies.

>>10360082
Same, at least there isn't a group of people in some huge disgusting city I don't give a fuck about printing more of my money for free.

>>10360103
>Same goes for you but you are absolutely right, tarrifs hurt business in the long run but it almost immediately makes poor people poorer.

Please. We're all merchants!

And, like a good merchant, I trade with everyone who brings me shekels.

Plus, Trump is the most amusing person turned President I have yet witnessed. Even outclassing Bush Jr.!

>>10360133
This is fucking eye opening anon, thank you

>>10360103
>This scares me, as it should everyone. If a Cambodian wood wittling forum knows it's about to crash, it's definitely about to crash

My baseline is, we're doomed. But, that shouldn't stop me from enjoying the party while it lasts.

>>10360021
Then you're incredibly emotionally stunted.

>>10360134
>>10360103
>>10360077
>>10360049
>>10360082
Prevalence of negative yield bonds suggest investors are so sure of the imminent collapse they're willing to lose money in the short term so as to secure their funds
>Only way to win is to lose the least
>Pay central banks to hold your money because they are the least likely to default when shit hits the fan

But all the experts on TV told me le drump was supposed to ruin everything. This booming economy doesn't exist and if it does it certainly isn't because of him! They told me this can't happen!!!!!!!!!!

>>10359592
>>10359652
>>10359641
YOU'LL PAY FOR THIS DRUMPFKINS!!

>>10360126
What's with all the names these days?

>>10360353
"Anonymous" is too individual

>>10360103
This anon gets it - so many /pol/ faggots arguing muh trump but don't look at the bigger picture/writing on the wall in terms of what will happen in the markets. Anons need to stop the political tribalism and figure out how to make money off all the policies being pushed by whatever bag of shit is in charge.

>>10360481
Spoken like a true Merchant.

I commend you

erase this the new biz beberage is pepsi

>>10360134
>>10360126
This goes to you two but any anon is welcome to answer this question. Why isn't anyone talking about shorting the market? Buying Bear ETF's?

>>10360609
working on it

>>10359612

>actually run an import business via china
>not an idiot so i'm finding suppliers in mexico
Why anyone would ever take economic advice from liberals whom have never actually participated in any economy outside of taking out student loans and being a wagecuck is absolutely fucked.

>>10360609
On that subject, i'm late 20's with 100k+ in my 401k, wat do for recession? Should i even bother doing anything?

>>10360627
I don't know how to futures/contracts short. I do know the Bear ETFs to buy though... Will the earnings be comparable?

>>10360640
Wait until Boomers crash the 401k market and destroy social security and the economy as one last 'fuck you' to the next generation. Then withdraw what's left.
This is their magnum opus

>>10359592
The "crash" happen in Feb.
It was heavily mitigated and just a correction.
This train is going full speed ahead

>>10360609
Because it's hard to time, takes big initial investment to match what you can make in crypto, and there's a huge possiblity that the government will make sure the bottom isn't as low as it should be

>>10360657
depends on the leverage

>>10360640
Nigga, I'm out here asking questions, not giving answers. I'm not one of these anons that tell you to buy stupid shit & get wiped out for the lulz... That said, I would take at least half of that & buy Bear ETFs

>>10360681
>crypto

Also, even if the floor isn't as low as it should be, it will be low... I think

>>10360685
fair enough - i was only looking for the lulz - but appreciate the rare anon not screwing over the community

i got my shit covered

>>10359659
This

>>10360683
>Leverage

I'm not borrowing more to make this bet. I've got what I feel is enough

>>10359677
A trump voters understanding of trade economics. Cheap steel from China is what you car is made out of retard.

>>10360721
What's your plan?

>>10360353
>>10360126
Seriously, he needs to get back in his time machine and get the fuck out of here.

>>10360727
Futures are typically bought on margin (at most brokers you can't even do it without margin loans) so when buying / selling futures, well yes you're borrowing.

>>10359592

he wont, the fed raising rates will.

>>10360742

> 100% stocks - primarily tesla, amazon, and netflix
> Taking a 401k loan to buy a nice little entry level house in a gentrified neighborhood
> Investing heavily in link as a crypto hedge against fiat

I'm going to make it

>>10360764
>FANG stock
>401k to buy a house in an already expensive neighborhood
>a fucking linklet
this has to be a meme right?

>>10360758
This is correct and stated specifically by Trump in >>10360133

>>10360748
Futures fuck me up desu. Complicated. I'm leaning towards just buying ETFs because they're simple. I'll know what I'm doing when I pull the trigger

>>10360780
Yes, this is a joke because these are literally the worst three things to do as of current.

>>10360780
On point 2, you missed another point about entry level houses being in a bubble

>>10360609
Takes a lot of balls to short this stuff, because the government might just try and prop the lie up forever.
My third world nation went through a similar ordeal:
>Be Brazil
>Have a commodity based economy
>Prosper through the 90s and 00s because of the boom in said market
>Irresponsibly increase govt spending
>Nothing happens because the economy is doing so well
>Come the early 2010s
>China slows the fuck down, commodities crash
>Govt gotta do some serious cuts and roll taxes back or shits gonna go sour very fast
>Stubborn leftie govt refuses to employ damage control
>Keeps on increasing spending. “This is temporary, we'll go back to having infinite demand for our exports soon”
>Go down squirming and refusing to accept reality
>But it's too late
>Country goes into recession for 9 consecutive quarters in 2015
>GDP goes down 8%, 25 million unemployed
>Still struggling to climb out of the hole to this day

If only they had accepted defeat earlier, there might have been less consequences. Also, whoever shorted the place had to endure some three years of artificial growth corroding their position before the reality sunk in

>>10360764
comfy
what could go wrong
enjoy

>>10360789
The joke is, bear ETFs are artificial constructs..

made of futures, options, contracts for difference, and more exotic things.

Which you don't know about either.

But you eat sausage, so it's probably fine :^)

>>10359652
I work buying and selling different metals- factories are going balls to the wall right now busier than they’ve been since GW Bush’s 2nd year in office.

>>10360764
Outside of untrustworthy crypto, you're the investing equivalent of a top-40 music listener. I thought you were going to make it anon

>>10360809
first things first, who is she?

second,
>keynesianism
>not even once

>>10359855
>Please explain this
>10 - 15 years ago
>posts graph covering only 3 years ago
Maybe you should go to the the range of data that you mentioned originally, then you'll answer your own question. Also see pic related, publicly traded companies as a whole are just now starting to get to the levels of leverage they were at 10 - 15 years ago, however, consumers are still below that mark, perhaps a lot more reluctant was an overstatement, they're still reluctant though. Also Energy and Natural Resource companies are dragging the figure downwards, as they are often highly leveraged and in a volatile market in regards to commodities.
>>10360242
>Prevalence of negative yield bonds suggest investors are so sure of the imminent collapse they're willing to lose money in the short term so as to secure their funds
The irony is, that with this many negative yield bonds, it creates more liquidity, which means it's easier for those with these bonds to actually spend their money, than it would have been otherwise. This is another reason why I think we're seeing volatility but won't see a major crash, too much liquidity, not enough leverage.

>>10360145
>>10360103
>>10360193
based off of your posts, you should do more research friendo :^)

>>10360780
No, just read the thread to see how clueless a lot of people are

>>10360789
Don't fuck with ETFs if your not experienced. Index funds are the way to go if your bullish. (Not saying I am) ROBO index fund is interesting if trumps plan to tax us more on goods ever results in more manufacturing in the u.s..

>>10360242

I am making extra income on volatile bear bull X10 certs. When and what X10 bears are best to buy when shit starts going sour ? And what would be the best indicator the downfall ha started ? I am aiming on fall 19 also but so are many others. Which means it probably won't happen then.

>>10360832
Moving the coalpoasts

Mine was about *personal* savings rates (near nil) and interest payments, not corporates

>>10360809
& when reality sunk in, that position must've gained like a bunda at the plastic surgeon, no?

>>10360815
>Which you don't know about either

That's why I'm asking nigger. Beside, the ETFs do what they're supposed to do. The fuck do I care what they're made up of

>>10360871
>The fuck do I care what they're made up of
That's what I brought in sausages for...

>>10360831
>keynesiam
Literally the most retarded school of economics. Keynes himself said ‘in the long run we are all dead’. It was literally a short term economic plan to save the US during the Great Depression. Keynesiam fucks you in the long run.>>10360852

>>10360837
I'm not going to short in the immediate future. I don't think it's going to happen within a calender year... but it is going to happen, & I'm determined not to be left on the sideline

Just sell and don't worry about it. Invest in some shitty bonds until the drumpftardations over.

This is what I've done, it's just not worth the stress.

>>10360894
Indeed.

>>10360852
>Mine was about *personal* savings rates (near nil) and interest payments, not corporates
Yeah and if you look at the original point that I made it was that debt is lower now than it was then, which is proven by pic related.

>>10360764
>Meme stock and meme coin.

>>10359592
Fucking A+ shop. Made me chuckle and i hate the guy

>>10360832
you're graph makes the current trend look like 2008. You're also proposing something thats never happened before and barely backing up your opinions. honestly get fucked.

>>10360609
You have to be a literal brainlet to short the market through ETF’s. You should short certain stocks directly and sell calls / buy puts.

>>10361272
That implies contracts purchasing, which must come true on a certain date, no?

>>10360764
Wow. the fact you actually think you have even made one correct investment here is astounding. Every single one of your stocks has astoundingly high P/E ratios and two have never turned a profit. Also your decision to invest in chainlikk as a hedge against fiat is more retarded that going all in NANO.

You are extremely stupid and anybody thinking this is a good idea should neck themselves immediately.

Monster+democrat psyop.

Fuck 4chan, wheres the autists going now? Count me in.

>>10361309
On the options? Yes. But you can buy long term puts and sell long term calls and in theory spend no money even opening the position. Long term options have much lower theta and will still amplify returns much greater than just buying an etf/ shorting stock.

>>10361309
>>10361356
Also, not sure how much you know about options but you can sell the contract at anytime.

>>10361309
I'm not sure which part of "selling calls" and "buying puts" was unclear but yes they have an exercise date.

>>10359652
tarrifs make walmet chines stuff more so drumpf voter mad

>>10360242
inb4 the central banks inflate the remaining shekels so the goy can continue to work for insect burgers and soup

>>10361356
You (((in theory))) spend no money because it's on margin or nah?

If I felt fully comfortable rolling with long-term options or any futures I'd do it. Are the returns that much more if you guess right?

>>10361386
Can the exercise date be rolled over into the future?

>>10359592

the funny part is that the orange retard seems to notice that his bullshit might not lead to the desired outcome. so what does he do? blame the fed. and all his inbred followers will think the fed ruined their favorite presidents hard work.

>>10361438
No. You in theory spend no money to open the position because you are SELLING calls and BUYING puts with the money.

>>10361438
Buying puts isn't a margin deal.
Selling calls is if you don't have the underlying in your portfolio.

Returns may be high, but bear in mind that especially when selling call options, the maximum possible loss is infinitely large.

>>10361453
>Defending the FED

>>10361462
except broker fees, and the amount to back the margin loan

>>10361471
>Returns may be high, but bear in mind that especially when selling call options, the maximum possible loss is infinitely large

& that's why I like my Bear ETFs, but that other anon is shaming me out of them

Tariffs are communism. If you support tariffs you're a repulsive commie and havo to get the fuck out of my business board

>>10361453
>The Fed are good bois. Dey dindu nuffin wrong

The absolute state of le drumphers

>>10361506
>I support doing nothing about Chinese & EU tariffs

30 year old The Economist reading Boomer detected

>>10361476
>>10361511

didnt say that
it just rustles my jimmies when stupid burgers cant see obvious shit. orange man knows that he cant weaken the dollar mid to long term with retarded tweets. so why does he pull this fed criticism shit off? i can only think of him taking measures in case his policy fails.

>>10360764
gentrification / urbanization is real estate pump/dump cycle
you are buying high bro
enjoy goldberg sending niggers on your street then buying your house for a 10% of price
then rooting niggers out again

>>10361248
>you're graph makes the current trend look like 2008.
The graph shows the amount of debt that companies take on in relation to earnings. Again, my point is that we're far less leveraged now, than then. The trend would lead us back to 2010 levels of leverage if anything, maybe you should understand the chart you're looking at before posting.

> You're also proposing something thats never happened before and barely backing up your opinions

I'm not proposing anything, and you haven't backed up any of your opinions

Literally the day after Trump is re-elected, just to ram the point home