/biz/ - Business & Finance

Are you the NY Post author? KEK.

>>10158157

Why do you think BTC dev team limited smart contracts as early as possible? Because it was a flaw and they foresaw this.

>>10158179
Google Root Stock. BTC smart contracts.

>>10158197
Blockchain is at best like tcp/ip in the 80s.

A solution an infustruture being made by people for somome else tomfigure out how to use it later. It will take decades to fix the oracle problem. No popular blockchain cares as its too hard. They just want to make the platform and let someone else do the hard part.

Link doesnt fix the oracle issue either before some faggot comes in with it.

>>10158149
Roger Ver, Jihan Wu, Calvin Ayre, The 8btc mod (19hZx234vNtLazfx5J2bxHsiWEmeYE8a7k), Jiang Zhouer, the bitcoin.com cofounder, the Coinbase founder - all BILLIONAIRES who can complete the flippening with their own cash TODAY.
They're not doing so because they'd rather invest in BCH adoption. BCH adoption is skyrocketing while btc adoption is dropping.
In a few years both St Kitts and Antigua will use BCH as their main currency (Roger is working on St Kitts, Calvin is investing in Antigua more money than their GDP exclusively because of BCH adoption), Craig Wright will increase transaction counts by circumventing corrupt governments in Africa for money transfers (this one is not certain but very possible considering his funding), Roger is speaking to VIP-s every other day, including Japanese bank CEO-s, stock exchange owners, etc. Brian Armstrong will push BCH and shit on BTC subtly every chance he gets, bitcoin.com wallet is the most popular mobile wallet and it literally shits on BTC, propaganda/censorship effects are fading, Purse just added BCH meaning that normies can use it to get 20% discounts on amazon, Koreans love BCH and they seem to matter at least as much as Americans and significantly more than eurofags, miners are looking for ways to destroy BTC in the next few years otherwise their profits will crumble, LN is proving more and more of a failure every single day, Wright will patent-troll startups into moving into BCH, tipping on github is now possible with bch, smart contracts are coming in November, stress tests are a massive success, charities are popularizing BCH in struggling countries (Venezuela today, others will join in if trouble arises), Free Society project is progressing well, Circle is adding BCH next few weeks, Ayre who became a billionaire from gambling is going to create BCH-only online casinos

>>10158149
> I spent the last 2 years learning everything about blockchain and smart contract technology. Then the market.
> Conclusion is that eth and btc had no reason to rise last year.
You're retarded.

>>10158351

It was speculation driven. The buzz of smart contracts and tps. On a bigger picture these things are worthless unless the off chain data problem is sloved. Vitalik igores discussing it because he knows its a goliath unsokvable step to adoption. He ignores the issue.

Now blockchain and smart contract buzz is dying. Billions are being spent trying to understand it. When normies and traditional investors finally realise the dead end of smart contracts, off chain data, it will die.

>>10158351
elaborate
the rise was orchestrated by fraudulent market-makers and exchanges along with south koreans buying shitcoin after shitcoin because they saw only one direction, upwards
this joke of a market is highly illiquid, don't need a lot of money to pump big

>>10158384
>The buzz of smart contracts and tps.
nah, the driving buzz initially was only the fact that you could buy some shit with two clicks and doubled and 10x your money a week later

>>10158384
stinky
>>10158385
shillin is only thing that matters
everywhere

>>10158385

Tether went from 25m to 2.5b in the punp. Lol. Its gonna reach 250b market cap when btc reaches 100k? Lmao

>>10158409

Link doesnt solve it. Get it in your heads. Its so impractical.

There is no solution without centrilization to an authority?, making smart contracts useless.

>>10158415
pls try to form a coherent sentence and try to make some sense

>>10158429
>oracles

>>10158149
LN is still beta tech and its going to continue to improve. Eth was always a scam token factory and anyone that cant see that is a literal retard.

>>10158149
>spent the last 2 years learning everything about blockchain
>still hasn't figured out what gives BTC value
i'm 130 iQ and i figured it out within a week. the thought of brainlets thinking BTC price rises magicaly or randomly is hilarious though. you should just give up and become a fucking janitor. and in 5 years when you see BTC's price at $500k you'll be thinking 'damn, BTC price randomly rising again, people who bought it are just gamblers and got lucky'. maybe you'll even blame the jews, who knows. must be depressing not being able to figure out why things really happen most of the time

>>10158149
2 years of extensive research

He thinks ETH can scale

He doesn’t know about the ADA google partnership

>>10158445

Jfc, how bad is your reading comprehension. I said that tether marketcap went from 25 million to 2.5 billion just so btc could go from 600 dollars to 20k.

So if we see 100k btc, i guess we also expect to see tether at a marketcap of over 250billion for similar proportions of change.

Lmao as if. Market is fake as fuck and blockchain is useless

>>10158460

Oracles dont solve it without centrilization. And they add a stupid number of layers to the network maning emergency situaions break the contract due to time fuctionality of financial contract binding.

Even vitalik acknowledges this

>>10158495
Here is the problem. BTC price wont rise like that anymore. 2017 was it. Next generation cryptos are going to take over. Dapps are going to take over.

>>10158495


Insaid xmr and btc are the only things worth holding manipulation or not. Everything else is fucked and doesnt solve the off chain data bottle neck.

>>10158511
>writes like a 13yr old hoodnigger
>how bad is your reading comprehension, lmao
at least you can if you try, good job anon, don't give up
where did i say anything about tether? so i'm not sure why you are adressing me, maybe my bad reading comprehension again, who knows
apart from that, tether is a moneylaundering-scheme first

>>10158511
tether just increases btc volume. It makes it easier to dump in fact. This tether pump talk is autistic

>>10158531
>he thinks usless dapps like crypto kitties will fuel the rise.

Wake up, gambling and intrisically mathematical daaps are the only things possible. Smart contracts break with real world information. And to solve that centrilization to an authory is necessary. Which beggs the question of why use a daap with blockchain?

This space isnt short of imagination but realise that since 2013 we have been debating off chain data and made absolutely 0 progress even in theory side. Its just been shoved under the rug. Nothing will materialize till we figure it out. And we wont.

>>10158495
>maybe you'll even blame the jew
>antisemitism is racism for the smart man

No doubt your IQ is actually a 130.

>>10158559

Im typing on my phone bitch. Stay indoors on your neet pc and ad hominem me instead lf adressing my arguments though.

>>10158278
25 cents has been deposited.

>>10158149

Smart contracts, and ETH itself, are absolutely worthless. BTC isn’t, and the fundamentals that protect btc are as strong as ever. The smart contract meme and ICOs was the bubble, real growth was meant to be a 10x around the price at halevning as expected. BTC should be 30k around 2021. ETH will be single digits.

>>10158511

>2 years of research
>acknowledges ChainLink in his post
>says off chain data problem isn't solvable without centralisation
>whole purpose of entire ChainLink project is decentralised oracles providing off chain data to smart contracts

Seriously are you a literal Fucking brainlet?

>>10158584
>continues to behave like a 13yr old hoodnigger
where did i contradict you?
anything apart from btc and xmr is useless by now and 99% will remain useless
it's pinksheets all over again, but this time you can't even sue someone because you just donated your money willingly in exchange for funnytokens
one can make mad profit from pinksheets, does'nt change the fact that they are mostly garbage

>>10158597

Chainlink cant achieve it. Decentralisation of oracles reporting on real world events as an absolute truth is literally a paradox. A philosophical idea.

>>10158595

Agree. Btc and xmr are the only things worth it. Its hilarious watching all these alts pop up with platforms waiting for an impossible solution to bridge them to the real world.

Currency coins are the only use for blockchain. Smart contracts are useless.

>>10158149
Crypto is fine. If it feels really hard to do you should do it more. It's like medicine.

>Conclusion is that eth and btc had no reason to rise last year.
Sounds correct to me, the whole market got extremely overhyped in big part thanks to ICOs. I don't know how many ICOs we'll even remember in some years.

> The fundamental problems which mean smart contracts can never work wont be fixable.
Perfect smart contracts on everything is never happening, we'll probably find more decent things to do with the ones that are possible. But sure, smart contracts may have spent too much time on the spotlight lately for no good reason and currently we're using them for shit.

> It was all manipulated upwards
Most markets most of the time. I know but regulations and dividends and wash trading and shit. No. It's the exact same thing, only the cheats change, this is why people who have spent a lot of time on other markets come here and fall for the new paradigm and don't react until they realize they have devastating losses.

> BTC, XMR, and Ethereum
> Alts are literally for retards who dont understand blockchain well.
I mean, you can play this in a lot of different ways, you can decide how much time to spend doing what and the risk you're comfortable with. But like I said, the harder it is to do, the better it actually is.

>>10158157
Worst article ever. Literally nothing was used to back it up. Fuck that dude to death

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.coindesk.com/three-smart-contract-misconceptions/amp/

This is ancient but still extremely relevant. Smart contracts are fucked

>>10158266
What exactly is the Oracle problem?

>>10158627
>oracles can't break the uncertainty principle, therefore we can't use them.
Bottom jej

>>10158149
>Jew Monies are literally for retards who dont understand blockchain well.

OP there's no point in trying to convince /biz/. It's full of cultists and desperate bagholders that MUST believe in cryptos no matter what because their money is stuck there.

>>10159446
Not the point. There's just no special reward for figuring out applications where crypto has no purpose.

>>10159446
Yet you'll believe a guys word wholly who claims in the first sentence of his post that he knows everything about the market and crypto. Kek. I'm sorry but none of you can see the future so shut the fuck up and stop acting like you have all the answers.

>>10158627
Explain why and how would that be a paradox?

>>10158149
there was a reason of course why the price rose: more people wanted the coins
similar reason for the price dropping: less people wanting the coins

other than that I am a bit like you. When I was first into crypto I literally read everything, educated myself, watched tutorials on how to get shit done, what a Blockchain is, how it could change the world (lol so far), read endlessly about every project in the fucking top 200, waited patiently for good entry points. my sad conclusion is however, nothing of that matters, because it is 90% manipulation and 10% hype. it just doesn't fucking matter how good a project is or how solid teams works. it is pumped when there is some hype and then left for dead for months. none of the fundamentals matter so far and until anything gets adopted it won't change anyway.

At this point it is literally just gambling and/or waiting and holding. it can go to 3k within a month, or also 12k. nobody knows, nothing would resemble any indication like there was in april 2017 and december 2017.

Really, all you can do is: throw in some money, like 20k if you have 30-40k and do nothing, while slowly DCA down to whatever point you feel like crypto would be dead anyway, maybe buyin every -20% with 1k. wait 12 months, see what happens. Chance are we see some big increases, but it can also be dead for the next 3 years.

You mean BTC, XMR and XLM

>>10159545
>I'm sorry but none of you can see the future
But I can see that crypto is vaporware, so no matter how many bubbles it'll have it's bound to have a final pop and dissipate into nothingness. Literally a ponzi.

OP is right. Bunch of idiots who don’t know a single concept in computer science are wrong but pretend to think that OP is a brainlet. How surprising.

>>10158266
>an infustruture being made by people for somome else tomfigure

nigger what

>>10158149
Yep. It’s all bullshit. I don’t care about any of this I just hope to make $$ then gtfo

pity reply

>>10158149

Ark solves the smart contract bottleneck you dumb fucking imbecile. And thats just one of the many solutions. Were all going to make it. Especially after 22' total financial market collapse.

>>10159624

Just like the entire financial system, which all signs point to that it is dying.

>>10159813
says the average tinfoiltard since 60 years

>>10158627
>We need absolute truth for smart contracts
We don't even need that for regular contracts. No one cares about proving the philosophical definition of truth to a computer, just good enough for the parties involved.

>>10159851

>2009 massive crash. Debt rose even more since then.
>Interest is at an all time low. They cant raise it back. Interest is like the pulse of a patient and he is about to flatline.
>global unrest and mass migration
>China sitting on massive housing bubble
>Demographics in rich countries + China fucked, pension pyramid scheme is faltering.

Myeah I think I'll go long on them Bitcoins.

>>10159186
>boils down to no outside data
who fucking cares? there are a million applications regardless

christ i hate you faggots
>discover some principle
>suddenly parading it around like a 12 year old who just discovered his penis

this place is full of morons

>>10158149
You sound like you know jack shit.

Looks like we're firmly in the anger/capitulation phase. Nice.

>>10159675
You do not seem to know jack shit about it either. Crypt I currencies are useful as a re smart contracts in combination with tokinasation of securities and property. It cuts out a bunch or middleman. Block chain is also great for stuff like tax fraud, car history, everything that can be tempered with. It only needs a block chain to run it on which is decentralized so it can not be tempered with.

The potential for tokens, cryptocurrencies, smart contracts and block chain platforms are huge. To many people are just to fucking shortsighted on the price to actually see that.

>>10159966
>expects total crisis
>somehow thinks people will pour their last money into ponzicoins

listen retard, boom-bust-cycle is fairly normal, only tinfoilheads and children are scared of the total bust
i'll tell you a secret:
capitalism is a chainletter
next target is africa
game will go on for another century

>>10159186
thanks for the read

>>10159966
>Thinks the world is about to be engulfed in the biggest financial crisis ever
>Bets on Bitcoin
The sad part is even if you're memeing some people actually believe this

>>10158149
Get fucked pleb

>>10160713

ok smarty pants how does the data for those smart contracts get into them smart contract to help trigger or clause them?

crypto space is not short of imagination at all. but its short of practical reality. smart contracts are useless. they cannot be created due to getting off chain data into them. the only way to do it literally makes smart contracts pointless.

>>10158149
You're right but everyone in here is going to disagree because they're retarded.

1) Smart contracts is a meme. You will always need a third party. Chainlink is fucking dumb. If you can't understand that then you're stupid. Code is law is a meme. There are going to be so many problems with this.

2) All alts are bullshit. BTC is the only one that matters and is proven. I have alts but wish I sold them all in January. They will NEVER overtake BTC.

3) dApps is a meme.
https://www.stateofthedapps.com/rankings
3,000 DAU for IDEX. It's literally you biz,reddit,twitter fags pumping and dumping on eachother lmao.

4) DEXs are a meme. See above. Nobody cares and will continue to use centralized exchanges like Binance and Coinbase.

5) The early adoption is a meme. We're all late. The only use for crypto currencies is as a store of value (BTC achieves this), cross border payments (XRP achieves this), or payment. So far, nobody uses crypto for payments because they don't actually need to.

6) Anyone who thinks internet tokens that get pumped and dumped that can literally never hold their positions are going to overthrow banks and governments are so fucking stupid. Go outside. Trillion dollar industries with the best minds of the world will not let your internet funny money take over lmfao.

The only thing that will save our bags is actual institutions building more trading desks and ETFs. Even though crypto is useless, atleast we can have gateways for normies to gamble on this bs. Hopefully by then we'll all sell our bags and live our lives a little better.

>>10158149
DELETE THIS. You're ruining the scam goyim!

>>10162002
Why do people keep calling me stupid if I say BTC and XRP are the big players mmm smart guy?

>>10162058
Im not going to read this thread to find your post but you're correct. If they call you stupid it's because they are bagholding alts that they hope will moon. They feel confident because they watched a few YouTube videos that their alt will overtake BTC one day. Most of these people have no tech experience and don't realize how insignificant this all is in the real world.

>>10158495
What is the velocity of money. BTC can't be $500,000 without replacing the pound.

>>10158266
none of this shit made much sense

>>10158584
Yeah boomer
*sip*

>>10162087
>Im not going to read this thread to find your post

Don't worry I was just shitposting about jews.

>If they call you stupid it's because they are bagholding alts that they hope will moon. They feel confident because they watched a few YouTube videos that their alt will overtake BTC one day. Most of these people have no tech experience and don't realize how insignificant this all is in the real world.

Interesting, I suspect you are right.

>>10162121

I posted on phone. If you aren't tech minded then it wont make sense to you.

TCP/IP is the internet infrastructure. its ancient and shit. When it was created by a group of super autists they had no idea how to transform it into something useful. luckily for them, this became possible and the internet as we know it today is here and masses of wealth was generated.

The problem with smart contracts and any crypto other than BTC, XMR, or XRP, is that although the super autists are working on this infrastructure, they are waiting for someone else to bridge it to the world and make it useful. which is impossible sadly for crypto unlike the early internet. Bringing off chain data into smart contracts is a chain that cannot be forged into the eco system to make them truly turing complete, and make smart contracts truly smart. Its a meme.
Thats why no daaps exist other than eth pyramids and a DEX or two. smart contracts as they are can only work in their own eco system. like a computer without the internet. computers without the internet are marginally useful. electronic book keeping. save some costs wow. big deal. same with smart contracts as they are.

not till the computer gets online is e-commerce possible and trillions of dollars opportunities real and possible instantly.
right now smart contracts cannot be connected to off chain data. and wont be. because to do so requires centralized point of authority. which means smart contracts are pointless.

>>10162002

great post, exactly my thoughts. i will continue to invest in BTC as it crashes down to 3k, along with XMR and XRP for my moon shot. nothing else is worth it. all memes.

>>10162280
womp womp

>>10159186
>https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.coindesk.com/three-smart-contract-misconceptions/amp/
Good read so far. But hes wrong about smart bonds. The capital inside may be "worthless" but the bond itself can be traded and hold value.

do people really not understand whos behind bitcoin and why its going to be the world currency? are you guys all fucking retarded?

>>10162280
>is a chain that cannot be forged into the eco system to make them truly turing complete
wow, you are stupid
turing completeness has nothing to do with off-chain data

>>10162480
Data confidentiality problem can be solved with PGP encryption
>>10162507
I don't. Theres a documentary I have to watch on Youtube that might explain it. Wwere you going to talk about the energy arms race?

>>10158149
>The fundamental problems which mean smart contracts can never work wont be fixable.

Oh really?

>>10162513

what you mean is, it doesn't need to be turing complete with off chain data. which i agree with. it doesn't it'd be nice but i will concede there.

issue still stands. third parties cannot be eliminated. decentralization impossible. smart contracts pointless.

>>10162554
>issue still stands. third parties cannot be eliminated. decentralization impossible. smart contracts pointless.
so what? there are countless applications without those things, even if what you're saying is true

and there are engineering solutions even if there aren't ideologically perfect solutions

christ

I keep selling 1 hour before the pump and hold months through the dump. Of course I am tired.

>>10158567
The data authority problem scales back before crypto.
If you look at the way dividend paying shares have to be audited by a 3rd party outside accounting firm.
I don't see any reason a firm like Deloitte wouldn't position themselves as a global oracle for dAPPS

>>10162565

>buys luxury bag
>smart contract initiated
>bag arrives, some third part has to upload through oracle. only one courier has the information. (unless we make that public to everyone which why would DHL want this?).
>Smart contract releases funds
>looks like bag is fake
>who decides if its real or not? how many people do i have to contact to get this authenticated to the network of oracles? who uploads this? easier for just one central point to do it
>smart contract clause triggered, funds put back in
>shit show continues

Tell me why someone would go through all that when tehy can just buy from ebay or a marketplace and have the central market place company dispute it all for them with no hassle or stress?

even if they make it all back end, like i said, its going to be centralized information uploading.

>>10162648
>entire post is one giant strawman
wow so smart
meanwhile reread my post you fucking nigger
>so what? there are countless applications without those things, even if what you're saying is true

beyond sick of crypto, today was like death. just when there was some hope of something good, niggers and bobos have their way. im sick of it im sick of everyday down im sick of roger ver and billionaire chinks and rich niggers on tv. I hate them all. so sick of it

>>10162653

name me these applications. if you are saying a degree of centralization is necessary, then you are essentially agreeing with my entire posts argument.

>>10158149
https://explorer.dcrdata.org/tx/c199bc1278d227dc611674596da17c2a6404a80ac3a6b955440142d782a87f98

>>10162674
holy fuck im saying there are applications even presuming you are right--I am not even debating your FUCKING point you ignoramus

obvious examples: dead man switch for sensitive data, provably fair and transparent international online gambling

but a shit ton of maybe less impressive things (to you) come to mind--bitbay style double escrow, robust and essentially immutable storage, etc.

>>10162713

well.. yeah. i didnt debate that either. Smart contracts don't struggle with inherently mathematical data. thats the point. the second you through any real life variable in thats when it gets fucked up.

A few financial functions will be the best it can handle. the scope is much smaller than people believe. the off chain data issue cant be fixed properly. so even then, the traditional means prevail.

in the even of online gambling, that will require information form some API to upload, relying on the exact same central authority we do today for it. so i ask, why use a smart contract for it?

>>10162745
>in the even of online gambling, that will require information form some API to upload, relying on the exact same central authority we do today for it. so i ask, why use a smart contract for it?
you can do this in a completely decentralized manner and it's trivial to do so, also you gain things such as the "casino" doesn't take possession of your funds, an escrow contract does, and the results are transparent for all to see on the blockchain. Super easy and straightforward. Funfair is taking this exact approach. You might have more arguments to make but don't split hairs and try to see my point here

Dead man switch, that is huge. Julian Assange can whip up a contract to basically guarantee his life with just a little bit of technical know how and $5 for transaction fees. It's that simple

>>10162785

This is true, especially when we deal with binary data like results of betting, or currency conversion rates. though i don't personally believe a decentralized solution exists still, and if you do, you have no choice not to be holding huge bags of chain link and any other oracle coin. Personally, i would not buy them as i don't believe its solvable in a practical way.

any other variables, like if the tokenized car used for collateral in a loan is destroyed or damaged to a degree. the complexities of deciding to what degree its voided and the value changed, etc. this non mathematical and unbinary data is what will eliminate 99% of the ideas for smart contracts.

>>10162821
you are on a soap box and continuing to sperg on about something that I am not directly contesting

maybe you're right but who cares? there are many important applications for smart contracts that don't involve trying to bridge the gap between a shipment of rotten oranges and code

but even that has engineering solutions as I said--see also EOS

>>10158149
Sorry my friend but if you don't see the utility of crypto and smart contracts, you are a brainlet.

Sure they have problems, but they still have immense utility.

Also the scalability problems of crypto will one day be solved for sure. Lots of progress already on it.

>>10162843
A central database will always be faster, nerd.

>>10159882
People care about
>Looks like you owe 20,000.55 on your smart contract mortgage this month
>B-but my mortgage is 2,000.06!!! Your data entry guy added an extra zero!
>I'm sorry but there's really nothing we can do, lol

>>10163400
That's not really going to happen.
Someone doesn't 'type up' your mortgage every month.
If you're dumb enough to agree to a 20k payment, that's your bad.

>>10158581
antizionism is the preferred term, zionism is an ideology and not something someone is born into. this is the most common divide and conquer tactic in the book, get with the times plz

>>10158149
youre an idiot. thanks for selling me your bags.

>>10158149
How do you get that shattered glass effect for your wojak?

>>10158149
I agree with you. Hate you're late to the party.

OP is right, we should FUD as much as possible so that i can buy low.
But stop the FUD as soon as i buy, ok.

>>10158149
That being said, is there any way to seriously discuss betting on things other than crypto.

Betting on sports for example...

I tried to start a /betting/ thread on /sp/ but no one seemed interested.

>>10163400
Wtf? No that's not how it would work. Your guy would type up the contract, then I would read it and see there's a typo.