/biz/ - Business & Finance

sweet fud bro

All that energy could have been used to grow food for starving Africans. Mining Bitcoin is morally wrong.

>>10077857
They will be financially

That's why you support better options

>>10077857
>malls use more energy than amazon
>therefore malls should be illegal

>TV and Video games use more energy than going outside
>Therefore TV and Video games should be illegal

>banks use more energy than bitcoin
>therefore banks should be illegal

>>10077857
coulda used all that electricity and money on important things like sex change operations and medical equipment for transgenders and reeducating racist misogynistic xenophobic transphobes
vote democrat

>>10077857
>some amount of energy is used to make Tomigotchis
>because people value them, despite their pointlessness
>therefor people who exchange raw material value into monetary value should be executed
>valuing things and experiences not on the "necessary" list brands you as a traitor to humanity

good going moron, you invented the values of the people's party of china.

>>10077877

Fuck off nigger lover.

>>10077927
So instead of your money being used to feed starving children (who's last thought is to immigrate to your country) you'd rather put it in the pockets of insectoid chink criminals. Gotcha.

>>10077903

Fucking this. Small minded brainlets like >>10077877 only care about the upfront costs and don't take into consideration how this will benefit society in the long term.

>>10077857
energy is eternal. once created, it can not be destroyed

>>10077857
and when it's unsustainable there will be a solution for the normies to flock to.

>>10077993
>once created

Imagine trying to sound smart and failing abysmally. Energy can't be created you dumbfuck mouth breather.

Looking forward to being able to buy a 1080 ti for a reasonable price again

>>10077974

Yes got a problem with that faggot go back to whatever shithole commie faggot country you came from niggerboy. think of all the people that have a job because bitcoin mining is a thing think of the economic benefit of bitcoin mining. And you'd rather give all that up to feed some social dead weights.

>>10078009

E=MC2 faggot.

the net energy of the universe can't increase but you can convert mass to energy. Albeit at a terrible inefficent rate.

>>10077857
reminder that farm generates more money in one hour then you do working for a full year

>>10077857
Far more electricity, fresh water and other valuable resources are wasted mining a worthless shiny gold rock out of the ground but no one seems to give a shit about that. At least bitcoin mining doesnt destabilize entire third world regions at the behest of giant mining behemoths who make deals with the governments to exploit the locals for cheap labor and destroy their natural habitat

>>10078089

YET

>>10078032
"""jobs""" that do nothing but waste energy. Literally bullshit jobs created out of nothing to monitor energy being wasted on 1's and 0's that then get sold to retards like you who lose money anyway.

>>10077891
>>10077903
>>10077914
>>10077927
you all have autism

>>10077857
they (((pay))) for it, kek

>>10077857
Bitcoin just like the universe will eventually find it's inevitable heat death. It mathematically can not survive.
if you were to continue the process of mining forever you require Infinite hashing power to defeat the infinite difficulty at the cost of infinite electricity. For this function to remain bitcoin must remain at infinite value but that is litteraly impossible with a set cap of coins. Because the only value miners will receive is from TX which is dependent to the number of transactions done.

>>10078113

Yep Unapologetically Autistic.

>>10078142

KYS brainlet you don't know jack shit about how bitcoin works and your talking out your ass like a fag

>>10078158
Fuck off faggot.
This is exactly what is happening.

>>10077983
>africa
>society

>>10078166

Educate yourself faggot

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEL-y_APu64

Bitcoin mining uses a difficulty retargeting to ensure blocks are produced at a consistant 10 Minute rate this difficulty will effect how much GPU power can be thrown at the blockchain before it becomes unprofitable to mine. The price of bitcoin will almost never go lower than the cost to produce it and if it does then miners will start moving to other coins to mine with a lower difficulty.

>>10078000
But anon, ETH is unsustainable. It can't even handle a cat game.

>>10077857
DPoS is the future. Coins like Ethereum and Tezos are the new frontier of crypto

>>10077983
>how this will benefit society in the long term

Get real, man. Crypto will only benefit speculators.

We need to help the subhuman race. Financial help isn't enough, we need to go down there and build up there country,
accept their culture and religion, raise their lovely babies, even build up a political system for them, because it is unfair right now (obviously prefered democracy).

Therefore we need to STOP wasting our own ressources. Fuck Bitcoin, fuck the energy waste! Share our wealth with everyone, we are equal and need to distribute everything equally.

>>10078272

You do that you nigger loving commie. go learn your fucking lesson.

>>10078352
Why don't you agree with it? How can you wake up every morning and look at yourself in the mirror?

ha ha no

no one is forcing anyone to mine

>>10077927
Boomers need to chill holy heck I know you guys love Hillary but you ain't Gotta be this racist

>>10077857
is that bitmain?

This shit is why iota is the future. A raspberry pi can do more than 5 tx/s using 5 watts. A solar panel is enough to power that. Wasting so much electricity without producing physical products or improving the human condition is needlessly burning our resources. bitcoin will die the moment quantum computers can find a private key from the public address, which any 256 qbit computer can. Get out while you can

>>10077857
>>10077877
Kill yourselves, bugman cuckolds.

>>10078473

>>10078473
my sources:
https://twitter.com/green_protocol/status/1012267490083201024
https://twitter.com/green_protocol/status/1011552970914217985

>wasting energy for muh speculative internet money
>>hurr durr you are small minded

anyway, this thread made me think: what would happen if there were no miners right now? btc and all shitcoins would have almost no monetary value, right?

>>10078594
literally no value because blockchain requires miners for transaction to occur

I'm thinking of creating a PoS Bitcoin yes that will be good

>>10078473

1. IOTA gives up consistency guarantees with its approach, see the partition of a few days ago. There are no free lunches in distributed systems.

2. 256 logical qbits, which at requirements of 10,000 physical qbits per logical error-corrected qbit means 256,000 physical qbits. Good luck building that.

basically you are an idiotic parrot who doesn't know what they're talking about along multiple axes.

>>10078630
>256,000 physical qbits
just run the program 10,000 times like they do on IBM's public 5 qbit computer

but tell me more about the consistency thing as I don't understand the language. I've only been in crypto for a few months

>>10078594
Why wouldn’t there be miners when PoW incentivizes them to keep GPUs/ASICs on, you braindead commie faggot? As for "have almost no monetary value", do you even know what a market is? You can’t talk out of your ass here that crypto is worthless, when there is a 200B digital asset class that proves your snarky comments wrong.

>>10078647

> run the program 10,000 times

IBM runs their computer thousands of times because their error rate is so high - it's just five physical qbits. This approach doesn't scale up to 256 qbits. To a first approximation, you have to run the program an order of magnitude more times for each additional bit of information you want to extract from the output, so 10^256. This number is substantially larger than the number of particles in the universe.

If you want to get into distributed systems then the best thing to do is to learn the paxos consensus protocol. Once you understand the problems it is designed to solve, you will be well on your way to learning distributed systems: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEpsBg0AO6o

>>10077857
that looks equivalent to, what, 0.9 Ant Miners?

>>10077857
Reminder that the PoW coins are the only true crypto, everything else is a security or a derivative of a security.
Watch the newfag cope!

>>10077993
Lol energy is not created u moron, it surrounds us as we transform it from coal to heat i.e. read about entropy, thats what uve meant cunt

>>10078669
what was the partition of a few days ago?

and I was wrong, you need 2^128 qubit operations to break sha-256 with modern algorithms
source: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Quantum_computing_and_Bitcoin

seems insane when you realize bitcoin itself is nothing more than a store of value and used for transactions
enormous amounts of electricity all going to sustain a network that isn't even used for anything but hoarding value...

seems a bit crazy to me

>>10077857
Do you have any comprehension of how much energy the VISA credit network wastes?

>>10077993
HAVE YOU EVERY HEARD THE TERM "ENTROPY" YOU STUPID IGNORANT FUCK.

>>10078928
EVER*
HOLY SHIT
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

>there are dafties here who unironically dont think this is a problem
Its a complete waste of time! Just use proof of stake or something else. Mining is just a decision making process, its fucking rediculous

>>10078686
>>10078909
this. and

i unironically believe that there is a small chance that bitcoin mining forces the human species to elevate into a type 1 kardashev scale civilization because it's the only reason that makes sense for us to even bother with capturing all of sun's energy that hits earth.

Taking the power away from kiles is worth it. I don't care if we have to build new nuclear power plants for it. Scarcity of electricity is anyway a meme created by retards who actually believe the world should be able to run on solar panels and wind turbines alone.

>>10077877
We should feed those starving africanis so they can mine bitcoin manually with their hands :)

>>10078941
>Mining is just a decision making process

>>10078915
Visa has 24000tps and its cheaper than running btc network with 7tps

>>10078108

>spending energy on video games, movies, pornography, etc. is fine
>bitcoin is tantamount to murfering children

If you’re gonna establish this dichotomy and say that we shouldn’t let a free market decide, then we should all switch ASAP to eating the cheapest and simplest food, get rid of all luxuries and maximise feeding starving children. Who are you to decide that killing a bunch of kids to make a bunch of dumb capeshit films is more morally justifiable than doing so to mine bitcoins?

>>10078941
just shift proof of work to those making the transactions, then use consensus for confirmation

>>10078941
>rediculous

>>10077857
gpus will be more efficient.

>>10079001
It does for now, idiot

>Filing cabinets store more text than these "computer" gadgets, they will fail

>our failed politics and the sun's hyperactivity are melting our poles, what do?
>yikes, who is the new guy we can blame?
>I heard bitcoin mining wastes some energy
>how much?
>no idea
>what does it do?
>no idea
>doesn't matter anyway, bitcoin it is then

>>10079230
>how much
More energy than the entire country of Ireland.

>>10079272
You know the oil companies are hiding ways to make energy more efficient/free. blame them. Energy is abundant we just use archaic ways to tap into it.

>>10079272
That's what they want you to think

>>10079106
>revolutionary technology
>3.5k times slower than 60year old technology
>IT'S GONNA GET BETTER LATER I PROMISE

>>10079344
>60 year old technology is only 3.5k times faster than branch new technology
nocoiner cope

>>10079370
I have more coins than you ever will
I'm just not delusional about my investment

POS is the future

>>10079404
Reminder that the PoW coins are the only true crypto, everything else is a security or a derivative of a security.

>>10079404
>oligarchy is the future

>>10077877
You could've used your energy to grow food or otherwise feed or help starving people African or otherwise. There's likely a soup kitchen within a two mile radius of where you are.

>>10078067
If that's not a textbook definition of efficiency nothing is.

The energy spent is used to secure a decentralised currency. OP is a fucking retard.

>>10078009
>when you make for ppl, but a little clue about what you are talking about.
The laws of thermo dynamics do not have to be broken. Like all laws there is stipulation as to when it doe not apply....High frequency/High Voltage. This is not creating energy...it merely uses a different way of accessing the energy that already exists. energy can't be created or destroyed it can simply turn into another form of energy

Why don't socialists just kill themselves for the greater good?

>>10077857
If they are paying their electric bill, then whats your problem?

>>10077877
Yeah, those Africans could've eaten those. Damn waste of a good piece of machinery.

>>10077877
You know, i was a little ambivalent about the energy consumption of bitcoin, but now that i know mining is directly killing poor little african children, i really wanted to start a massive bitcoin farm.

I hate fucking niggers. The less aid they deserve the better.

>>10079982
thank god electricity just comes out of outlets huh

>>10080018
Yeah, its pretty amazing how a men can keep a complex modern world running smoothly day after day. Capitalism is great.

>>10080038
Bitcoin currently consumes approx 71.12 TWh per annum (https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-energy-consumption))
1000kg of coal contains approx 2.46 MWh of energy

This checks out at approx 29 million tonnes of coal to run the bitcoin network per year.
And that's assuming we could transform coal to electricity at a coefficient of 1:1

>>10080060
Thats a lot of economy stimulation.

>>10080060
I'm french so my electricity comes from nuclear, carbon-free.
Wait, you hippie pussies don't like nuclear too ?
Damn, i really want to please hippie pussies.
Their opinion about Reality is so consistent with Reality, going against them is a surefire way to fail.
I hope i hired enough black womyn, the more diversity, the more monies !

>>10080085
I'm sure france is powering all of china's mining operations

>>10080100
Whats it to you how Chinese is powering their grid?

>>10077857
Your a stupid piece of shit

It literally does not matter.
Do you know how much electricity is used in a paper mill? so much power in fact that they only build them near power plants.

It's 2018, we don't need paper any more! What a waste of trees and power yeesh!

Btc mining operations are good for residential consumers as the states/provinces/countries that offer power for mining give them an increasing rate- and what that means for you normal fucks is that the more power they use, the CHEAPER your electricity is at your Fucking home.

Jesus fucking Christ you guys are idiots, why the fuck do I even still come here. Your all poor as fuck and are grasping at strings to justify your stupidity.

Got something else bad to say about mining operations? Please share your concerns cause I'll just make you feel like an uneducated twat.

>>10080106
gee I wonder what I know about public information

>>10080114
Good for them. Hopefully as time goes on their citizens will demand better working conditions. Then cleaner plants for a better standard of living and stop treating their people as mindless drones. But lessons not learned in blood are soon forgot, they have to take their beatings like the rest of the 1st world did through the industrial revolution.

>>10080141
you actually believe they wouldn't just do that if they could? It's like you think uranium is just lying around on the floor

every is neither created nor destroyed

>>10077903
>oh and by "bitcoin" i mean bitcoin cash
how can you be so right and wrong at the same time?

>>10080152
Actually uranium is just lying around on the floor. Its called yellow cake.

>>10077857
Hopefully Elon builds solar and computer farms on mars and we can let nature recover again.

>>10080184
I mean if that's your definition of "just lying around", sure.

No such thing as a free lunch. Market demand will create the opportunity for someone to go gather the resources needed to supply it. Take your pick.

Mining gold uses ten times more energy and causes a lot more pollution to the immediate surroundings. Paper production uses more energy. Processing traditional accounting and finances probably wastes more energy too.

>>10080246
The issue is that there just isn't enough supply of uranium to supply the whole planet. There are just a handful of mines in the world while coal is literally everywhere.

I mean that's basically THE issue of nuclear energy (if you ignore the whole waste and meltdown issue, which to be fair the world has been perfectly capable of so far)

>>10080264
You appear to know nothing about nuclear energy as well as coal, China or capitalism. You must be a gender studies major in college.

Uranium is used because a byproduct of Uranium is weapons grade uranium. There are other elements that can be used for nuclear energy but no government will build the plants because they cant make weapons from them. Uranium power plants are very inefficient but noone cares because nukes.

>>10077877
lololololololololololol

>>10080303
I love how your solution to using an incredibly rare isotope of an incredibly rare element, is to use even rarer isotopes of even rarer elements.

Brilliant mate.

>>10080315
And now we add your ignorance of the periodic table to the list. Fucking hell you are stupid. Go back to school and get an education. I feel like im talking to a nigger straight out of Africa for as much as you know about the world outside your home village.

>>10080100
Didn't EDF just opened a nuclear plant in China actually ?

>>10080060
The yield of a modern thermal power plant is between 40 and 45%

>>10080162
I thought the same, lol.
bcash is no more than a pump and dump at this point.
Ver and Jihan wanted to make more money, and since they had a ton of BTC, they ended up with a ton of BCH. So they wanted to sell it for as much as possible so they started shilling it.
They even made deals with the korean exchanges to sell while the server was down that time, so nobody could cancel their orders.
Meanwhile lots of retards buying their bags keep also sucking Jihan's and Ver's dick.

>>10080658
>They even made deals with the korean exchanges to sell while the server was down that time
I would never guess that corecucks are this much into conspiracy theories.

>>10077877
wtf I love mining now

>>10077877
Literally all the world has given Africa money, but they waste it quickly because they can't produce more.

>>10077857

>>10077877
if bitcoin mining makes you so upset, why do you still throw your trash in the recycling bin?
oh right, because you bought at 19k
oops

>>10077857
>Miners investing Billions into mining bitcoins
>I-it's gonna crash to 0. It's gonna die out.
Okay bearfags

>>10077891
Banks actually should be illegal though.

>>10080085
They built those for cern, not you.

How much energy goes into running servers for thots to upload their selfies to?
Gas the normies first.

>>10077877
KYS liberal faggot. Everything on this planet, including you, is mine to conquer, kill, fuck, subjugate, enslave, consume or destroy as I see fit. If Africans want to eat, they can grow their own fucking food.

>>10077857
The energy Bitcoin uses would have otherwise disappeared into the aether. Mining companies are essentially arbitraging electricity by building mining facilities in areas where power is cheap and in oversupply. The cost of ATMs and server equipment for, say, interac, far outstrips Bitcoin. By a LONG SHOT.

>>10082086

What am I looking at here

>>10083302
The Ukraine.

>>10078089
>and destroy their natural habitat
>habitat
At least you got this right.

>>10077877
What's wrong is feeding these fucking Africans that are breeding like rabbits and putting a strain on the world. They are a regressive culture that mother nature was dealing with through drought and famine but then bloody dogooders like you start sending them your gains and now they out breed and out pollute all of us. Darwin is rolling in his grave at this propping up of inferior group to become the dominant one

>>10078909
that's because you're a normie and a jew sympathizer

>>10077877
You're retarded. Those niggers will keep breeding past capacity. They need to be culled.

>>10077857
All the useless people on this website combined use far more electricity. Maybe that leads to an unsettling conclusion based on your premise, but...

>>10077857
And most miners come from fucking Chinkland, place where no one gives a shit about environment or anything else except money.
Really makes you think.

>>10077857
>MINERS SHOULD BE EXECUTED
Soon.

>>10079230
>bitcoin wastes a lot of energy
>therefore, you are only blaming bitcoin for a much bigger problem
I don't think one thing follows the other
protip: no one ITT said bitcoin is the only way to waste energy